Hmm, that would mean a total of ~300kcd? Seems pretty low for such a large reflector? The TN42 gets 2x that much with a much smaller reflector?
This is a domed LED correct? First off where are you finding these? I have not been able to find any W2 in neutral tints (although even 2B is not neutral).
In a pre-made light the LED needs to be a HI LED from the factory. Dedomed versions will be for modders to do later. It is simply not practical to sell a de-domed light from the factory. Too many possible issues plus the tint shift would not mesh with most people, including me.
So that leaves a V3 HI or an XHP35 far as I know. (assuming we could even get a V3 XP-L HI).
Haven’t seen this level of power in a binned domeless emitter from Cree. It could be in the works, but I haven’t heard anything about it.
Cutter in Australia is selling a W2 2B, it’s warmer than one might think, not sure if that means the tint bin is incorrect or just what is going on there, but it definitely shows up as a warm tint when viewed under a UV source.
Absolute long range output will almost certainly have to rely on the XHP-35. High output HI variants are not readily available and even if they were, the domeless emitter doesn’t produce throw like a de-domed high bin XP-L, proven fact. I’ve gotten 2 dozen of the new XP-L and they came on 10mm aluminum mcpcbs, attached in a sheet. It’d be comparatively easy to de-dome an entire panel at a time in a solvent, so it shouldn’t be completely out of line for consideration here.
Jerommel, if indeed all the light is produced in parallel rays from that recoil type of lens/emitter arrangement, wouldn’t we have a relatively large diameter beam profile? Wouldn’t this be non-conducive to extreme throw range? And wouldn’t the arm be subject to damage if dropped? A small amount of mis-alignment and the beam would suffer horrendously. Even if there were 4 arms for strength, could we rely on a manufacturer to nail perfect placement of the emitter? Tricky stuff there, interesting yes, but we can barely get some of these folks to get focus and centering right with centering rings.
Are there working examples of this recoil type of light out there that might give an indication of performance? All I have seen have not fared so well.
The issue is getting the factory to do reliable de-doming and then you have the un-escapable fact that they will tint shift.
While acceptable as a mod for sure, the average joe would see that and go yuck. The De-domed lights I have I don’t even show off anymore, people always mention the color after being amazed at the intensity.
Plus I figure that anyone that is interested enough in max throw also has the ability to install a de-domed LED. Particularly since this light will be designed for easy modding.
The only way I can see that a factory emitter is going to make long distance throw is if it’s the XHP-35 HI. No other factory variant I know of will do it.
MaxToch built many many MANY lights, factory de-domed.
The real issue there is availability of a proper tint binned emitter for the start point. An 0D tint bin works out pretty well, but is it being made in the W2 format? I’ve only seen 1D and 2B offered, and the 2B is not what I would have expected, showing out more like a 2D or 3A, definitely warm white and not Neutral. I used to always use 2B’s for triples, in XP-G2, and they tend to show a bit on the blue-white side. These W2 “2B” are a bit on the orange side of white. Very powerful, yes, but I’m fairly positive the 2B is not correct.
Look at these 2 panels of W2 under a UV source. The top panel is from about a month ago, the bottom panel was shipped last week, arrived Monday, as W2 2B, although they are obviously not.
So, my primary point is that while there may be a new emitter with outstanding power level characteristics, it may also be difficult to obtain. Modders may have fun with it, and who knows, by the time this light is actually going into production maybe things will be different. Certainly easy to see that a ~2000 lumen de-domed XP-L W2 would have a more concentrated light output for epic throw…
True but they also had complete control over the process and WANTED to get it right. It seems that our group buys are generally an after thought to the manufactures and they do it the right way only if they feel like it as they don’t know why we want half the stuff we want.
It is a matter of priority, we simply do not appear to be very high on anyone’s priority list sadly, not high enough for me to trust them with this.
IF we found a manufacture that was not only open to, but enthusiastic about offering factory de-deomed emitters then it would be a consideration. Sadly I doubt that will happen.
I’m thinking, since MaxToch has already worked with us extensively on the M2X-2S and Sniper and Shooter 2X, since they already have one of the best throwers on the market in a 2 series 18650 rifle mount light, they might embrace the title of worlds longest throw searchlight. They are a manufacturer, they could run with this from scratch and produce what we are looking for. The Classic is a pattern that follows some of their previous design, pretty sure they could get this done right, with a high quality light that would devastate the current Top Name brands throwers.
And for the record, they are currently working with us now on a small light that was essentially built from the ground up. If anybody would do it, could do it, MaxToch is the go-to source.
You have two leds that can be had dedomed from factory, and are great at throw. The XPL HI and the XHP35HI. If the light comes with any of these it should be really cheap and really reliable. Also it will be really easy for the modders to do their own stuff. Who likes to swap will swap XPG2, and similar. But since those 2 leds are available, and are throwy in their nature I really do not get the point of getting into such detailed dedoming factory procedures. They are simply not needed. Perhaps in the times before the HI versions, but now there is no point. And the mods are relatively easy if all else is good.
Bogging down on specific stuff is bad for business.
Those 2 are domeless, not de-domed. There is a pretty significant difference.
Getting the specifics correct before starting is the path to a successful launch of a superior product. Being as how this thread is all about a theoretical, and seeing as how we will need to source a manufacturer, why not nail down specifics with a proven manufacturer that excels in the throw business?
Two sides to every coin. We’re looking at building the ultimate throw monster, not necessarily a cheap budget light with commonly found parts and host components. Certain things have already been done. Certain people here wanted more. The namesake behind all this gave certain specifics, so that is what is trying to be met. There are only a few ways to go about this. Commonly available and cheap don’t really come into play given the dynamics.
