Generic AAA flashlight variants?

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DoubleA
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Generic AAA flashlight variants?

I recently bought a Geonaute OnBright 200 keychain flashlight from Decathlon. It’s a nice and handy flashlight and I like it very much.

It throws a small decent spot with rings and spill and the light is a clean white with no blue tint but not neutral white (5500K maybe). Beam never reaches max 10 meters, anything beyond that is not really visible. The light ain’t very bright but I don’t need a bright light, so the 8 lumens it throws is more than enough for me.
All metal body with a rubber grip in the middle. Both head and tail unscrews and AAA battery can be inserted from either direction. Came with an energizer cell but I use a Panasonic 750mAh eneloop and it works just fine.

Now here is the funny part. I have seen other manufacturers selling the same flashlight with different specs and colors. One of them was Rayovac(Value bright AAA, 5 lumens, 6 hour runtime) and the other was GP (Discovery, CREE led?? 8 lumens, 40 hour runtime on pack, 15 hour on website??? really). I’m pretty sure there are other manufacturers with the same product because this seems to be a generic AAA flashlight which some companies like these buys and rebrands them.

Here are some pics for easy comparison

If anybody has seen similar flashlights then please post it here. Smile

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

Edited by: DoubleA on 07/10/2017 - 11:12
Silent_Star
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 Genesis 1:3 "And God said, "Let there be light,"  and there was light."

DoubleA
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Yupp… that’s the same thing. I wonder who is the actual manufacturer.

It says 40 hour runtime on the pack but only 15 hours on the website. Big Smile
I believe Rayovac’s claim (5 lumen 6 hour) to be more realistic.

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

sbslider
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DoubleA wrote:
Yupp… that’s the same thing. I wonder who is the actual manufacturer.

It says 40 hour runtime on the pack but only 15 hours on the website. Big Smile
I believe Rayovac’s claim (5 lumen 6 hour) to be more realistic.


I would be surprised if the 5 lumens did not last 15 hours with a new alkaline battery. I ran my lumentop worm at 3 lumens out for 31 hours on a 750mAhr eneloop. At the current required for 5 lumens (likely around 50mA, maybe less) the alkaline is good for 1000mAhr or so.
DoubleA
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I would be surprised if the 5 lumens did not last 15 hours with a new alkaline battery. I ran my lumentop worm at 3 lumens out for 31 hours on a 750mAhr eneloop. At the current required for 5 lumens (likely around 50mA, maybe less) the alkaline is good for 1000mAhr or so.

15 hours with an alkaline? I don’t think so. Even theoretically 1000mAh from an alkaline could run a 50mA (0.16W) LED for only 9 hours and that too only if the boost converter(or Joule thief) inside the flashlight is super efficient. I don’t think the circuitry in cheap flashlights could achieve such results.

As a matter of fact the converter draws a lot of current to maintain stable output voltage and this current draw will substantially reduce the alkaline’s capacity (alkalines can’t handle high current draw) which will in turn cause the alkaline’s voltage to drop rapidly because of it’s chemistry. With an eneloop you could basically get better result because the capacity of LSD NiMH cells are not seriously reduced with higher current draw unlike alkalines and also eneloops maintain a stable voltage output unlike alkalines.

What’s actually happening is the cheap converter is giving less current and the LED will run longer although with a reduced light output. Smile

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

sbslider
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Maybe you are correct. I made my assessment based on data I have taken with flashlights I own. My Manker E01 ( a sort of cheap flashlight, but not as cheap as those above) draws 73 mA at 1.3V input to deliver 7 lumens with a Nichia 291B emitter. My Lumintop worm (even less cheap) draws 26mA at 1.3V to deliver 3 lumens with a Nichia 291B emitter. I use 1.3V as the alkaline starts at 1.5V or better, and decays during the discharge to 1V or less. I have tracked the discharge of an alkaline at rather low currents (5-10mA) over a 17 day period so I have some idea of how they perform. I don’t think the performance is significantly different in terms of the discharge curve at the currents I am talking about.

I rationalized that a 5 lumen device could consume 50mA, and with a 1000mA battery 20 hours is possible. 15 seemed easy. But I have not tested any current draws on the cheap lights mentioned above, so my numbers could be all wrong for that case. Not sure of the math you used to determine a 1000mAh battery can provide 50mA for only 9 hours though. Take a look at this: http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Duracell%20Plus%20Power%20AAA%...
For 0.1A discharge, the battery lasts 9.5 hours to 1.0V. I think you would agree for a 50mA discharge, the duration would be at least 2x if not more, as alkalines do better at lower currents.

DoubleA
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You own decent branded flashlights which probably has really good and efficient circuitry and can provide good runtimes with consistent output. Mine is a cheap generic rebranded one.

Quote:
I rationalized that a 5 lumen device could consume 50mA, and with a 1000mA battery 20 hours is possible. 15 seemed easy. But I have not tested any current draws on the cheap lights mentioned above, so my numbers could be all wrong for that case. Not sure of the math you used to determine a 1000mAh battery can provide 50mA for only 9 hours though.
Big Smile My bad here. I mistakenly calculated for a 50mA LED current draw instead of using device current draw. You are absolutely correct here.

Thanks for AAA discharge tests link. You can clearly see that the capacity of an alakaline (duracell) is 1000mAh at 100mA draw whereas it’s 500mAh at 1000mA draw. The capacity of Alakaline is heavily depending on it’s current draw. Eneloops fares better at higher current draws.

However the capacity in our flashlights won’t be affected due to low current draws, so yes you are correct once again that alkalines will perform better in these low power flashlights. Only on current draws above 300-500mA will eneloops be a better choice than alkalines.

So it is indeed possible for these flashlights to give 15-20 hour runtimes, that is if the circuitry is efficient. Have a look at this video and you can see that a poorly designed one can be very very inefficient as well.

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

sbslider
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DoubleA wrote:
Have a look at this video and you can see that a poorly designed one can be very very inefficient as well.

I enjoyed the video, thanks for sharing!
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Quote:
I recently bought a Geonaute OnBright 200 keychain flashlight from Decathlon. It’s a nice and handy flashlight and I like it very much.

You’re right!
It’s a nice looking little flashlight, and I would buy it too (@Decathlon) but I don’t want to pay it 8/9 euro… Sad

www.youtube.com/channel/UCeDhMPm0L1yvr3LpygDPgMw my flashlights/knives/gear video reviews
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DoubleA
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I bought it because in my country I don’t get any major branded ones. Fenix, Nitecore, Thorfire etc all are sold at double or sometimes triple their actual price because of import duty and other tariffs.

However if you really like it you can buy the same from other sources like I mentioned because this is just a rebranded flashlight. The original one may only cost half of what it the Geonaute one costs.

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

Cythras
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Interestingly, I have owned the Rayovac pictured above, grabbed it from Walmart many years ago. Used a standard 5mm LED with a collaminating lens, and was dimmer than the similar penlight model they sold at that time. Fairly blue tint as well, though maybe they have changed in the last 5 years or so.

DoubleA
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Used a standard 5mm LED with a collaminating lens, and was dimmer than the similar penlight model they sold at that time. Fairly blue tint as well, though maybe they have changed in the last 5 years or so

Maybe so, the head and tail of rayovac looks quite different. I have an old generic 3xAAA flashlight that has 9× 5mm standard LEDs with a blue tinted beam and this Geonaute throws more than half the brightness that old one gives sans the blue tint. So I guess this single 5mm strawhat LED used is an improved version.

Here’s the pics of the LED and the beam shot at 1 feet from wall (took using a crappy cellphone camera)

I also thought of mentioning the tiny knurlings/grip all around it’s body. Dunno if Rayovac or GP has them, couldn’t make out from the web images so please confirm. Feels damn so good in hands. Big Smile

Edit: just noticed it now, The head and tail section looks slightly different from advertised picture. Also logo is different.

managed to find a beamshot of the rayovac from an amazon review. Courtesy of “NLee the Engineer “

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

Cythras
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Wow, that Amazon picture is quite the find. The penlight on the right is the one I was referring to, was tinted bluer than the other but had a clicky switch as opposed to the twisty of the other Rayovac. Obviously, the one you own does not have a Cree LED, just a generic 5mm. A similar type was in the Rayovacs. That “Knurling” you speak of is from the milling process, and is actually quite common on the cheapo penlights you can buy on ebay, commonly sold under the “Skywolfeye” name.

Are you looking for a good small AAA torch?

DoubleA
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You mean this one ?

Yepp, I do know that it’s no Cree. Actually it’s GP that advertises Cree LED, although Cree does make em 5mm LEDs I don’t think GP ever uses Cree LEDs.

I am looking for a small AAA light/lantern/beacon with color LEDs. If you do know anything good please tell me. So far I looked at Fenix CL05 but I don’t like it’s design, Glotoob seems fine but I guess I need lights to shine upwards, Thorfire KL02 I like the design but don’t want CR123 same with Fenix CL09. Nitecore LA10 looks good but I want a AAA version. I don’t want to fit a diffuser onto a torch.

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...