LED drivers and Accessories you want, but don’t exist

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Enderman
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Texas_Ace wrote:
Agreed, it would be foolish to input 4S and output 1S at 50A. There is no single LED that can handle that so you are better off running multiple LED’s in series. It makes things much simpler and more efficient.

Luminus LED are 3-4v and use 30A+ current.
Take a look at some of the datasheets, it’s insane.
As with most LEDs you can drive them at even higher currents for more output as long as you give them enough cooling.
Agro
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Texas_Ace wrote:
The_Driver wrote:
The Luminus LEDs which I meantioned are rated for a max of 28A. They will probably be able to take a bit more. So 30A is the absolute minimum here to make a driver interesting in this case!
The new Luminus CFT-90 is the one that is really interesting. It is much more efficient compared to older models. It is as bright as an XHP-70, but it’s factory de-domed and the DIE is only 9mm^2, the XHP-70(.2) should be around 14mm^2 when de-domed and 28mm with dome). It also probably doesn’t have the 3D-Die of the Cree LEDs and will probably have a very high luminance (so very high throw with very high luminance). There is nothing on the market that matches it.

Please tell me more about your 30A project. You can PM me if you like.

Interesting, never heard of the Luminus CFT-90. The last gen models were so inefficient I wrote them off. This latest version is still inefficient but it is not that far off of what we drive other LED’s to here.

Still going to be a tough job to make a buck driver for that, it will need to be quite large to fit the components needed, even a 46mm driver could not be big enough for everything depending on what components are used.

The project is kinda floating right now, not gonna say too much till I know if it is going forward or being dropped.

Basically it is a 6s6p input that needs to provide 18V at ~30A output to some LED’s.

Some math can give you an idea of what the results might be.


Let’s assume one wants to drive it at max allowed Tj (150C)
They rate Vf vs temp up to 120 degrees, let’s use that.
27A (this is the max, not 28) * 3.52 V = 95W.
Thermal resistance between PCB and junction is 0.45 C/W.
Let’s assume 30 degrees max ambient temperature. You need your host to have under 0.8 C/W. So even stock output will not be thermally sustainable in a passively cooled flashlight. Which is not always a problem. Wink
Lexel
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Agro wrote:
Texas_Ace wrote:
The_Driver wrote:
The Luminus LEDs which I meantioned are rated for a max of 28A. They will probably be able to take a bit more. So 30A is the absolute minimum here to make a driver interesting in this case!
The new Luminus CFT-90 is the one that is really interesting. It is much more efficient compared to older models. It is as bright as an XHP-70, but it’s factory de-domed and the DIE is only 9mm^2, the XHP-70(.2) should be around 14mm^2 when de-domed and 28mm with dome). It also probably doesn’t have the 3D-Die of the Cree LEDs and will probably have a very high luminance (so very high throw with very high luminance). There is nothing on the market that matches it.

Please tell me more about your 30A project. You can PM me if you like.

Interesting, never heard of the Luminus CFT-90. The last gen models were so inefficient I wrote them off. This latest version is still inefficient but it is not that far off of what we drive other LED’s to here.

Still going to be a tough job to make a buck driver for that, it will need to be quite large to fit the components needed, even a 46mm driver could not be big enough for everything depending on what components are used.

The project is kinda floating right now, not gonna say too much till I know if it is going forward or being dropped.

Basically it is a 6s6p input that needs to provide 18V at ~30A output to some LED’s.

Some math can give you an idea of what the results might be.


Let’s assume one wants to drive it at max allowed Tj (150C)
They rate Vf vs temp up to 120 degrees, let’s use that.
27A (this is the max, not 28) * 3.52 V = 95W.
Thermal resistance between PCB and junction is 0.45 C/W.
Let’s assume 30 degrees max ambient temperature. You need your host to have under 0.8 C/W. So even stock output will not be thermally sustainable in a passively cooled flashlight. Which is not always a problem. Wink

The LED has a build in thermal resistor, so you can ramp down when it gets too hot
you can do it smart so that the ramp down also calculates the thermal difference to Tj which gets lower with less current

there are no thermally sustainable flashlights in that power range so far, the X9 might get 100W thermally stable

The_Driver
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Enderman wrote:
The_Driver wrote:
2. Buck driver with 7-8A for 3-4V LEDs and 2S-3s input. Should have all the usual features.
This maybe? http://www.international.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/prod... 2-4S input.

Not with that U.I.
I want all the nice features some of the BLF drivers have ;).

Regarding CFT-90:
When you a driving an LED with 95W you can add a fan. It makes no difference in the runtime in practical terms. The light needs to be big anyhow. You need lots of batteries, a big heatsink, large driver, large reflector or optic (only a thrower makes sense).

tekwyzrd
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Boost driver for xhp and mt-g emitters with firmware adjustment of current limit and pwm for fan speed control so the higher the output the faster the fan spins. Sized for 3p or 4p 18650 or 26650.

Banggood – recommended for buyers who don’t mind an endless wait and continuous excuses for not dealing with defective items.
Fasttech – recommended for buyers who like to wait long periods with ever changing arrival dates for items that were ‘in stock’ when ordered.

Enderman
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The_Driver wrote:

Not with that U.I.
I want all the nice features some of the BLF drivers have ;).

I would be fine with a single mode UI for my flashlights tbh… Silly

Jerommel
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To me 3 modes 10% – 30% – 100% is enough for lights up to 10 Watts.
for more powerful lights an extra ‘lower low’ is a must too.

2Q19

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I maybe look into building a buck-boost driver with the TPS63027, so 2A max output.
Another topic: looking at multiple posts about fans for cooling, I can’t quite get it. Where should the fan get air from to cool the components?

tekwyzrd
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Schoki wrote:
I maybe look into building a buck-boost driver with the TPS63027, so 2A max output. Another topic: looking at multiple posts about fans for cooling, I can’t quite get it. Where should the fan get air from to cool the components?

Air could be ducted from outside the light and blown across the fins of a heatsink allowing the emitter to be cooled in a manner similar to a computer cpu or gpu.

Banggood – recommended for buyers who don’t mind an endless wait and continuous excuses for not dealing with defective items.
Fasttech – recommended for buyers who like to wait long periods with ever changing arrival dates for items that were ‘in stock’ when ordered.

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The_Driver][quote=John-Galt wrote:
5s buck driver. I have some black+decker 5s2p 4ah packs I would like to use to drive 12v leds, but can’t find a suitable driver that will accept 20+ volt input.

Easy! The German company pcb components offers this. There are different variants. Two for up to 3A LED current:

Thanks for the info & links. I was hoping for something a little less expensive than $30 each, though.

Enderman
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Schoki wrote:
I maybe look into building a buck-boost driver with the TPS63027, so 2A max output.
Another topic: looking at multiple posts about fans for cooling, I can’t quite get it. Where should the fan get air from to cool the components?

Mine gets it from the back and exhausts heat near the head of the flashlight:
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scully012 wrote:
A 17mm 3.7v input 6-12v output boost driver to put xhp series leds in a S2+ or C8.

Edit: or mtg2 leds

+1

I probably don’t know what I’m talking about but here goes

9v MT-G2 to 3S

we all hate pwm and we all want the efficiency I love ramping but it seem like the D4 is (dear I say it) too much of a hot rod for getting more lumens for longer time. (yup most lumens its great) but I keep waiting (and I think some lights can do it now) but 3k-4k continuous in a nice tint. Yes I know that the heat dissipation of the material is/can be a bottleneck even in lights larger then the D4.

Love the BIG floody MT-G2 when can we make them in triples?

XHP to me has too many artifact issues and unpleasant tint (never heard of a 4C tint in an XHP 35, 50, 70)

Again not up on the latest but what about progress for us guys who want say the smallest light possible that will run three MT-G2 at 3000 lumens continuously with out getting too warm. don’t care if turbo is 5k or 6k or ?k the peak numbers are almost a game because they don’t address what it take to keep belting out big lumens.

Love the D4, but its a case in point, it can run over 4k lumens but struggles to constantly run over 400-600 depending on emitter. again not an expert and not up on the “latest” but it seems like something is missing in the “improvement” trend over time of technology.

And yes I am thinking every day use (not necessarily carry but at least use) the BIG MONSTERS just don’t seem to get actually used.

I know its a jumble and thanks for listening

P.S.

There also a 36v MT-G2 that we never get to use.

6v
9v
36v

If we were starting from scratch with would be the smartest voltage to run?

Should we be specifying drivers in watts?

(“It’s good that most people can’t remember their previous lives. Otherwise
things would be a lot more complicated than they already are.”
Ajaan Lee Dhammadharo)

mattlward
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I so badly want a 2S current controlled buck driver that will output 5 to 6 amps at 6 volts! And then, a single cell boost driver for use with good 18650’s or 26650’s that will run the XHP50.2 as it should be.

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

Enderman
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mattlward wrote:
I so badly want a 2S current controlled buck driver that will output 5 to 6 amps at 6 volts!

2S to 6V would not be a buck driver… that would just be simply a 7135/linear driver.

http://www.international.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/cate...

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right now, a driver that can drive the 6 and 12v xhp70s to 6000 lumens so i can put 3 of them into my chunky monkey. that should be about 8-10A an LED

mcorp
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Noticed most of the wishlist are for the XHP variants.

The dream driver is for the battery omnivore for say the XM, XP leds as below..

  • Constant Current (or extremely high PWM if not possible)
  • Voltage input: 0.8V ~ 6.0V (AA/18650/2xCR123a)
  • Max Amp: 3A at least (with DD option would be nice)
  • Modes: Programmable with selections as currently available (from Moonlight to Max)
  • Diameter: Small enough to fit an E-series LE

But if the above can cater for the 6V LEDs as well (highly unlikely) then all the more the better!

The Lite Review (click for my Review website!)

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Texas_Ace wrote:
This is a good idea. If we can get next gen firmware running on the latest MCU’s (the 1617 looks the most promising but not sure if they are able to be programmed yet) then we can have a few universal hardware and firmware options that should be able to cover almost everything.

Why the 1617? I don’t get it. The 1616 is much more attractive with it’s smaller size. How many pins do you need?

And why sit around and wait? Start with the 1634, and when the 1616 is widely available, port the firmware and make a new driver version.

Texas_Ace
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I had not heard of the 1616. The 1617 offered several features that were important for next gen drivers such as 3 voltage references, 16kb rom ect.

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Personally I don’t see much use for the voltage references that the 1616 and 1617 offer. You still need voltage dividers to utilize them to measure the full range of voltage levels a cell can have. To use the 4.3V internal reference, VCC has to be at least 4.3V anyway.

The size of the 1616 interests me though, but other than that it won’t do much more for me than the easily available and widely supported 1634.

mattlward
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Enderman wrote:
mattlward wrote:
I so badly want a 2S current controlled buck driver that will output 5 to 6 amps at 6 volts!

2S to 6V would not be a buck driver… that would just be simply a 7135/linear driver.

http://www.international.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/cate...

Maybe, I did not say that correctly. I would like to deliver 6 volts to the led, not something around 8 volts falling off to 6.something volts. And I would like to do it at a constant current as long as possible. The big thing for me would be regulation and not direct drive. Gives battery life stability if all of the modes are regulated. Currently I am using 2S FETs and a very old constant current from the BTU Super Shocker (I think) but it only delivers around 3 amps to an XHP50.2.

My understanding is that if it regulates current and voltage, from a voltage source above the rated LED voltage that it would be a buck driver? Correct me if that is wrong, have been building 1S lights for a good while, but 2S+ are more recent builds for me.

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

Texas_Ace
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mattlward wrote:
Enderman wrote:
mattlward wrote:
I so badly want a 2S current controlled buck driver that will output 5 to 6 amps at 6 volts!

2S to 6V would not be a buck driver… that would just be simply a 7135/linear driver.

http://www.international.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/cate...

Maybe, I did not say that correctly. I would like to deliver 6 volts to the led, not something around 8 volts falling off to 6.something volts. And I would like to do it at a constant current as long as possible. The big thing for me would be regulation and not direct drive. Gives battery life stability if all of the modes are regulated. Currently I am using 2S FETs and a very old constant current from the BTU Super Shocker (I think) but it only delivers around 3 amps to an XHP50.2.

My understanding is that if it regulates current and voltage, from a voltage source above the rated LED voltage that it would be a buck driver? Correct me if that is wrong, have been building 1S lights for a good while, but 2S+ are more recent builds for me.

Both of you are right, although a linear driver for 2S voltages would be very inefficient and would be at risk of overheating.

Depending on the size of the driver there are already buck drivers for the xhp70 that do what you want. The FX30 in the convoy L6 does 5A from the factory, same for the driver in the S70 but those are both 30mm drivers.

mattlward
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Texas_Ace wrote:

Both of you are right, although a linear driver for 2S voltages would be very inefficient and would be at risk of overheating.

Depending on the size of the driver there are already buck drivers for the xhp70 that do what you want. The FX30 in the convoy L6 does 5A from the factory, same for the driver in the S70 but those are both 30mm drivers.

I am looking for something in the 17 to 19mm range for my convoy M1 (MT-G2) and Nightfighter (XHP50.2) that will deliver more with out getting stupid with a full on FET.

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

Texas_Ace
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The mtnbuck is about the closest thing I know of, not sure what it was capable of with 2S voltage but it was round 5A IIRC.

Enderman
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mattlward wrote:

Maybe, I did not say that correctly. I would like to deliver 6 volts to the led, not something around 8 volts falling off to 6.something volts. And I would like to do it at a constant current as long as possible. The big thing for me would be regulation and not direct drive. Gives battery life stability if all of the modes are regulated. Currently I am using 2S FETs and a very old constant current from the BTU Super Shocker (I think) but it only delivers around 3 amps to an XHP50.2.

My understanding is that if it regulates current and voltage, from a voltage source above the rated LED voltage that it would be a buck driver? Correct me if that is wrong, have been building 1S lights for a good while, but 2S+ are more recent builds for me.


6V LEDs use closer to 7 or 8v especially when driven at higher currents, so you won’t get stable output for very long using a 2S battery unless you had a special buck+boost driver that will keep a constant current even when the battery voltage drops below the LED voltage.

A buck driver would be something like 3S or 4S to 6v LED, 2S+ to 3v LED, or 4S+ to 12v LED.

mattlward
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Thanks for the info, makes sense. So, I am really wanting a good low loss buck/boost. Makes sense.

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

SJT
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Right now i would like to have boost driver with 2S input and output of about 100-150W and output voltage for 6 x XM-L2 in series, or maybe 12 in series. I have that 12xXM-L monster but can’t find good driver for that. Leds are now 3S2P x 2 and 2S input with FET just won’t work. Sad

Any ideas? Smile

The_Driver
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SJT wrote:
Right now i would like to have boost driver with 2S input and output of about 100-150W and output voltage for 6 x XM-L2 in series, or maybe 12 in series. I have that 12xXM-L monster but can’t find good driver for that. Leds are now 3S2P x 2 and 2S input with FET just won’t work. Sad

Any ideas? Smile

Well, it certainly needs to be rather large for this much current.
This one is already very powerful, but only does 48W input at 6V input voltage:
https://pcb-components.de/led-aufwaertswandler-boost-step-up/led-senser-...

Do you need a real flashlight driver or any driver? Maybe there is one on Ebay.

Jerommel
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A good 1S driver to drive a 6 Volts LED would certainly sell.
Nearly ordered a H1-A from Kaidomain, but it has PWM at a clearly audible 3.6 kHz.
I don’t want PWM at all actually…

2Q19

SJT
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The_Driver wrote:
SJT wrote:
Right now i would like to have boost driver with 2S input and output of about 100-150W and output voltage for 6 x XM-L2 in series, or maybe 12 in series. I have that 12xXM-L monster but can’t find good driver for that. Leds are now 3S2P x 2 and 2S input with FET just won’t work. Sad

Any ideas? Smile

Well, it certainly needs to be rather large for this much current.
This one is already very powerful, but only does 48W input at 6V input voltage:
https://pcb-components.de/led-aufwaertswandler-boost-step-up/led-senser-...

Do you need a real flashlight driver or any driver? Maybe there is one on Ebay.


Flashlight driver yes, it is same than here:
http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/469156#comment-469156

Driver diameter is 26mm but i can use original as contact plate for smaller driver if needed.

And that over 100W would be only “turbo mode”, this really won’t last long for such high power. Smile

JIGHEADWORM
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one cell boost driver for xhp35 that gets at least 2.5 amps.

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