+1 with TK. The idea was make the default simple basic usage:
click to turn ON to last level
when on, click to turn OFF
or click&hold to ramp up, let go where you want to stop and leave it at
once the light is ON, click&hold to adjust it up and down
double click from OFF or ON to go to turbo/max without effecting the saved last level
I'm not sure if everyone agrees to this, but this basic operation described above came about directly from BLF user input, not from me or the Q8 team, least as best as I recall from early on in this thread.
the criteria here that the UI meets is:
quick, no frustrating delays to turn the light ON or OFF, always one click
quick access to the lowest setting, quick access to the max setting, quick access to last level used
ramping - seemed to be desired by all, and make it smooth and quick
get rid of poorly chosen output level sets of modes (Low/Med/Hi, etc.) - ramping has effectively an infinite # of brightness levels (~150)
The problem is of course do it all with one switch, but i think we worked that out. Now most of the talk about click timings was related to the switch LEDs, unrelated to basic operation of the light. But for those reports of the switch not working, there's two type:
intermittent click not working
any click not working til the power is reset (tube loosened)
For the intermittent issue, I think most of the the time the switch is held too long, so ramping starts. I designed ramping to be quick, so one click has to be pretty quick to differentiate from ramping. If I slow down the one click, then I'm adding delays to when ramping starts - it's a tradeoff. I thought it was a nice compromise, but others may disagree.
For the "any click not working", not sure of the detailed circumstances, how often/repeatable, etc., and certainly I've never seen it,and I believe no one on the team has seen it, prototype or production Q8's. I believe/think the reports were just a one time thing, not repeatable.
If an even simpler UI is desired, that can be arranged. I could take some things out of my FSM ramping example and make a Q8 firmware which only has on, off, a reversing ramp, and maybe a 4-bar battcheck. Call it “dead simple” or something like that.
With a bit of extra plumbing, maybe it could even forget the memorized level after an hour so it’ll be more predictable after sitting idle.
Plus safety stuff like LVP and thermal regulation, but those aren’t really things the user should have to care about.
For simpler UI's I also intend to get bistro-HD working on it (might already, but ..) and probably even add a lockout command . I've seen that Narsil has fixed modes which is very neat, heck a of a firmware with tons of features packed. However, the click commands for ramp I guess limit the remaining commands for modes if I'm reading it right (I'll definitely give a whirl before I decide), and the one that overcomplicates it for me in modes is the lock in. I suspect this is because long click has other uses, so you need lock in to then have an off command available?
So in bistro-HD e-switch, it will be short click forward, medium click back. Long click off, almost as it's always been for bistro. No lock-in, any click back on (with memory or not, no fancy double click commands to select on-the-fly like narsil). I don't know, Tom, maybe this is something that can be worked into Narsil still? The lock-in is something I'm sure I'd rather avoid. The thing that changes slightly for e-switch bistro is you'll need a long click-off followed by a quick tap on to get what used to be a long click in bistro, ie, with no memory, a reset to first mode. But I think that's fairly intuitive.
I'd never care for a UI that has a long click for off, sorry. I've seen lot of posted complaints on long click ON/OFF UI's, and there's quite a few lights out there with it. Some could argue for symmetry - long ON/long OFF, and I think I've seen long ON, short OFF. Suppose all possible combos have been done.
I'm very interested in the direction TK is goin with her latest e-switch driver, but don't know all the details yet. I believe though it has, and will have many possible options for UI preferences though. That's part of the goal - give the user what they want, whether it's 60% of users, or 2% - it's all a matter of personal preference.
2 switch lights of course would give us more options, but we would probably need to jump to the next level ATMEL MCU's that have more I/O pins.
I can certainly see why short off would appeal to some. For me, quick access to mode change is more important. If I need more light NOW I need more light now. I can always worry about turning it off later. But I could imagine there could use cases where the opposite is true.
I have to report that both my switch leds have randomly decreased in intensity to about half as bright as when I first received it, and sometimes they go back to the original full brightness for a few seconds then return to this lower level, I like the lower brightness level that it has now, looks more acceptable for a switch now, but I’m wondering if they will fail later on…
If they do, I will probably just solder some new resistors and leds to the board, for the people that have successfully modified the switch leds and/or resistors, where did you buy them? Interested in trying different color…
So what was the consensus as to what was causing the issue, was it the resistors or the leds?
Anyway, why symmetric? If the light is off, what could any click possibly mean other than that you would like it to come on? The only question being exactly how you'd like it to come on. My computer also uses short click on, and long click off, well ok, short click is also off, just not as brutal.
Does double click to turbo work from mode lock-in? If so, or if not, that would be a nice compromise that helps.
edit: If it doesn't already, to the extent this would then be maybe a potential feature, I'd probably make it double click to advance, but either is good.
Thank you for taking the time to check it on your 3 protos.
I checked mine in room light.
The timing is perfect for me. Out of the box, no problem to turn it ON or OFF like expected. The only timing that was a bit picky at first was to turn OFF the light switch = too short between the two clicks (first to turn ON, 2nd to turn OFF the Q8 and the light switch) turns the Q8 into turbo.
But once you get it right by trials and errors, it’s not hard to remember the right timing.
Your Narsil UI is really growing on me and I’m starting to really appreciate it, but as I’m really got used to flashlights with fixed modes that are more predictable concerning runtime, I would appreciate a Narsil modification in ramping mode to always turn it ON at 100% 7135 and 0% FET, without memory.
An option to reverse the ramping in the configuration UI settings would be awesome. With 100% 7135, to preserve your vision adapted to this brightness, I would prefer to go a bit lower first with a click & hold, and have the option to go higher with a short click & hold followed by another click & hold.
:: Setting # : 1 :: Function : ramping mode :: Clicks : 1=disable, 2=enable, 3=reverse ::
Going via Turkey post.
