Ultrafire DV-S9 diving light?

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Lightbringer
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Pete7874 wrote:
From Ultrafire’s website for this DV-S9 light:
Quote:
Power Supply: 1*18650

Current: 3800mA

Runtime: 4 Hours


Hmm…. something does not add up here. Smile

Anyway, do you have any beam shots?

Naw. One of the websites had nonsense descriptions, like “switch: clicky”, “modes: h/m/l/SOS”, etc.

Ah, here ya go! Right from the horse’s ass, umm, mouth:

http://www.ultrafire.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=8428

 

Number of Modes: 3

Mode Arrangement: Hi,Low,Slow Strobe

 

Whaaaat??

Methinks lots of these “specs” are just c&p from other lights, and no one bothers to even look at them half the time.

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Jerommel
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texas shooter wrote:
I would stay away from diving with this light or any other that runs current though the body.

On ships they place aluminum or magnesium plates on the hull to corrode before the steel hull does. Run a current from tail to head and your light will dissolve away.

I doubt that’s because of electrical current.
The shell is (usually) negative and there’s no positive outside, so there’s no current through the water surrounding the body.

..waiting for parts..

Still looking for 5” parabolic reflector (for recoil light)

Jerommel
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Let me rephrase:
There is current through the battery tube from tail to head.
But since the battery tube has very very low electrical resistance, there’s hardly any voltage between tail and head, so i expect electrolyses is negligible or just not happening.

The picture shows problems on the edges.
Probably damaged anodization, and so the seawater just has a go with the aluminium.
The result is porous salts which absorb seawater so that the process continues on dry land.

..waiting for parts..

Still looking for 5” parabolic reflector (for recoil light)

kramer5150
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Jerommel wrote:
texas shooter wrote:
I would stay away from diving with this light or any other that runs current though the body.

On ships they place aluminum or magnesium plates on the hull to corrode before the steel hull does. Run a current from tail to head and your light will dissolve away.

I doubt that’s because of electrical current.
The shell is (usually) negative and there’s no positive outside, so there’s no current through the water surrounding the body.

Those pics are from a 2012 thread. The damage you see is from galvanic corrosion and electrolysis when this light is submerged in salt water. Basically it forms a cathode / anode and the salt water is the electrolytic solution. It only happens when this light is turned OFF (IIRC) though because the electrical circuit when turned on becomes the current path of least resistance. The condition is worsened for spots where the anodize is scratched off or etched off. Thread here… skip ahead to page 5-7. IIRC a couple different members were complaining about the same thing.

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11143

See post 178 and 191….

Lightbringer
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kramer5150 wrote:
Those pics are from a 2012 thread. The damage you see is from galvanic corrosion and electrolysis when this light is submerged in salt water. Basically it forms a cathode / anode and the salt water is the electrolytic solution. It only happens when this light is turned OFF (IIRC) though because the electrical circuit when turned on becomes the current path of least resistance. The condition is worsened for spots where the anodize is scratched off or etched off. Thread here… skip ahead to page 5-7. IIRC a couple different members were complaining about the same thing.

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11143

See post 178 and 191….

Good read, and answers some questions I had about all this.

Specifically, even with a decent tailcap switch, if it’s tightly connected to the body, the only breakpoint is between the internal switch and the (-) end of the cell. The whoooooole head+body+tailcap should be one long electrically-conductive piece, all at 0 potential. So like a shielded cable, the entire length would be one long 0.

And unless you turn your flashlight into an electron-gun, it’s only 1 electrode in a salt-bath, and no fizzing should occur.

That’s why, a design like this one, no switch in the tailcap, screwed on tightly, no reason to twist/untwist anything, and a magnetic slider, nothing should make a 2nd connection/electrode. (Think of way bigger version of an Astrolux A01 1-piece body, only no twist-head, but one solid piece, internals (incl. battery) accessible only through the front bezel and lens, and an internal magnetic switch.)

That’s why, in the shown pix, what’s fizzing off of what. If it’s a 2-electrode system bathed in saltwater, 1 set of bubbles should be H2 and the other set should be O2.

Lookit https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis_of_water . The (-) end should fizz H2, and the (+) end should fizz O2.

By figuring out which is which, you can narrow down where’s the break in continuity, and see what can be done to fix it.

Point being, in a good solid conductor, there should be no fizzing of any kind no matter how much current is going through it, not unless the voltage drop is more than 1.23V.

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EndlessWaves
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Lightbringer wrote:
mikeyx wrote:
Looks similar to the Starry Light DXM.

Ha… twins! Big Smile

I was wondering if there were any “relatives” of this light floating around out there. Now I know!

There’s also at least one more version that’s sold under various names that has the Starry Light DXM tailcap and simple spiral knurling. Here’s a (fake?) ultrafire-branded version:
https://www.fasttech.com/products/1601/10010861/4516600-ultrafire-cree-x...
It’s also around in black and green variants:
www.amazon.co.uk/d/s7v/Flashlight-Underwater-Waterproof-Torch-Submarine-...

There’s also the Ultrafire UF-S11 which looks like it might be a slightly more distant relative as it has similar proportions and a magnetic switch. Although it seems to consistently claim 3 modes instead of being infinitely variable:
http://www.gearbest.com/led-flashlights/pp_576215.html

Back to the DV-S9. Does it take protected batteries and what is the beam spread like? Similar to the Starry Light DXM? How hot does it get if left along on maximum brightness?

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EndlessWaves wrote:
Back to the DV-S9. Does it take protected batteries and what is the beam spread like? Similar to the Starry Light DXM? How hot does it get if left along on maximum brightness?

Interesting clones, cousins, whatever. Big Smile

Yeah, I got a protected 26650 that fits just fine. Big honkin’ springs on each end, so could probably take a ¼” spacer, too, and still fit.

Beam’s nice, pretty well-defined hotspot, decent spill, maybe the size of an XM-L in a C8. Wider than an XP-L HI C8, narrower than my (stock) VG10.

Bulb above my washing machine went out, had the DV-S9 tailstanding on full, using ceiling-bounce for light. Had it going about 10min straight, comfortably warm, nowhere near hot. It’s got a good amount of bulk to it.

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Van
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texas shooter wrote:
As long as current is past through the body it wouldn't help. Current has to be isolated from all external parts. At 8.4 volts 3 amps you could probable see gas bubbles forming if done in still water like a fish tank. Simply having both contacts at the head and none of this would happen.

Since the body of this DV-S9 is made to use both 18650/26650, when using 18650 there should be ample space left on the sides, right?

Maybe it is possible to disconnect the body contacts and make one's own wire connections going alongside the 18650 battery to the head?

Jerommel
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kramer5150 wrote:

Those pics are from a 2012 thread. The damage you see is from galvanic corrosion and electrolysis when this light is submerged in salt water. Basically it forms a cathode / anode and the salt water is the electrolytic solution. It only happens when this light is turned OFF (IIRC) though because the electrical circuit when turned on becomes the current path of least resistance. The condition is worsened for spots where the anodize is scratched off or etched off. Thread here… skip ahead to page 5-7. IIRC a couple different members were complaining about the same thing.

Aha, it has a tailcap that acts as a twisty switch. I didn’t know that.
So, when it’s turned ‘OFF’ there’s the battery voltage between tailcap and body, and then electrolyses will happen.

..waiting for parts..

Still looking for 5” parabolic reflector (for recoil light)

Jerommel
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I see i forgot to ask how the PWM is.
I assume they use PWM, and i know the big XHP70 diving lights with stepless slider is quite noisy (but not visible).
So how’s this one doing?
I like the concept.

..waiting for parts..

Still looking for 5” parabolic reflector (for recoil light)

Lightbringer
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Jerommel wrote:
I see i forgot to ask how the PWM is. I assume they use PWM, and i know the big XHP70 diving lights with stepless slider is quite noisy (but not visible). So how’s this one doing?

The DV-S9?

Think I mentioned it early on. My phone’s camera can see it, but honest to B’Harni (pbuh!), I can’t see it.

Didn’t take it into the shower or in the rain, but even flicking the light back’n‘forth across the room, I don’t notice anything.

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flydiver
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To revive an older thread….

Just received one of these. Looks decent to visual inspection and has survived a simple dunk+burn test. It has a low voltage cut-off and the light goes out suddenly and entirely with the battery showing ~3.2v after. It will not restart, even on low.
Light is a diffused focus similar in intensity and spread to my regular canister (4 LED, 2S2P 18650) dive light. Light intensity seems to stay decent down to cut-off.

I LIKE that the switch mechanism seems to be internal with just an external slider. First slider light I’ve had. I like it so far.
A bunch of the cheap dive lights with Hall sensors have external magnetic mechanisms with springs/magnets/occasionally ball bearings that are cheap steel and rust to garbage with saltwater use. They would be OK for shore use but are completely unsuitable for actual diving. Saltwater is death on them after awhile.
The 3xO-rings are good and seem to seal well. Hopefully the lens sealing mechanism is decent. It appears to be a single silicone O-ring which is typical of this price point.

I will be taking it for an empty test dive. If it survives I’ll put a battery in it and do a dive test. Then we’ll see if it can pass as a dive light. Big Smile

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That was my only question, as to whether/not the front glass is adequately sealed against water ingress with the single O-ring in front.

I don’t go diving (I’m allergic to drowning), so can’t really put it to the test. Big Smile

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flydiver
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Single O-ring is completely sufficient to seal…..IF the design and execution are good. I carry a $800 camera+lens on dives that has a dozen small single O-rings sealing controls, one large one for the lens port, and a huge one for the camera housing back. They all work just fine if clean and in good shape.

The problem with cheap lights is often poor design, shoddy assembly, and/or lousy parts. That’s what I’m checking out here.
Then there is the operator factor…… Facepalm

flydiver
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Took it for a single dive, saltwater, 56 feet max depth, about an hour exposure. No flooding, no sign of electrolysis. Day dive with decent ambient light so not optimal for evaluating the beam. It’s not as bright as my canister light, but it’s not bad. Would seem suitable for tropical use and as a backup light to a primary, even a primary for an occasional diver. Lasts over 3 hours with a 5000mA, 26650 in it (bench test). I got tired of watching it and it quit sometime after that, 3.24v remaining in the battery.

Lightbringer
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Yeah, I don’t recall what I measured way back when, but I don’t think it was more than 1.5A running wide-open.

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flydiver
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Just ordered up the U`King ZQ-X960 CREE XM-L2 1200LM Underwater 100m Diving Flashlight Torch – BLACK

Seems to be almost the same light, minus 1 sealing O-ring, + a better end cap for a lanyard, which means it won’t end stand but for a “real” dive light this is not important.
Starry light DXM seems to be no longer available on GB.

flydiver
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Received the U’King light. In black it’s a bit more traditional looking. I did a quick run test in a glass of water and it came out dry. Then did a long run test using a Lii 5000mA > 4+ hours before it shut down.
One less sealing O-ring but I thinks that’s because the assemblers of the DV-S9 (mine anyway) put an ‘extra one in the grooves behind the grooves machined for that. There is an adequate space and it doesn’t hurt anything. I may add one myself. Can’t get too much sealing for real diving. Silly
Slider is a bit stickier even after greasing. Did not realize the ring behind the slider unscrews and the slider can come out.
Light intensity and spot seem identical to DV-S9.
Dive test pending, probably after the holidays.

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I’m finding the green tint seriously ugly, otherwise it’s a great light. Mine doesn’t come on until I’ve screwed the tail cap on REALLY tight.

It seems that it would really benefit from an emitter swap, but from what has been posted it sounds as if it might be difficult to get at the interiors.

Not got the necessary skills to reflow an LED yet, but if there’s a way to get behind the lens without compromising the sealing, it would be something I’d be interested in at some point in the future.

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Flying Luminosity wrote:
I’m finding the green tint seriously ugly, otherwise it’s a great light. Mine doesn’t come on until I’ve screwed the tail cap on REALLY tight.

Green? You referring to the Ultrafire or UKing?

Mine’s definitely on the cooler side of CW, at least 6500K, but doesn’t have even a hint of green.

And I hate green-tinted beams…

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flydiver
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Chances are the front ring unscrews. No idea if it’s glued. That will press down on the glass lens and there will be an O-ring, probably silicone, under that. After that it should be fair normal but the pill will have a Hall sensor on it. Getting it back together dive level water tight is another issue. Splash tight should be a snap.

I don’t have any issue with the tint. No green to me on either light. Maybe you got a poor bin. But color goes away fast underwater anyway, with reds going within about 15-20 feet, and working it’s way through the rainbow spectrum with depth. In the NW we have so much plankton in the water everything is pretty green all the time anyway no matter the depth. We just need lots of light.

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I was referring to the DV-9. Compared with my other lights the beam definitely has a rather sickly greenish tint – will try to take some photos and post a vomparison.

Yes, I guess when it is actually used for diving, the tint won’t really matter too much. Not been scuba diving for nearly 30 years, but I do remember how red colours fade very quickly after a few meters.

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Just dug out mine again. Got 3, all the same tint, white-white ever so slightly on the blue side. Not a hint of green, even at moonlight levels.

My 2AA-X? Green. Jet-I? Green. F1? Green.

DV-S9? Not a trace of green.

Yeah, you may’ve lost the tint-lottery.

Maybe they added AR-coated glass to green it up?

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Pretty sure it’s not AR coated.

Last time I used it a few weeks ago, I forgot to turn it off, and I noticed the next day when the light was very dim. But instead of taking the battery out (VTC6 with sleeve), I left it inside, and I just noticed it has been drained to 2.31V! Currently charging the battery and obviously checking the temperature every few minutes – that should be safe as long as I keep an eye on it, right?

flydiver
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That’s kind of low but it should live. Mark it and watch it for heating or other bad behavior.

One of the things I really liked about the DS-V9 I had (gifted away), was that it had what seemed to be a reliable low voltage cut-off @ 3.25v (resting and tested after pulling it out). The U’King is the same, at least the 3x I’ve tried it. Sounds like maybe you have a ‘lemon’ (lime? Wink light.

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Flying Luminosity wrote:
Last time I used it a few weeks ago, I forgot to turn it off, and I noticed the next day when the light was very dim. But instead of taking the battery out (VTC6 with sleeve), I left it inside, and I just noticed it has been drained to 2.31V! Currently charging the battery and obviously checking the temperature every few minutes – that should be safe as long as I keep an eye on it, right?

I’ve resurrected some laptop pulls from lower. Big Smile

I use them only in lights where I can keep an eye on them, not as nightstand lights or anything. No problems yet.

I also try to never run them down too low. Only once did I notice a light get dim (S2+) and then blink itself silly. Immediately turned it off (before it turned itself off) and recharged the cell. Didn’t measure its voltage.

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Flying Luminosity
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I’m pretty sure that the LVP didn’t kick in – unfortunately I didn’t check the battery level before I turned it off, but it must have been way below 3.25V, considering how dim it was. And it would be an insane parasitic drain, if the battery had been depleted by one volt in just a couple of weeks – I thought only Nitecore lights did that!

Light bringer wrote:
I use them only in lights where I can keep an eye on them, not as nightstand lights or anything. No problems yet.

Does that mean it could still cause problems during use after successfully recharging it? I thought the only issue was the charging process after a battery has been drained to <2.5V?

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Flying Luminosity wrote:
I’m pretty sure that the LVP didn’t kick in – unfortunately I didn’t check the battery level before I turned it off, but it must have been way below 3.25V, considering how dim it was. And it would be an insane parasitic drain, if the battery had been depleted by one volt in just a couple of weeks – I thought only Nitecore lights did that!

10mA as I measured mine. About as much as a single LED on moonlight mode.

What about if LVP kicked in, turned off the light, but that 10mA kept draining it all the while you forgot about it?

Parasitic drain is parasitic drain, period. Keeps the Hall-effect sensor alive, powers the µC, etc., just turns off the power to the main LED. That’s pretty much the same for all lights without a mechanical off-switch. All e-switch lights, all sliders, etc.

Flying Luminosity wrote:
Does that mean it could still cause problems during use after successfully recharging it? I thought the only issue was the charging process after a battery has been drained to <2.5V?

Meant that I’ve been using my resurrected pulls for quite a while without incident.

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flydiver
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There may be parasitic drain after the light goes out. Since yours was still on there certainly was drain. Once the battery is significantly drained it doesn’t take much to pull the voltage down lower. Mine stays fairly bright and simply goes out….gone. It will not start again. I have not left it that way so don’t know what happens if that is done.

On over discharge there is the potential for permanent damage. Depends on the battery quality, age, and degree of discharge so there is no clear answer. Seems 3.0v is pretty safe, 2.8v is OK, 2.5v IMO is pushing it but not a catastrophe. Once you get down below 2.0v it’s not so good. Then you get into the whole debate of what’s the battery worth to you vs. the potential for damage and harm?

The problem does generally show up with charging, but there are reports of problems during use. But the specifics of those are often difficult to clearly determine. I’ve got some lipos (for RC flying), that were new and I accidentally discharged to 0v. I ‘boosted’ them with a NiXX charger, and then charged them normally. They puffed a bit but continued to operate like normal 2 years later. They ARE marked, kept in a fridge at storage charge, and ONLY charged just before flying. Obviously I didn’t toss them, but I SURE AM watching them.

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Thanks for the infos. Will definitely be marking it, and using it for low-risk applications.

I usually recharge my batteries when they reach about 3.6V – I hate the thought of walking my dog, and not being able to use turbo mode, since most of the lights that I own draw a high current and cause a considerable voltage sag. That’s why I have plenty of VTC6 and 30Q lying around and I used one for the DV-9, otherwise a high drain battery would probably be overkill for this light. The one that I used had been recharged less than ten times.

With nightstand lights, I’ve been testing how long they last in the lowest mode. But after this experience I’ll probably put an end to that, and check the voltage more regularly. Or I’ll just use my Olight S Mini with CR123A – those cells almost seem to last forever! Smile

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