Texas_Ace MT09R Modding thread, 20k+ lumens, 80CRI, can start fires? Yes please.

Hmm, that is quite possible. Those were from my old stash of LED’s, it is quite possible they were from another reel and were slightly higher binned.

But aren’t these all M4 bins? Thought you can’t source anything over M4 for 4000k 80CRI?

Alright guys. I will compare another ceiling bounce test tonight. Acebeam x45 quad xhp70.2 25000 lumen vs haikelite mt09rTA triple xhp 70.2 ( 22k-24k ). I will post number tonight.

Yes but each bin from Cree has a 7% +/- tolerance range in both output and forward voltage. This is why the results can vary so much light to light and LED to LED.

I just got the second MT03 finished and it is doing a bit better, a bit at ~21.5k lumens.

As you know the color temp is just the color of the light from the LED. Although it gets more complicated then that as you can have many differnt hues toa given tint (green, red, yellow, blue ect) it is still pretty basic.

CRI is how close to sunlight the light produces color. most LED’s are 70cri or less and colors look flat and dead.

80cri is 80% of the sun and is what you generally see in LED and florescent household lighting. It is a good mix of output and color.

90CRI is 90% of the sun and produces nicer colors at the cost of lumens.

The flux bins are simply how bright and efficient the LED is.

In the case of the XHP70.2 the P2 is the highest output bin, It then goes N4 - N2 - M4- M2 - ect.

Each bin is around 7% brighter/dimmer IIRC and Cree has a 7% tolerance for each bin as well (convenient wouldn’t you say).

So what this means is that some LED’s will simply be brighter then others and vice versa and there is no way to know until you try them.

You also have to factor in forward voltage. For example the 80cri LED’s have a much lower forward voltage that helps them make the big lumens they do even though they are a lower bin.

I look forward to the results!

Check out this link and download the data sheet. http://www.cree.com/led-components/products/xlamp-leds-arrays/xlamp-xhp70-2
You will start to see the patterns. Every led is tested with a set voltage and current and Cree reads the color data and brightness. It is then divided up into several groups to be sold.

Oh, I also wanted to let everyone know that I requested Terry hold off on sending me the MT09R’s he is sending to me until Monday. I will not have time to work on them until middle of next week anyways and this gives everyone a little more time to jump on board before he ships them to me.

The more we can keep things in larger orders then a bunch of small ones the simpler it is for all of us.

He has the lights now, I just simply won’t have time to work on them as the lights I have on hand now will take all my spare time until this weekend I am sure and early next week I will be busy with other stuff.

Speaking of which, 1 or 2 more packages showed up today but I have not opened them up yet to see whos they are.

Ok. I got it. I am happy with the result. Mt09rTA did great.


pic upload

Sent mine Fed Ex this morning, they said it would get there Friday morning :slight_smile: Can’t wait!

Maybe Dale, in holding off on shipping more lights, will have time to ship my charger that I bought.
Back in January.

@Texas Ace, if the package you received is Blue MT09R XHP 70.2, that should be mine

This is not convenient at all!
Lol.

So an N2 bin has 7% less output than an N4 bin “generally speaking”. You would think each bin would have a tolerance of + or - 3.5, but it doesn’t. It’s + or - 7 or 14% total! :confounded:

Here are common 70.2 bins and their lumen range at 2.1A, 6v and 85°C.

K4 1290 1380
M2 1380 1485
M4 1485 1590
N2 1590 1710
N4 1710 1830
P2 1830 1965

With such a large tolerance you can see where an N2 might fit in the range of a M4 or N4. It’s a wide tolerance of 14%.

So an N2 could be anywhere from 1540 to 1760. Basically anywhere from its normal range to the upper half of the bin below it to the lower half of the bin above it.

For example, from 20,000 lumen to 23,000 lumen is 15%. So you could see such a large swing in output from a single bin. (assuming all 3 emitters in one light were on the bottom end of the tolerance and the other 3 were at the top end of the tolerance. This is pretty rare, though. It’s usually in the middle somewhere)

It is only when using FET drivers that forward voltage has a big effect. With most factory drivers the forward voltage has little to no effect at all. I don’t think the 80cri has a higher efficiency, either. It gets its higher output from drawing higher amps which produces more heat and drains the batteries faster. Correct me if I’m wrong TA. The forward voltage stuff is a bit hard for me to understand.

I made a mistake, I meant to say Terry not Dale lol.

I will watch for your light, I know I have several showing up in the next few days, gonna try to knock them out by this weekend before I start on another project that will take my time for a few days.

Very possible, I will go through the mail after I finish SVK89’s last MT03. I have had his lights long enough and want to get them shipped out tomorrow.

Yes, that is more or less correct, there are some highly technical things that can effect it but not enough to matter in 98% of situations.

Higher CRI emitters generally have lower forward voltages in order to keep efficiency up to par. In this case it can handle the extra power so that helps a lot but yes, it will get hotter then the same light built with P2 emitters.

They both get hot so fast I doubt most would notice the difference though lol.

Great info thanks!
Of the three, which one can use turbo the longest? I’m suspecting the x45 due to the largest head? And which one has the most throw….mt09?

Ok… if I want to order and modded where do I start? Do I pm someone or go ahead to the site and order it then pm? and can you do some night shot comparison of different lights and the modded MT09?
I might just get this one and called it the final flashlight I’m going to buy… until I see a 50k lumen fairly compact handheld cannon (yes I set the numbers high so I don’t go and buy another new light (with good UI/CRI) that’s capable of doing 22.1k lumen lol)

Pretty sure my version 1 MT03 arrived at your place today. You are on a MT03 roll… :+1:
Thanks. Can’t wait to see the transformation.
Keepitsharp

Ok, I just got SVK89’s final MT03 modded, this one is the best of the bunch, it is doing just under 23k lumens also with the 4000k 80cri LED’s.

Goes to show how the LED lottery can work, 3 lights with the exact same work, same driver and the LED’s are all from right next to each other on the reel yet a range from 21k to 23k lumens. Just no way to predict it.

I will get SVK’s lights packed up and shipped tomorrow.

You can order the light from Terry and then just tell him you want it sent to me.

Then PM me and we can figure out exactly what you want and get the order in motion.