I prefer charging my basic cells in a charger. I donāt like on-cell USB charging because things being smaller, thereās more of a chance something in the charging module craps out, thus rendering the cell useless. Same with PCBs and perhaps dropping a cell on the ground.
If I have to have on board USB charging for something, I guess Iād prefer the light to do the charging, all things being equal?
I get that theyāre totally convenient for many people and while I have a lot invested in chargers, some of mine: Liitokala 100, Xtar MC1+ and Xtar XP-1 Hummingbird arenāt all that inconvenient to carry around.
I respect you have your own comfort zone, however, the USB charging disc in my PT lights seems to operate exactly the same way the charging discs built into the USB batteries operates.
The disadvantage of the charging disc being in the light, is that it disables the light, while it is acting as a chargerā¦ That is a big disadvantage, for me. I greatly prefer the ability to charge the USB 16340 outside the light, so I can continue to use the light while the Battery is charging separately.
I also respect that you have more sophisticated chargers, that can give you capacity data, which the USB charging ports on Lights or Batteries, does not provide.
Iāve got two of the CooYoo Quantum type lights that Ven gave and they (lost the CooYoo during Irma) never got close to charging up to 4.20v, which isnāt unheard of with external chargers either, but they generally get closer, IME. Then thereās the item of speed and light chargers tend to be on the slower side of things.
Like I said, I donāt mind choices if theyāre rendered properly, itās just that I donāt seek out lights with internal chargers, I donāt seek out lights with fixed, or proprietary batteries and I donāt seek out cells/batteries with on board charging modules on them.
I have lots and lots of cells and chargers here, so Iām not speaking from trepidation, or inexperience.
But if we all liked the same things, it would be a boring world, wouldnāt it?
Im new to LiIon, I dont have a lot of older cells, I dont have unprotected cells, and I dont rely on external chargers.
If a charger falls short of 4.2v, I consider that safer.
If a charger works too fast, I consider that less safe.
since Im new to LiIon, and 16340 in particular, All my cells have USB rechargeability. It is imo, the newbie friendly, more modern option.
Not to say that there arent plenty of old timers that do fine with chargers and unprotected cellsā¦ Im just conservatively cautious about LiIon use, and imo the USB Protected 16340 are a no brainerā¦ No charger needed, whats not to love? These are not proprietary, that is, they work in ALL my lights, they are not tied to a specific light model, nor to a specific charging strategy.
The only proprietary battery mentioned in this thread is the S1R battery, which I do not recommend at all. Also this thread is specifically about the USB Rechargeable cells, it is not about IMR, or other chemistries, nor about non USB batteries.
I think the USB batteries are a totally viable option, and imo lights that include them make great gifts for newbies, who may not need to learn about chargers, voltmeters, and the safety strategies for using UnProtected cells.
Jon, I have no experience with integrated charging cells, but if a typical cell charge is closer to 4.10 V on the meter, I would begin to suspect the meter calibration (or lack there of). I know my meter measures about 0.07V higher than a calibrated meter when measuring around 4.2V. It could be that your meter is measuring a bit on the low side, which is why you always measure voltages below 4.2V. Or it could be that your meter is very accurate, and all the cells you bought have the charge cut off set below 4.2V. I hope it is the latter.
In built charging rules!
Imagine taking out your cell phone battery and having to have the charger with you every time to charge it :weary:
This is also why we carry multiple lights, one on charge, one in use
Very rarely seen the smaller cells maintain 4.2v after a little rest out the charger except some HQ 18650ās, a little undercharging is good for the cells too.
Admittedly, youāre new to this stuff and therefore inexperienced.
Slower isnāt safe per se, itās just slower, since cells have a charging range speced in.
4.20v (+/- .05) is the standard. Less isnāt safer.
With 16340s and PCBs, weāre talking generally ChiCom li-co chemistry, which is the reason youāre using a PCB in the first place. With modern lipstick lights drawing higher currents, li-co isnāt ideal for that application, since li-co is a <2A chemistry.
If youāre not running on high/turbo, all that often, then li-co can be fine and offer slightly more runtimes.
Anyhow, stick with what youāre comfortable with, but thereās more than one way to skin a cat.
most people dont have experience with USB cells. That is why I started this thread, to share my experience and appreciation for the option. I recommend you try them.
I agree my meter may be reading low, Im not worried about that. The bottom line is the USB charging circuits work great, they dont overcharge, they dont overheat, and they dont charge at too high a rate.
I cannot find anything not to like about my USB rechargeable cells. In fact, I wont buy cells without the feature anymore.
and fwiw, the Olight S1 Mini, the Klarus Mi1C, and the Utorch S1 Mini, all include a USB cell in the purchase priceā¦ I think they are a very good buy.
I recall you were selling one of the proprietary IMR batteries for use in an UnProtected light a while back. I tried to tactfully suggest that was a bad idea. I still think it is a bad idea to use the S1R battery in other models that lack built in protection.
The beauty of the USB rechargeable cells, besides the convenience of charging, is that they are Protected. That means they can be used in all the many Unprotected lights that are being sold, without having to use a Voltmeter at all, not to test discharge level, and not to test charging cutoff voltage.
There really is no downside to the USB Cells, that I have found.
I still respect that people are leery of new technology, and or loyal to their old chargersā¦ choices are good.
thank you for sharing that info
I would definitely not be happy if my batteries did that
I have not tried storing my 16340 cells, unused for 3 monthsā¦ my cells are all actively used and rotate through my lights
if any new info arrives, please do shareā¦ It is unclear whether freemeās cell had a problem related to the USB portion of the design, or some other factor
your post is totally on topic, and I appreciate any info regarding failures of Cells with built in USB charging
especially if the failure can be attributed directly to the charging chip, which may or may not be what caused the failure freeme reported
I still am. The buyer could choose to buy the light without the battery, as I originally listed, or buy the light with the battery and not use the battery, or offer to buy just the light at a lower price, or be conscientious of what they have and use the two together. The buy could choose to use the battery in an protected light also. They will certainly see your warning in the buy thread, as I havenāt relisted the light.
The chargers and batteries all have LEDs on indicating full charge. I donāt think theyāre drawing power from the battery, so your meter probably canāt detect the small current. Are you sure thereās no trickle charge?
I have no evidence of Trickle Charging.
Share if you find any evidence of Trickle Charging.
In any case, folllowing those protocols, there is no possibility of a trickle charge:
Do NOT charge LiIon unattended.
Do NOT charge LiIon overnight, unattended.
Do Disconnect the charging cable when the charge indicator says Charging has Stopped.
another example,
the charging chip on my PT-18, immediately after it turned green:
Battery is still connected to charging cable, the indicator light is green, and there is Zero Amps charge rate, but 4.99v:
4.15 volts from the fully charged battery, immediately after unplugging the charge cable
Charging cable disconnected from battery, Zero Amps charge rate, but now 5.03v:
As you suggested, the status LED seems to be using Volts to light the status light when the charge cable is plugged inā¦ even though the charge status light is green, there are Zero Charging Amps indicated on the meter. I interpret that to mean that charging is switched OFF, and the Green Full Charge Status indicator light was being powered from the USB cable.
How are these cells holding up? Particularly the Olights? Iām about to get some of these for a couple V11Rās that Iām gifting to non-flashaholicsā¦
I have the Fenix batteries. I know they make 2 versions of this USB 16340.
The original by the name of 700U, and the newer one goes by the name of 700UP.
The U stands for USB, and the P version is capable of a higher discharge current, rated for constant 2.5 amps.
Fit hasnāt been an issue, but I own very few 16340 lights.
