Actually, I think you can on a HDS, if for example you’re running a RCR123 and you switch to a CR123A within the 60s delay (for soft reset), the light simply won’t switch on….so if you open and close it within 60s with a depleted 16340, you’re still good to go !
But the contrary isn’t true, if you switch from a CR123A to a 16340, the light will immediately notice the difference (same behavior as the Novatac BTW).
The Novatac forces you to do a battery reset, the HDS does it automatically, but you have a 60s “grace” delay.
One thing that could be interesting to see on Novatac (if you’re eager to redo a 250 click routine to enable programming) could be to try if it can blink out it’s firmware version like the HDS. On the HDS you have to remove the battery 60s (or open the light while it’s on), then hold the button while screwing the battery tube. It will switch on dimly, then brighter for 10s, then go off for 10s (hold the button !), then after 10s should start blinking it’s firmware number, until you unscrew the battery compartment (number displayed with button clicked should be the version, for example 1.23, and the value displayed with the button released could be the lumen value rounded to 2 digit. My 100HC gives 10, then 1.23, my 140 gives 14, then 2.11. The button only has function for versions 1.xx.
(since the legacy clicky can be version 1.22 or 1.23, I guess Novatac could be like version 1.10 or something). To be tested on a “real” 120P, where you don’t need to click 250 times !
Sorry this is off topic. The Novatac also has a tendency to flicker more on CR123A than 16340.
LOL, nope, not gonna do a factory reset
so, not likely to determine the Firmware version of my Novatac
I definitely appreciate your posts, no hijack at all, Im grateful to learn more from your experience with HDS, I have only tried a Novatac so far
suffice to say Novatac gives ample low battery warnings:
when the battery goes below 3.6v, low mode will flicker visibly, but other modes will still function
when the battery goes below 3v, low mode will strobe visibly, and no other modes will be available
then there is the meaningless visible flicker at 5 lumens, which is always there, regardless how full the battery is
I have no interest in using CR123, I dislike how they smell.
I am very happy with Protected 16340, no matter what the Novatac tries to do, it cannot overdischarge a protected cell.
I like Protection, and particularly the USB rechargeable Protected cells from Olight:
I recommend against the Fenix USB rechargeable version due to excess length.
CR123 Primary on left, Olight protected USB rechargeable 16340 middle, Fenix protected USB rechargeable16340 on right:
It is true that CR123A smell! I have a bunch of them, need to use them before they expire…16340 have little capacity. Good thing with Novatac is you can perhaps using 18350 batteries, replacing the spring by a brass/aluminum contact bar.
Will try to have my Novatac blink out its version.
yes, about half of a CR123 Primary
they last a long time for me, as I dont use the maximum mode hardly at all. Most of my use is below 20 lumens and indoors.
Firmware versions are a new topic for me. I dont know what features they offer. Will be curious to learn more from you about that.
It’s mostly hidden features, like a supposed better efficiency…also some change in the programming, the way the menu work the way the low battery indicator works. Also bug corrections !
I don’t know much about that, you have some details,on the HDS website, I can only see the visible part of the iceberg : electronic lockout, low battery indicator, and starting firmware 2.10 (or 2.11 ?), the soft start when the light has been off for a while. The, you can enter the details of the default programming, tactical modes, etc…I think the last 2.18 offers the best compromise so far
Novatacs vary widely in runtime between each other too… 4 samples with different runtimes (also not calibrated to the same levels)
pic is a link
.
meanwhile, I did a little exercise to determine at what lumen level my camera can no longer capture Novatac SPA Flicker… the answer is, above 7 lumens, no Photo flicker… noticeably different scan lines at 0.4 and 5 lumens…
.
and other fascinating trivia… check out this Driver and UI description, doesnt it sound like HDS/Novatac?
Programming: Each mode can be configured to a one of the 24 available (visually linear) levels of brightness. There are also some special functions which can be configured to any brightnes level, too: strobe, beacon
Battery monitoring: Whenever the battery falls below 3V under load, brightness is reduced (about half). The reduced load usually brings up the voltage a bit. When it drops below 3V again, brightness is halved again - and so on, down to a very low level. It will not switch off and leave you in complete darkness.
thats actually H17f w lucidrv2 …
I wonder if H17f driver eliminates the Flicker the camera sees on Novatacs?
pic is a link
Well, since the h17fw is using linear 7135 chips, it means the dimming is PWM (although it seems to switch to an only 7135 350mA for the moonlight modes). Maybe the PWM is fast enough so you can’t detect it ?
yes,
it would be intertesting to see a Novatac modded to Triple Nichia, w H17f driver. I believe CRX has built one like that for ven
The H17f driver seems to have some very similar features to the Novatac driver, including 24 power levels that each increase at the same rate that HDS ramping does. And like the Novatac, the H17f driver has a 3v low battery step down… I wonder if HDS drivers are built by Dr. Jones?
re the PWM, the H17f driver link says:
“16 kHz PWM frequency: Invisible and inaudible.”
the fastest I can detect with my eyes seems to be 2kHz
given that the stock Novatac driver flickers visibly, as well as on camera, my guess is it oscillates at less than 2kHz…, technically Novatac Flicker is not from PWM, its from Constant Current Ripple… same difference, it causes photo interference, and is visible to my trained eye.
Yes, Novatacs flicker in the lowest mode. My Wichita also does this. A guy on CPF who worked for Novatac acknowledged this problem in one of his posts.
I have a few h17f’s Jon, in fact one of my fav drivers all this time on. Not in a Novatac though, I enjoy the beam as is ,with a nichia transplant thanks to CRX. It’s a good general use all rounder for me.
You can detect with a camera, but more importantly not by eye(for me anyway).
excellent info ven, very helpful @16kHz the PWM on the H17f is outside my vision range too
I can only detect visibly, up to 2kHz, as in my Olight S Mini on lowest mode
Im not as bad a flicker snob as I once was
I even tolerate the Novatac flicker now… in fact, I use it as a “recharge the battery” indicator, since the flicker becomes obvious to me, when the battery goes below 3.6v
I have also figured out which modes on the Novatac flicker Visibly, the most. I can avoid those levels… the 5 lumen, and lowest low, are the worst Visible flicker sources. I can see the dots on lowest mode if I wave the light to check, but, LightWaving is not a primary use for me… LOL… I have mellowed with age, and dont wave my lights as much as I used to…
Your CRX modded Novatacs have inspired me to pursue a single N219b mod, despite the NovaFlicker features.
I find the Novatac a really fun little programmable… It has one of the throwiest beams in my selection.
Some Flicker is Visible to some people, while others wont notice. Separate from Visible, there is also Flicker that can be photographed but is not Visible to the naked eye. I tolerate visible flicker in some lights, because I want to enjoy some of their other features. I feel that way about my Novatac, I like the UI, and I tolerate the flicker.
[QUOTE=maukka]I noticed some flicker on the lower levels 1-6 on my light. If someone’s interested in the output behavior measured OTF, here’s what it looks like. Measured levels 4 through 24. Sensor sensitivity / scope resolution not high enough for the lowest levels which also explains the low bit depth on the low levels.” The snob index”:Approximating flicker visibility of 5+ usually indicates that you can notice the flicker if you know how to search for it. 20+ is getting to the distracting territory. The flicker on the HDS will probably never be visible in normal use.
More like two thirds. Since the voltage is different you can’t directly compare rated mAh, you have to compare watt-hours.
1500mAh CR123 =4.5Wh
700mAh 16350 = 2.59Wh
880mAh 16340 = 2.96Wh
Let’s average the best capacity and best output 16340s and we get ~790mAh.
The Wh of a 16340 with 790mAh rated capacity would be 2.92Wh which is 64.888% of 4.5Wh or ~2/3 the capacity.
I find in my use of 16340 / CR123 lights (not much) I greatly prefer the ability to charge the batteries and the increased output over that ~33% extra capacity. Infact I don’t notice the reduced capacity IRL at all.
I dont like PWM either, or certainly when i can see it Jon. I can not or will not have a light i can see flicker! Simple as that, luckily most(pretty much all i have thinking about it)that have PWM , i can not see it. To me thats what matters, if i can not see it, no distraction……………not a problem for me. Malkoff(iirc the 3 mode) have PWM, again can not see it.
The 47’s mini have it on high , which i find kind of odd, now and then i can kind of pick something up. But i rarely use max anyway, so no big deal.
As with chadvone, the little novatacs are one of my all time fav lights. I just like the older designs, the feel/look and beam.
Bout time you got a HDS rotary Jon, too add to the family
yes, and a triple Tana Haiku, and a Sundrop
so many lights, so little money… LOL
thanks for sharing info, I fixed your Kaidomain link, I see it was a 4000k N219c
while the one from International Outdoor is a 5000k 219c
Your triple mods are an inspiration to me.
Do you have any preferences between the 4000k and 5000k LEDs you tried?
Can you please also share your thoughts, and a link, for which Carclo lens you like?