Maxtoch XSWORD L2K // 2000 Meter Laser Tech Thrower // Full Review

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Theodore41
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Tom Tom wrote:
Theodore41 wrote:
Is there any sound?Because I can’t hear any.

Yes, check your settings. And settle back for a good listen. Which was the whole point of my link, but probably went “whoosh” over the heads of most Wink


What about the wattage?How is it possible to have a 10W laser,when I know that Sanwu for example goes max to 7W?
The_Driver
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Theodore41 wrote:
Tom Tom wrote:
Theodore41 wrote:
Is there any sound?Because I can’t hear any.

Yes, check your settings. And settle back for a good listen. Which was the whole point of my link, but probably went “whoosh” over the heads of most Wink


What about the wattage?How is it possible to have a 10W laser,when I know that Sanwu for example goes max to 7W?

Only by combining multiple diodes, which is very common. 7W per diode is only reached in extreme mods.

Enderman
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Yeah, lasers use constant voltage, opposite of LEDs.

luminarium iaculator
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djozz][quote=DB Custom wrote:
With the Black Flat in a rough B158 mod (47mm lens) I got 350 kcd, but with some sorting and optimising people should be able to get 390 kcd. Correction to a 53.4mm lens would give 503 kcd. So this LEP technology gives 2.6 times as much spot brightness as the best current overdriven flashlight build. A wavien collar can increase the luminance of the die 2.2 times, so with one, a led actually comes pretty close to a LEP module. I wonder what the upcoming HX Boost led achieves with a collar…

Hmmm… How does 430 +kcd sounds to you in 50mm(47mm) B158 with emitter XP-E2 die size? LOL yes… Very possible, and this will strike whole forum soon. So goodbye XP-G2 S4 2B and Black Flat… Game over for that leds… Beer

But I agree that B158 has natural opportunity for 53.4mm lenses (Just look how much unnecessary “meat” their 50mm lenses have).

Sometimes I really can’t understand manufacturer blindness on some thing… Even if you draw them, explain them etc. They still don’t want to listen.

So I really hope Maxtoch will make LEP light suitable for all hunting situations… Probably smaller one with zoomable function. Or same size with zoomable function. I will wait…

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Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think I have the basic understanding of how this light is working.

This should be the basic design used in the Maxtoch. A rear firing laser to excite the phosphor in a very small dot, then a double convex (double aspheric) lens to produce a “parallel” beam out the end. Think of sunlight through a magnifying glass creating a tiny focused source of light. Now it’s night time and you reverse the source of light. You go from a tiny source of light to a wide parallel beam.

Enderman wrote:
The thing on the glass is a 45 degree mirror which directs any leaking blue laser light off the the side and into the flashlight head. The laser is behind the phosphor, you can’t see it. The 45 degree mirror is there to prevent blinding people.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

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Tom Tom
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The_Driver wrote:
Theodore41 wrote:
Tom Tom wrote:
Theodore41 wrote:
Is there any sound?Because I can’t hear any.

Yes, check your settings. And settle back for a good listen. Which was the whole point of my link, but probably went “whoosh” over the heads of most Wink


What about the wattage?How is it possible to have a 10W laser,when I know that Sanwu for example goes max to 7W?

Only by combining multiple diodes, which is very common. 7W per diode is only reached in extreme mods.

Oops, I didn’t make my link clear.

Try 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e11h73WhqK4

Turn it up loud, and admire the syncopation.

Edit: and the fat Moog bass.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autobahn_(song)

Deutsche engineering. Driven by a need for speed. Coming to a flashlight near you soon, by trickle-down.

The_Driver
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Why do you keep posting that? You’re cluttering the thread.

Tom Tom
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The_Driver wrote:
Why do you keep posting that? You’re cluttering the thread.

Frankly there is no thread.

Talk about it, hypothetically, but I doubt that you are going to get any useful tech. data. The rest will be supposition.

A very few people now have these, but don’t quite know what to make of them yet . They are very different.

This is beyond what has gone before, and the standard ability to measure the thing (if that matters at-all).

So, I suggest, a period of quiet contemplation, before posting again. Particularly if you don’t actually have one, very few do. (also applies to me, but I do have a deep technical understanding of the subject, and am impressed).

Otherwise, well, I’d better not say.

DB Custom
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This actually IS a thread, posted by a friend of mine, and Tom Tom, you’re out of line.

I am one that has the light, as is my friend, and we’re trying to bring it out to those interested. All relevant measurements have been posted, along with beam shots and some tear down pics, so do you actually have anything relevant to say or are you just loitering here, trolling? Stand down or go outside please.

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Not raining, 61º, few bugs, barely a breeze… I got out the Canon 5D MK IV and put my 70-200mm f/2.8L IS on it, set it up on a tripod with the XSword clamped to the center post… these are straight out of camera, JPEG’s as processed in camera at manual settings of 1/2” exposure, f/5.6, ISO 1600 WB set on Daylight.

at 200mm , a base shot of the neighbors barn with his US flag illuminated,

same settings, XSword on high… you can easily see the corrugated barn metal inside the barn and the tree line on the other side of the barn at over 750 yds…

And set up to point at the water tower 1.9 miles away… at 70mm first…

And zoomed in at 200mm…

These are full sized JPEGS SOOC, 30MP images so you can see for yourselves, this little light easily puts visible light on the water tower at 1.9 miles distant! AND, I forgot to take the clear glass lens off that I put in the threads to protect the aspheric! So it even gets better than these if my memory would just work for a change…

DB Custom
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By the way, humidity is 90%, supposed to start raining again late tonight and rain for 2 more days….

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Nice shots dale……definitely a little beast of a thrower this new tech.

Click any link to see MY REVIEWS:

Maxtoch M24 Sniper / Maxtoch 2X Shooter (2016 factory dedomed) , 2X - XHP 70.2 / Maxtoch Xsword / M1 Archer *** ### ThruNite // Archer 2A V3 / Ti4T / TN4A HI / TH10 / TH20 / C2 Mini / TC12 V2 / T01 /  , neutron 2C V3 , TC20 / Catapult V6 / TC15 / TC15 CE *** ###  Olight // H2R Nova , S10R III / S30R III / H1 Nova / H1 R Nova / X7 Marauder , PL Mini ,  M2R warrior //// Orca T11 / Nitecore EC20 / BLF A6 / Custom Convoy C8 / Lixada Triple 3800LM / Lixada 1000LM / LuxStone X30 / Manker E02 / Manker E14 II /  ### Thorfire /// PF03PF04 , Upgraded PF04 , C8 , S-50 ,  VG-10 , VG25 , C8s , BL30 , TK4A  , S1 , VG15 S  , TK 18 //// ##WowTac// A4 , A1 (original) , A2 headlamp , A3 //// Acebeam L16 /// Massdrop (Lumintop) Brass EDC

DB Custom
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A screenshot showing some relationship for those pics…

JasonWW
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A little update.


.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

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master-of-disaster
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The_Driver wrote:
Wetool states that their laser puts out 0.25W (ouput energy) for 200 lumens.

There is just no way that that is true. I suspect they are lying about the laser power because they are concerned about safety regulations.

In lock’s review he measured a max output of ~250lm. We all know how accurate homemade measurements of luminous flux can be, so let’s say that the light is actually capable of putting out 200 lm max, right on spec.

The spectral luminous efficacy of white light is commonly quoted as 300lm/W, but obviously that depends on the actual light source. (this paper gives 250-370 for ‘ideal white light sources’)
Let’s assume that the Weltool produces an optimized spectrum with lots of green and is able to reach 400lm/W.
Let’s also assume that the conversion process in the phosphor achieves 85% efficiency (IDK what would be a realistic number here) and that 60% of the light emitted by the phosphor makes it through the lens and out of the light (rough estimate).

Based on these assumptions, we get:
OTF lumens, for a laser output of 0.25 W:
0.25W * 400 lm/W * 0.85 * 0.6 = 51 lm

Laser power, for 200 OTF lumens:
200lm / (400 lm/W * 0.85 * 0.6) = 1.0 W

So the laser power needs to be roughly ~1W or more in the weltool, unless I heavily underestimated the amount of light that hits the aspheric lens.

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I don’t know what the power (wattage) is coming from the light , but I recently got ahold some of Maukka’s test lights to check my light meter setup and I was about 2 1/2 to 3% UNDER what Maukka’s big expensive sphere showed , so I am pretty confident in my measurement of 417 lumens coming out the front of this light with my light measurements.

Click any link to see MY REVIEWS:

Maxtoch M24 Sniper / Maxtoch 2X Shooter (2016 factory dedomed) , 2X - XHP 70.2 / Maxtoch Xsword / M1 Archer *** ### ThruNite // Archer 2A V3 / Ti4T / TN4A HI / TH10 / TH20 / C2 Mini / TC12 V2 / T01 /  , neutron 2C V3 , TC20 / Catapult V6 / TC15 / TC15 CE *** ###  Olight // H2R Nova , S10R III / S30R III / H1 Nova / H1 R Nova / X7 Marauder , PL Mini ,  M2R warrior //// Orca T11 / Nitecore EC20 / BLF A6 / Custom Convoy C8 / Lixada Triple 3800LM / Lixada 1000LM / LuxStone X30 / Manker E02 / Manker E14 II /  ### Thorfire /// PF03PF04 , Upgraded PF04 , C8 , S-50 ,  VG-10 , VG25 , C8s , BL30 , TK4A  , S1 , VG15 S  , TK 18 //// ##WowTac// A4 , A1 (original) , A2 headlamp , A3 //// Acebeam L16 /// Massdrop (Lumintop) Brass EDC

master-of-disaster
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robo819 wrote:
I don’t know what the power (wattage) is coming from the light , but I recently got ahold some of Maukka’s test lights to check my light meter setup and I was about 2 1/2 to 3% UNDER what Maukka’s big expensive sphere showed , so I am pretty confident in my measurement of 417 lumens coming out the front of this light with my light measurements.

I would guess that Maxtoch is using a 3W laser diode in the Xsword.
DB Custom
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My XSword checks out at 424 lumens with fully charged cells, holds it’s own quite well as the cells deplete. My XSword is only pulling 1.33A at the tail, so it’s really taking it easy on the 2 18650’s.

I have a 3W Blue laser and it’s pulling 1.61A at the tail from two 18350 cells, no longer making full power as it’s pretty aged now. It does, however, still burn what it hits as far as 25’ away (or a little more).

Beyond me what all this means except that the XSword puts light on a target an extreme distance away for the amount of power it’s using. Wink

DB Custom
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My green laser is rated at 200mW, bought as a module, and it pulls .53A from a single cell. (18500 in this case) It’s bright, but not a burner.

Adhara
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I have all of the available LEP production lights, the Maxtoch is a remarkable thrower, exceeding its specs handily.

Nice review, BTW.

robo819
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Adhara wrote:
I have all of the available LEP production lights, the Maxtoch is a remarkable thrower, exceeding its specs handily.

Nice review, BTW.

Yes it does do a heck of a job in throw…..and thanks

Click any link to see MY REVIEWS:

Maxtoch M24 Sniper / Maxtoch 2X Shooter (2016 factory dedomed) , 2X - XHP 70.2 / Maxtoch Xsword / M1 Archer *** ### ThruNite // Archer 2A V3 / Ti4T / TN4A HI / TH10 / TH20 / C2 Mini / TC12 V2 / T01 /  , neutron 2C V3 , TC20 / Catapult V6 / TC15 / TC15 CE *** ###  Olight // H2R Nova , S10R III / S30R III / H1 Nova / H1 R Nova / X7 Marauder , PL Mini ,  M2R warrior //// Orca T11 / Nitecore EC20 / BLF A6 / Custom Convoy C8 / Lixada Triple 3800LM / Lixada 1000LM / LuxStone X30 / Manker E02 / Manker E14 II /  ### Thorfire /// PF03PF04 , Upgraded PF04 , C8 , S-50 ,  VG-10 , VG25 , C8s , BL30 , TK4A  , S1 , VG15 S  , TK 18 //// ##WowTac// A4 , A1 (original) , A2 headlamp , A3 //// Acebeam L16 /// Massdrop (Lumintop) Brass EDC

blueb8llz
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Any available coupons? I think I’m ready to swoop one of these up now. I was waiting for a single cell version. I don’t know why they never released the option to use an extension or not. Single cell would still have given this enough power and runtime.

robo819
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blueb8llz wrote:
Any available coupons? I think I’m ready to swoop one of these up now. I was waiting for a single cell version. I don’t know why they never released the option to use an extension or not. Single cell would still have given this enough power and runtime.

No codes / coupons that I am aware of.

Click any link to see MY REVIEWS:

Maxtoch M24 Sniper / Maxtoch 2X Shooter (2016 factory dedomed) , 2X - XHP 70.2 / Maxtoch Xsword / M1 Archer *** ### ThruNite // Archer 2A V3 / Ti4T / TN4A HI / TH10 / TH20 / C2 Mini / TC12 V2 / T01 /  , neutron 2C V3 , TC20 / Catapult V6 / TC15 / TC15 CE *** ###  Olight // H2R Nova , S10R III / S30R III / H1 Nova / H1 R Nova / X7 Marauder , PL Mini ,  M2R warrior //// Orca T11 / Nitecore EC20 / BLF A6 / Custom Convoy C8 / Lixada Triple 3800LM / Lixada 1000LM / LuxStone X30 / Manker E02 / Manker E14 II /  ### Thorfire /// PF03PF04 , Upgraded PF04 , C8 , S-50 ,  VG-10 , VG25 , C8s , BL30 , TK4A  , S1 , VG15 S  , TK 18 //// ##WowTac// A4 , A1 (original) , A2 headlamp , A3 //// Acebeam L16 /// Massdrop (Lumintop) Brass EDC

luminarium iaculator
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Guys how about new VCSEL laser technology? I have few VCSEL in 850nm IR spectrum and they are crazy throwers when looked through night vision device.

Ocelot
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H

DB Custom wrote:
Pretty simple and obvious question with a very complicated and not so obvious answer. To get white light, equal parts of the color spectrum are mixed. Output from lasers is very distinct, a particular wavelength, but to control the effective output is perhaps more complicated than it would seem. Easy to put out a large amount of green light, not at all easy to produce an equal amount of red light, and blue is also not easy to make the output match green. The resulting mix of color, IF the outputs are matched through a great deal of effort, is not the white light you would want to use as a "flashlight" because of the 3 specific wavelengths mixed instead of an equal amount of all light. And then of course there's the radiation, the part that is damaging to animals (human's are animals too of course!) So, level of difficulty, expense, and dangerous output are the 3 primary reasons it's not done. (This is of course my take on the subject, accuracy may deviate from actual truth based on factors beyond my control, ie: how fast have I drank this mornings coffee...)

 

Actually the technology has existed for some time in laser DPSS projectors using wonderfully magic devices called dichroic cubes as a compound multiprism for generating white light from three independent  RBG laser sources... a fellow named “thunderf00t” on youtube has an excellent video of their properties, and they are ultra cheap (under $20) on ebay ...

 

EVERYONE HERE SHOULD SEE THIS ITS CRYOGENIC COOL...

 

https://youtu.be/GkvgkrCSIX0

 

however, the mechanism of laser excited phosphor works, instead of using direct electrical current to excite an LED to produce blue light, striking the yellow phosphor, which in turn reflects the many subtle variations of white tint and intensity of spectral white (to be then reflected, etc)....

LEP uses a powerful focused 445nm blue laser to excite the same yellow phosphor, so its an LED that is not directly electrically driven at ALL, driven exclusively by intense collimated photon light energy output...

 

the technology is in in infancy now, but BMW are pursuing it as the current future tech of automotive state of the art lighting systems, superior in so many ways to both the former reigning champion technology of metal halide HID back in the 1990s and very recently the EXPLOSION of permeation of very high output white LEDs as a primary headlight light source...

 

I was sooooo excited in when Osram developed its first Ostar white LED, first to achieve over 600 lumens from a single discrete LED, when the (then Luxeon, which held market supremacy the same way Cree does Now) rest of the field was challenged to reach the 200 mark... maybe ten years ago? Im old, cant remember exactly.... that i knew it would be within a few years to have discrete LEDs powerful enough to be used as automotive headlights...

 

Likewise, the emerging laser emission phosphor LEP technology is poised to leapfrog LED to provide a quantum leap ahead in candela intensity if things continue to evolve as i sense them...

 

.....too much throw is NEVER ENOUGH,  and LEP promises to be an exciting future directly immently ahead, although Now limited in power, just wait a while.... 

 

By the way, Dale, i hold you in highest regard for your relentless pursuit of insane overdrive phosphor scorching lumen output in all your mods, particularly of the Emisar D4S.... YOU ARE A MADMAN IN THE BEST WAY and i would love to be able to contract your modding services, since a stroke has robbed me of my ability of doing precision soldering work or component assembly, so im now a handi-modder in a sense. Many Cheers for your talents and abilities! 

 

i would love to hear the opinion of Enderman, whom i hold in Diety status on this forum for his relentless ingenuity in pursuit of the most extreme performing LED systems and engineering skills par excellence! I am always slack jawed by his encyclopedic knowledge base and DaVinci inventors gifts... Cheers to you, my friend...

 

and Cheers to the entire BLF community, its wonderful to have such a concentration of talent hobby enthusiast in one place to continuously educate and entertain.

 

Long Runtime and High Candela for All Smile 

 

Ocelot
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luminarium iaculator wrote:
Guys how about new VCSEL laser technology? I have few VCSEL in 850nm IR spectrum and they are crazy throwers when looked through night vision device.

 

heres the latest from Osram semiconductor, a page about VCSEL versus LED tech:

 

http://vixarinc.com/technology

 http://vixarinc.com/technology/benefits

 

Im THRILLED to see whats just around the corner in the immediate future of lighting technology...

DB Custom
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Thank you Ocelot, the madman part was probably more correct than you realize. Smile Thanks for filling in the blanks up there, a lot of fast past technology going on these days!

Since this is a hobby, I don’t make a habit of taking outside work but I do like challenges so from time to time I accept a proposal. Big Smile

Sorry to hear of your dilemma, I know we all hang in a delicate balance and there is a lot of “taking it for granted” as a general rule, in a way I’m a bit surprised to still be doing this but it’s still fun and while harder and harder to find something new to do I somehow am still managing.

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