Test/review of Vapcell INR21700 5000mAh (Purple) 2018

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Pajda cz
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vapcell Dennis wrote:

Vapcell 21700 5000mah 10A ,LG M50 rewarpped Smile

Yeah, all Vapcell cells are definitelly rewarpped Big Smile love english
Tom E
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vapcell Dennis wrote:
Pajda cz wrote:
vapcell Dennis wrote:
vapcell 21700 5000mah 10A ,sanyo NCR21700A rewarpped, the same battery :-)
I am quite sure that Dennis means vapcell 21700 5000mah *15A* = sanyo NCR21700A rewrapped. Vapcell 21700 5000mAh 10A are based on LG or Samsung cells.
Yeah,you are great Vapcell 21700 5000mah 10A ,LG M50 rewarpped :-)

Ok, I certainly understand better why rewraps are important. For example SONY does not like their cells being sold individually, outside a complete pack.

And I guess Dennis has to be as clear as mud about what this cell is a rewrap of. But no matter how you rewrap it, it's barely 15A, probably rated lower by the original manufacturer, and certainly never meets it's rated capacity. The droppage of capacity between 0.2A and 5A has me a little concerned, but for a lower performing cell, maybe it's more common.

At this point, I regret buying this one piece and won't be buying again. It won't keep me from buying Vapcells though, because I'm very pleased with many of their other offerings, like the rewrapped VTC5D. Bottom line though through testing like what HKJ does here, we can positively identify the good rewraps if all variants are tested.

Agro
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Except that you still risk that at the time of your purchase the wrapped cell is different from the one reviewed. And even if its not…how can you know if the next batch the rewrapper got was of the same grade? Facepalm

Tom E
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Agro wrote:
Except that you still risk that at the time of your purchase the wrapped cell is different from the one reviewed. And even if its not...how can you know if the next batch the rewrapper got was of the same grade? :FACEPALM:

Well the best thing to do is buy from a known good reseller like Liionwholesale.com - his support is phenomenal, and tests every batch that he gets in. I always will prefer buying cells from him based on availability and price (reasonable that is). imrbatteries.com is also good, personally don't know if their support is as good though.

But as mentioned before, you could be at as much risk buying a rewrap or branded cell - dunno if the branded cell is a fake or recycled as well.

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vapcell Dennis wrote:
Thank you very much for your understanding and support. Refer to the KHJ test vapcell 21700 5000mAh 15A, he said that discharge to 2.5V may reach 5000mah. But it needs to be noted that this is a high-power battery, you can compare HG2, VTC6, the voltage is not inferior. It may be less than 5,000 mah, but it's important that high voltage platforms, discharged to 3.2V, can get more capacity. :D

He discharges to 2.8V, not 3.2V, and the difference between 2.5V and 2.8V is typically very small. His conclusion is: "This cell is a good cell for large capacity and can deliver a fair amount of current without being a high current cell."

You call it high-power, he calls it not a high current cell. Again, the way my Vapcell 21700 performs, where it drops voltage immediately off the charger implies there's a problem with the cell. If this was a heavily used cell, I'd get rid of it. Again, I have no other Vapcell 21700 to compare it with and I won't spend the money on any more to find out.

I'm hoping if any other owners can report if there's behaves the same or not - does it drop well below 4.20V after a charge, in a few minutes, next day?

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Tom E wrote:

I’m hoping if any other owners can report if there’s behaves the same or not – does it drop well below 4.20V after a charge, in a few minutes, next day?

I also own two of this cell (I think this should be Sanyo NCR21700A, the 21700 cell used by Tesla). My answer is, yes, the voltage of this cell does drop below 4.20V within 1 hour, especially after a few cycles of use. But I also found similar drops on Sanyo NCR18650GA, so I regard this as a normal phenomenon.


This cell performs noticeably better than its competitors (5000mAh 21700 cells, Samsung 50E and LG M50), even when all of them have been cycled for a few times.


But, I don’t like the recessed top of this cell, because that introduces quite some more resistance in flashlights since the springs cannot be fully compressed. I must add a 2mm thick copper pillar to compensate this, otherwise its performance in some flashlights will be even worse than Samsung 50E, LG M50, while it should be better. With that copper pillar, it indeed performs better than the other 5000mAh 21700 cells. However, adding that copper pillar can be dangerous in some flashlights — it can cause short circuit! One of my cell died immediately because of that. Vapcell really should add a new top to this cell, otherwise, it is not that useful.

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True, I do see this behavior with my GA's but not as pronounced. I'll need to try it for a couple more cycles. Thanx though! good to hear other experiences.

I stopped buying GA's though because of this. The 35E's seem to do better, but may be because they are newer now, not sure.

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vapcell Dennis wrote:
Agro wrote:
Except that you still risk that at the time of your purchase the wrapped cell is different from the one reviewed. And even if its not…how can you know if the next batch the rewrapper got was of the same grade? Facepalm

We always choose good batteries for our customers. Big Smile

The words on the battery steel can will not be removed, so that customers can check the batch grade easily. Smile


Thanks for the info, that’s useful to know.
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Tom E wrote:

Thanks HKJ! This cell is a strange one - it does under perform, as expected, compared to the high amp cells. But I'm seeing some odd behavior in the charger. I set my SkyRC MC3000 to charge to 4.22V, so when I take the cells off, usually they read at 4.21 or 4.20V. For this VapCell 5000, it takes a long time to get to the 4.22V level, longer than any other new 18650 or 21700 cell I have, but some old cells behave this way. Then once fully charged, it drops fast - luckily if I can get it off the charger above 4.18V. In fact the first time, I pulled it off, measured at 4.18V, then the next day just sitting on the bench, it measured 4.13V. I have to see if this droppage is consistent - maybe it's a first time issue.

It's weird you measured such a low resistance - usually low resistance and high amps go together. Also capacity is lower than the rating even at a 0.2 amp draw.

So far to me, mine has characteristics of an old cell - hope I didn't get a bad one. I only bought one as well so can't compare it.

This may be related to quality issues at Tesla'a gigafactory.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1122728_report-tesla-panasonic-battery-waste-could-lead-to-battery-flaws

 

Quote:
A report by Business Insider, quoting three current and former employees, says that the company scraps enough material to make half a million batteries per day, out of the 3 million cells it sends to Tesla daily.

On its face, that level of waste might be appalling. But to insiders who understand battery production, it's a sign of even bigger problems, according to the report. One of the main reasons for the waste is that material to produce the cells, from lithium-hydroxide solution to machine rollers, gets contaminated too frequently.

Like other battery manufacturing operations, Panasonic's facility at Tesla's Gigafactory in Sparks, Nevada, operates a cleanroom environment, where employees are required to wear special "bunny suits" to prevent hair, lint, body oils, or other substances from contaminating the battery materials.

The current and former employees told Business Insider of examples of scissors, tools, and a roll of tape falling into vats of chemicals being mixed into battery electrodes. "Why do we throw away half a million batteries a day? Because people are slobs and the stuff's not clean," said one former employee.

Tom E
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Interesting, but still would like to buy a Tesla someday...

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In the product title of Vapcell 21700 5000mAh 15A it is described as a Tesla rewrap. HKJ Review

Is this Vapcell 21700 the same battery as Convoy / Tesla 21700 4800mAH ?
A reviewer gets 5004 mAh at 500mA charge. While HKJ only got 4744 mAh. Does this prove they are different batteries? I guess both are Sanyo NCR21700A? Do you know about any review of this Tesla / Convoy battery? Is this the best high capacity 21700 cell that can do 15A continuously? It has better discharge curve than Shockli 21700 4550 mAh (Pink).

I ask because Convoy 21700 is much cheaper.

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