[♛ FreemeGB] Fireflies PL47 Gen II 4*XP-L/ Nichia/ SST20 Hi CRI 21700 Right Angle Flashlight - ENDED

It has 150 ramp steps from moon (level 1) to turbo (level 150).

Internally, this is implemented by using PWM with duty cycles of 0 to 255 on multiple power channels. But as far as the user needs to know, it’s 150 ramp steps following something close to a perceptually-linear curve.

It’s not necessary to understand the code… but if you run it, it can calculate the estimated lumen output for you. It generates tables like yours, and lets the user choose which type of curve shape they want and how bright some of the points along the way should be.

It’s a python script, so it’d need a python interpreter installed. Depending on the OS, this can be a little inconvenient or it could already be installed by default.

Anyway, the links are the script used to calculate the ramp, the parameters sent to the script, and another thing to help determine exactly which of the 150 ramp levels it’ll use in stepped mode. The ramp shape it used wasn’t a logarithmic curve in this case; it used a ninth root instead.

Ha. Thank you. But, maybe someone else with like minded enthusiasm will be able to do that, because i just hugged my knees, started crying and i am now rocking back and forth. I hope to be done crying by friday but we’ll see how it turns out.

Seriously though, that seems about a phd away from my level of typey thing aptitude.

I said it doesn’t give twice the current of other high current cells. This is what your data show. It was in response to someone who asked if it’d be safe to use the 30T in the E07. I said it would be. In the same post I said I’d use the 40T in the PL47, due to heat issues, and the 30T in the E07.

Seems we’re in agreement.

So i just tried to acquaint myself with the concept of ninth root as it is entirely foreign to me and i found stuff like this:

“…Any non-zero number, considered as complex number, has n different ”complex roots of degree n” (nth roots), including those with zero imaginary part, i.e. any real roots. The root of 0 is zero for all degrees n, since 0n = 0. In particular, if n is even and x is a positive real number, one of its nth roots is positive, one is negative, and the rest (when n > 2) are complex but not real; if n is even and x is a negative real, none of the nth roots is real. If n is odd and x is real, one nth root is real and has the same sign as x, while the other (n − 1) roots are not real. Finally, if x is not real, then none of its nth roots is real…[wikipedia]”

The rest of the internet made about as much sense to me, didnt even seem like a comprehensible language for me, like i recognized the letters and some of the words but in combination, in context it just sounds like, “barblesnarfing harnkle pop doozelwenkel root plurfle zonkin buffle. Horple n > 2, yintoffen roffer (n - 1) noktory jimpley pinduffel…”

So unless someone else is willing to take up the cause i suspect this query is outside the scope of my abilities.

That said…i will consider the table i generated as a guideline with caveats. The provision being that it is wrong-ish, but ballparkyish right. In other words, good enough—for me—well not really, but no choice.

It basically means the ramp is configured to the shape of “x to the ninth power”… but scaled to fit. Every available ramp formula generates a smooth curve, but different formulas emphasize different parts of the output range. The ninth power thing I used places more of the ramp steps toward the bottom, then escalates quickly at the top.

In theory, a cube / cube-root shape should be visually linear, but I find it really depends on the light. So I made the curve shape a parameter for the calculator, for easier fine-tuning. And I use different shapes for different lights… just depends on what seems appropriate for each model. This one was actually calibrated for the Emisar D4S, and then copied to PL47 because it uses an extremely similar driver and emitter configuration.

The ramp shapes it has so far are: square, cube, fifth, ninth, and log. In order, they get progressively steeper at the top of the ramp and progressively flatter at the bottom of the ramp.

In any case, the higher it goes, the faster it rises. It’s not linear.

See why we love her? :heart_eyes:

Beautiful and painfully smart to boot. The beauty behind my brawn (lumenetically speaking, of course) I don’t have to understand it, I just have to run big enough wires to it to light the moon… :smiley:

I got my pl47 nichia 219b yesterday. Using 30T at 3.5v or Sanyo ga with adapter, the turbo works fine.

Using a fully charged 30T, turbo will overdrive the led, giving a purplish bluish tint.

So stick to toykeeper’s advice. Recommended cells only.

Thanks! That helps me visualize it better. Which also confirms my suspicions. It seemed to me there were going to be other factors that my model did not account for, and why my brain kept telling me there was a curvey thing going on and not a linear one.

I wonder if there is a simple way of estimating output like i did per ramp level without having to use your algorithm? To, say, approximate output levels or is it more likely that the formula keeps changing as it rises—i think is what your saying. In which case the approximation is that, “the higher it goes, the faster it rises.”

There has to be a formula that could do this. I am afraid however, that i lack the competencies necessary to do it myself.

Thank you for your input!

150, good to know. I like the UI on the PL47, thanks again!

Question: My PL47 is at default setting, when I ramp up it stops short of turbo and I must double click for max brightness, I’m assuming this is as intended and I’m ok with that. Aprox what % of max brightness (turbo) is the top of the default ramping? 50? 75?

Ok… i tried again… i use blue samsung 40t, and got 4210 lumen… this is for xpl hi 5000k.

Top of the ramp max is 1600 lumen. Or 40 %… all stock

The ramp curve is not a neat thing that can be easily calculated and implemented based on pure theory, one size fits all.

Particularly once you start multiplexing in a FET for direct drive at the higher levels, mixed in with the characteristics of particular cells, be they brand new, or aged, full charge, or lesser (realistic).

Hence the need to try to wind things back, where there is an obvious miss-match between the capabilities of the LED and the cell, and the thermal capability of the rest, ultimately leading to consumer dissatisfaction, warranty claims, reputational damage, if not addressed.

It has to be tuned, subjectively. But if you use a TK derived firmware, you can always change it to suit your own preference, if you take the trouble to learn how.

Frankly, you might be better off using modes. I do, after having given ramping a good shot. Which also allows me to have a pretty good idea of run-time at each level, which is important to me, and at what level the torch is going to turn on at…

Then there are the actual characteristics of the LEDs, which are all different. We have a couple of experts who do their best to measure them quantifiably, but manufacturers have to source what is available, which may be very different.

Then there is the subjective discussion based on no data, except observations such as “I like it. I see a hint of green. I cannot tolerate any hint of green. It is nice and rosy, creamy white, too cold, too warm, Goldilocks’ bears wouldn’t eat it. I expected a miracle gazillion lumens but only got what was obvious from a few minutes research of e.g. Maukka and Djozz test results, etc.

And in each torch design, the effects of e.g. good, or poor thermal management, and ambient temperature, and driver design, component selection, even things as seemingly simple as springs, will alter the actual response of the LEDS, brightness, tint shift, etc.

Which is what makes it interesting.

Ultimately you can only use your own eyes (all different) and decide what you like, subjectively. This is not a subject where numbers count for much at-all, no matter how tempted you are to try to put things into neat little boxes, and insist on asking questions such as “what is the best … I must have the best … and the brightest … I want lumen numbers only, because I don’t understand what candelas are and just like simple numbers, … only the best bin is good enough (all the rest should be binned) but I don’t want to pay any more, I won’t buy it unless I have a discount code, and I want it now, why don’t I already have it, It must be below the BBL (not that they have any idea what the “BBL” represents, that would take a little bit of scientific knowledge and critical understanding of why, instead of a buzzword to fixate upon), such discussion is frankly Wank.”

Otherwise it is worthless, e.g. the usual “my tracking number isn’t working, I’m going to file a PayPal complaint and get my money back, I will never trust this outfit again, etc. etc.”

It’s hardly a matter of life and death, but it is a livelihood for the suppliers who make these esoteric things for us, but don’t quite perform as well and in a timely matter, nor communicate as some would expect, it is a different culture, for individuals particularly so.So cut them some slack. Otherwise we’d still be thinking that a Maglite was the height of sophistication, and something to aspire to owning.

Or that crude FET+n drivers derived from Comfychair’s great Nanjg mods, back in the day, are still the bees knees.

Rant over, but really, this is just a torch that deserves to do well, despite the sniping and negativity. Whilst being realistic about what is realistically possible, and delivering.

My PL47 just hit the USA. 17TRACK showed it as not even received from the seller on the China end all this time. This is how bad overseas tracking is. You have to be patient. Then there’s the slow cargo ship that got caught in a big storm, my flashlight went overboard, got swallowed by a kracken, he shat it out, a dolphin found it and used it to light his way to Nova Scotia, he passed it to some Canadian geese who used it to light their way flying to Florida for the Winter, they dropped it (butterfingers) over the harbor in NYC, it landed on a pimp who traded it for some rock candy with a lady who also works at a mail sorting center, it then fell out of her pocket and got scanned into the USPS shipping system and now I have some tracking finally. Whew. Look at the positive, at least it’s tested as working :smiley:

Go for a e07 and use 40t.
Pl47 should be fine with 18650.

Just received mine. At first it worked fine, but after I unscrewed battery tube and screwed it back, flashlight stared on turbo and can’t be turned off. The only way to turn it off is to unscrew tail cap. I tested with LG 21700 which i got with the light and Sanyo GA with the adapter.
Any idea why is wrong with it?

It’s in the PL47 config file, but if I recall correctly I think the default ceiling is set to ramp level 120 of 150. And I think that works out to about a 30% to 50% of the full lumen output, but with all the nonlinear response curves involved it’s hard to say exactly without measuring.

If a light is in full turbo any time power is connected, that usually indicates a short somewhere, allowing current to bypass the driver and go straight to the LEDs.

That makes sense, I guess I should contact Fireflies then.
Thanks for the fast response ToyKeeper .

As you guys know, skylumen have two dead pl47. FYI