New VirEnce MCPCB for E17/E21/119/144/233U

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SKV89
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So far, the Optisolis doesn’t seem as enticing compared to the E21A, but I’ll wait for Maukka’s test.

clemence
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SKV89 wrote:
So far, the Optisolis doesn’t seem as enticing compared to the E21A, but I’ll wait for Maukka’s test.

Indeed, Optisolis is not easy to implement in flashlight world unless very specialized optics used. In my opinion E21A still the best when very high CRI LED for flashlight is needed.

- Clemence

ma tumba
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clemence wrote:
TIR still very useful to direct the beam out front and make the transition smoother than no optic at all (mule).

Clemence, could you explain what you mean here, please? What transition?
clemence
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ma tumba wrote:
clemence wrote:
TIR still very useful to direct the beam out front and make the transition smoother than no optic at all (mule).
Clemence, could you explain what you mean here, please? What transition?

Without TIR optic as in mule setup (just flat lens) the beam would be full circle with hard cut-off. With most TIR optic you should get gradation with center weighted intensity.

Any optics should help to throw the beam outside the flashlight rather than just absorbed in the cavity as heat. Let’s say we can get the same beam profile with mule and TIR optic (super even and floody). There must be a difference with output, because the TIR optic will direct the beam off the front more than a simple flat lens. This is especially true if the LED shelf cavity is deep and non reflective (black, matte, etc..)

Note: Frosting/diffusing any TIR optics should be done after the collimation (top surface only), except for some severe cases. Because frosting the LED cavity in the TIR optic would upset the designed geometry and lessen the chance to move the light to the front. Most TIR optics designed with uniform lambertian light distribution from the LED die.

- Clemence

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ma tumba wrote:
clemence wrote:
TIR still very useful to direct the beam out front and make the transition smoother than no optic at all (mule).

Clemence, could you explain what you mean here, please? What transition?

I assume that he means to say that with an optic, even if heavily frosted, you do get an actual beam which is bright in the middle with the brightness slowly fading away to the side, while without optic you do not have a visible beam at all, just flood light from front to side (although right in front of the led the brightness is higher than at the side)

Edit: clemence beat me to this answer, and said it better Smile

clemence
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djozz wrote:
ma tumba wrote:
clemence wrote:
TIR still very useful to direct the beam out front and make the transition smoother than no optic at all (mule).

Clemence, could you explain what you mean here, please? What transition?

I assume that he means to say that with an optic, even if heavily frosted, you do get an actual beam which is bright in the middle with the brightness slowly fading away to the side, while without optic you do not have a visible beam at all, just flood light from front to side (although right in front of the led the brightness is higher than at the side)

+1 Jos, and a mule’s outside perimeter beam shape will also follow the bezel’s shape (shadowing).

- Clemence

ma tumba
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I see what you mean. I really appreciate your yhorough explanations. They always add some extra bits of important and useful info in addition to what was asked

johnkey68
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Yesterday received order No. 10244
Today I decided to mount the VR16SP4 with the Nichia E21A 3v Configuraton in Skilhunt H03.
He soldered everything as it should, as recommended by the seller.
I decided to check Fluke. No diode burns.
Very sad …

clemence
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johnkey68 wrote:
Yesterday received order No. 10244
Today I decided to mount the VR16SP4 with the Nichia E21A 3v Configuraton in Skilhunt H03.
He soldered everything as it should, as recommended by the seller.
I decided to check Fluke. No diode burns.
Very sad …

What do you mean? I’m confused here
johnkey68
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To check the diodes, put the multimeter in the diodes check mode Diodes do not light, an audible signal is heard The driver did not connect, I decided to start to ask What’s what and why
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johnkey68 wrote:
To check the diodes, put the multimeter in the diodes check mode Diodes do not light, an audible signal is heard The driver did not connect, I decided to start to ask What’s what and why

Your module tested at 8A for 1 minute without problem. Try to disconnect it from the driver and test again. Smaller solder pads are the anode.

- Clemence

johnkey68
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 Everything was done, as in this photo, there is no result. The diodes are dead. Do not understand why. Can the diodes partially break off during soldering and move away from the pads?

 

https://i.imgur.com/tpiNOQy.jpg

clemence
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johnkey68 wrote:

 Everything was done, as in this photo, there is no result. The diodes are dead. Do not understand why. Can the diodes partially break off during soldering and move away from the pads?


 


https://i.imgur.com/tpiNOQy.jpg

Yes, it’s possible if you solder them for to long with weak soldering iron. The heat will melt the entire solder on the MCPCB and possibly one or more LED shorted (if moved). Easy fix is to add flux in between the LED gaps and reflow the whole MCPCB on a hot plate. Remove all wires and test again. Don’t forget to clean it THOROUGHLY before testing.

- Clemence

clemence
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Btw, from the picture….Did you test it using crocodile jaws? If yes, then the base will short

- Clemence

johnkey68
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clemence wrote:
Btw, from the picture….Did you test it using crocodile jaws? If yes, then the base will short

- Clemence


No crocodiles, only needles with needles
johnkey68
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clemence wrote:
johnkey68 wrote:

 Everything was done, as in this photo, there is no result. The diodes are dead. Do not understand why. Can the diodes partially break off during soldering and move away from the pads?


 


https://i.imgur.com/tpiNOQy.jpg

Yes, it’s possible if you solder them for to long with weak soldering iron. The heat will melt the entire solder on the MCPCB and possibly one or more LED shorted (if moved). Easy fix is to add flux in between the LED gaps and reflow the whole MCPCB on a hot plate. Remove all wires and test again. Don’t forget to clean it THOROUGHLY before testing.

- Clemence


Soldering iron 60 watts, visually the diodes are not displaced, the gaps between the diodes and the star are absent.
clemence
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Disconnect all the wires first. Then test each LED individually. It’s easier to only fix where the short occurs. It’s possible you heat it for too long and the solder bridged. If you can’t fix it, you can send it back to me or anyone else near your area who did the reflow of this LED before. E21A is indeed harder to solder than most LED.

- Clemence

johnkey68
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clemence wrote:
Disconnect all the wires first. Then test each LED individually. It’s easier to only fix where the short occurs. It’s possible you heat it for too long and the solder bridged. If you can’t fix it, you can send it back to me or anyone else near your area who did the reflow of this LED before. E21A is indeed harder to solder than most LED.

- Clemence


Has already detached
I called each diode individually
None burns
Tomorrow I’ll try to warm up on the kitchen ceramic stove at 200-210 degrees Celsius
johnkey68
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Exquisite color rendering
The picture was taken in RAW format
By pipetting the white balance is set
Thank you Clemence

!
!

VR16SP4 , 4 x Nichia E21
- Combined LED voltage: … 3v Configuration
- LED1: … sm503-D220-L2-R9080
- LED2: … sm403-D240-M1-R9080
- LED3: … sm503-D220-L2-R9080
- LED4: … sm403-D240-M1-R9080

clemence
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Nice scene choice!
I saw it before in your email attachment. Too bad, the Optisolis still not feasible for most flashlight applications.

- Clemence

SKV89
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I just received the 5 Tiara C1 Pros modded with 4x E21A from Virence.com and I am very happy with Clemence’s work! The packaging of my emitter/mcpcb order was phenomenal too! Thumbs Up Beer

I love the E21A tint especially the 2500k and 3000k version, which is perfect for bedside use. They are rosier tinted than the 3000k 9050 219B bedside EDC I’ve been using, which I already thought looks really nice. The 4000k is slightly rosier looking than my 9050 219Bs but not as rosy as the Cree 5D tints on the Emisar lights. However, it looks noticeably cooler than the Cree 5D tint. I think the 219B 9080 will be even better looking tint wise if you prefer rosier tint. I took lumen readings at 1sec (turn-on) using the TA Tube calibrated with Maukka calibration lights:
Tiara C1 Pro 4000k – 572 lumens
Tiara C1 Pro 3500k – 539 lumens
Tiara C1 Pro 3000k – 529 lumens
Tiara C1 Pro 2500k – 438 lumens
Tiara C1 Pro 2000k – 407 lumens

Lights were running with fully charged Aspire 18350 1100mah batteries. I doubt it matters what batteries I use though since the amps are pretty low. But the output is quite impressive given how small the Tiara is and how good the tint and CRI looks.

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Also, since you aren’t pushing much current on very low VF quaf E21A, you will get full regulated runtime.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

adam7027
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clemence wrote:
Nice scene choice!
I saw it before in your email attachment. Too bad, the Optisolis still not feasible for most flashlight applications.

- Clemence

Hello Clemence,

Could you test your VR21P4 loaded with Optisolis with Carclo 10623 or 10624 optics? I think, if the beam is properly even, that would be good for using them in a short (and wide head) 18350 flashlight. With 1.6-2 A (400-500 mA per LED), that would make a very usable 400+ lumens (500+ for 5000K and 6500K CCT).

Do I guess right, that the 4 different rotations of the emitter with the centered TIR over them should balance the beams produced by the off-center light emitting surface?

clemence
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adam7027 wrote:
clemence wrote:
Nice scene choice!
I saw it before in your email attachment. Too bad, the Optisolis still not feasible for most flashlight applications.

- Clemence

Hello Clemence,

Could you test your VR21P4 loaded with Optisolis with Carclo 10623 or 10624 optics? I think, if the beam is properly even, that would be good for using them in a short (and wide head) 18350 flashlight. With 1.6-2 A (400-500 mA per LED), that would make a very usable 400+ lumens (500+ for 5000K and 6500K CCT).

Do I guess right, that the 4 different rotations of the emitter with the centered TIR over them should balance the beams produced by the off-center light emitting surface?

I have no Carclo 10623/10624 but frosting the 10622 with #320 grit SiC already fix the beam very well.
No, with only 4 LEDs, rotation will only make the beam’s hotspot weighted to one side. The LED’s die hot spot is too asymmetrical it requires at least 6 LED in rotation to get even beam pattern from a tight plain TIR optic. So far, the best fix is to use the tightest Carclo 10621 paired with Luminit’s 30° – 80° LSD.

- Clemence

adam7027
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clemence wrote:
I have no Carclo 10623/10624 but frosting the 10622 with #320 grit SiC already fix the beam very well.
No, with only 4 LEDs, rotation will only make the beam’s hotspot weighted to one side. The LED’s die hot spot is too asymmetrical it requires at least 6 LED in rotation to get even beam pattern from a tight plain TIR optic. So far, the best fix is to use the tightest Carclo 10621 paired with Luminit’s 30° – 80° LSD.

- Clemence

If you refer to this, can you link retailers, where I can get it?

Another (non-flashlight) question. Did you consider getting an MCPCB manufactured for Optisolis, which has: 16 or 24 emitters, and can be configured into 4S4P (4S6P) or 8S2P (8S3P) for 12V or 24V voltage requirement. I think, if Optisolis is not the best for flashlight usage, it would be very tempting for ceiling light panels. If there would be such panel, I’d be a definite buyer for that (3-4 of these panels could nicely illuminate a bigger room).

clemence
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adam7027 wrote:
clemence wrote:
I have no Carclo 10623/10624 but frosting the 10622 with #320 grit SiC already fix the beam very well.
No, with only 4 LEDs, rotation will only make the beam’s hotspot weighted to one side. The LED’s die hot spot is too asymmetrical it requires at least 6 LED in rotation to get even beam pattern from a tight plain TIR optic. So far, the best fix is to use the tightest Carclo 10621 paired with Luminit’s 30° – 80° LSD.

- Clemence

If you refer to this, can you link retailers, where I can get it?

Another (non-flashlight) question. Did you consider getting an MCPCB manufactured for Optisolis, which has: 16 or 24 emitters, and can be configured into 4S4P (4S6P) or 8S2P (8S3P) for 12V or 24V voltage requirement. I think, if Optisolis is not the best for flashlight usage, it would be very tempting for ceiling light panels. If there would be such panel, I’d be a definite buyer for that (3-4 of these panels could nicely illuminate a bigger room).

Work in progress…. Wink Seamless module you can combine it to make unlimited larger panel of light.
Yes, that’s the correct Luminit. Will put some in the store too. Try to contact Edward Udarbe in Luminit, he’s the marketing manager. But be prepare, it’s a very expensive, aerospace class diffuser. Luminit just launched the cheaper version for earth dweller like us.

- Clemence

adam7027
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clemence wrote:
adam7027 wrote:
clemence wrote:
I have no Carclo 10623/10624 but frosting the 10622 with #320 grit SiC already fix the beam very well.
No, with only 4 LEDs, rotation will only make the beam’s hotspot weighted to one side. The LED’s die hot spot is too asymmetrical it requires at least 6 LED in rotation to get even beam pattern from a tight plain TIR optic. So far, the best fix is to use the tightest Carclo 10621 paired with Luminit’s 30° – 80° LSD.

- Clemence

If you refer to this, can you link retailers, where I can get it?

Another (non-flashlight) question. Did you consider getting an MCPCB manufactured for Optisolis, which has: 16 or 24 emitters, and can be configured into 4S4P (4S6P) or 8S2P (8S3P) for 12V or 24V voltage requirement. I think, if Optisolis is not the best for flashlight usage, it would be very tempting for ceiling light panels. If there would be such panel, I’d be a definite buyer for that (3-4 of these panels could nicely illuminate a bigger room).

Work in progress…. Wink Seamless module you can combine it to make unlimited larger panel of light.

It would be just perfect! Very good to get these good news! Thumbs Up I just told my father about Optisolis, and this way of its possible usage about a week ago (and I told him, that I will contact you). You already read minds Beer

clemence wrote:
Yes, that’s the correct Luminit. Will put some in the store too. Try to contact Edward Udarbe in Luminit, he’s the marketing manager. But be prepare, it’s a very expensive, aerospace class diffuser. Luminit just launched the cheaper version for earth dweller like us.

- Clemence

Aw. So this would be good for occasional custom builds, but probably won’t be competitive for using in a manufactured flashlight.

nsl18
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adam7027 wrote:
clemence wrote:
I have no Carclo 10623/10624 but frosting the 10622 with #320 grit SiC already fix the beam very well.
No, with only 4 LEDs, rotation will only make the beam’s hotspot weighted to one side. The LED’s die hot spot is too asymmetrical it requires at least 6 LED in rotation to get even beam pattern from a tight plain TIR optic. So far, the best fix is to use the tightest Carclo 10621 paired with Luminit’s 30° – 80° LSD.

- Clemence

If you refer to this, can you link retailers, where I can get it?

Another (non-flashlight) question. Did you consider getting an MCPCB manufactured for Optisolis, which has: 16 or 24 emitters, and can be configured into 4S4P (4S6P) or 8S2P (8S3P) for 12V or 24V voltage requirement. I think, if Optisolis is not the best for flashlight usage, it would be very tempting for ceiling light panels. If there would be such panel, I’d be a definite buyer for that (3-4 of these panels could nicely illuminate a bigger room).


Is there 16 leds module https://www.lumitronix.com/en_gb/aventrix-4×4-v2-led-module-16x-nichia-...
virencelights
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a quadtrix e21a or a quad optosolis 4000k for LEO use. which one?.

Virence ArmyTek Viking Pro Quadtrix 9080 E21A 5700, Virence Skilhunt H04 Quadtrix 9080 E21A 5000k, Virence Jetbeam AAA 9080 E21A 5000k,
Virence Jetbeam AAA Nichia HCRI Red Led.

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Easy Nichia E21A soldering on Virence VR16SP4 MCPCB
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Part. 0 (forgot to make it, Kaybi made me shot this one)
Pre-soldering the Indium to the MCPCB


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Part. 1
This is a quick and dirty video I made with one of the order. Sorry for the quality, it was hard working with only one hand.
The MCPCB was first pre-soldered with Indium at the LED pads. I simply add some flux (common water based Zinc Chloride) and ran the molten Indium balls until all pads properly wet and contained sufficient Indium blobs. Be careful! This nasty flux will corrode aluminum instantly in contact (above 50°C). I did all the soldering on my upgraded “deluxe” cloth iron hot plate. Temperature regulated and monitored to 160°C (+/- 5°C)
Next, I cooled the MCPCB and carefully placed the E21A in approximate locations. Reheat the MCPCB just enough until all the E21A stuck to the pads. Cooled the MCPCB, added some more flux and reheated the MCPCB. Voila! it’s done with minimal efforts.


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Part. 2
Ultrasonic Cleaner post cleaning. The water based flux makes it very easy to clean all the flux residue leftover, even from underneath the LED! The liquid ingredients: distilled water, dishwasher surfactant agent, and some dirt from previous cleanings. I did final rinse in a clean water (using glass beaker submerged in the USC)

Result:
Perfectly centered!

- Clemence

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