Prototype off-road/boating spotlight - King COB!

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prototype3a
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I wonder what LEDs this uses… It is one of very few PAR36 modules that I can find where it appears that it can be opened up.

https://www.amazon.com/Grote-63831-5-Work-Lamp/dp/B00460FV0Y

Also, I found one on ebay for far less than the insane $100 retail price.

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
I wonder what LEDs this uses… It is one of very few PAR36 modules that I can find where it appears that it can be opened up.

https://www.amazon.com/Grote-63831-5-Work-Lamp/dp/B00460FV0Y

Also, I found one on ebay for far less than the insane $100 retail price.

Not sure, but you can get it with this cool Fresnel…

https://www.amazon.com/Grote-63821-5-Work-Lamp/dp/B003H0TYIO/ref=pd_sbs_...

prototype3a
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Check this thing out!

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1349-page1.html

Looks perfect for a passively cooled hand cannon.

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
Check this thing out!

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1349-page1.html

Looks perfect for a passively cooled hand cannon.

I don’t even care much how it cools – it LOOKS freakin’ cool! NOFAN’s claims about the first fanless PC system though are dubious – they’ve been making fanless computers seemingly forever…

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prototype3a
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The key words “1U” and “passive” seem contradictory. Anything 1U is going to have stupidly powerful fans in it.

Though, I do like vapor chamber tech…

I can’t seem to find that NoFan CR-95C ANYWHERE. I know it was discontinued but….

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
The key words “1U” and “passive” seem contradictory. Anything 1U is going to have stupidly powerful fans in it.

Though, I do like vapor chamber tech…

I can’t seem to find that NoFan CR-95C ANYWHERE. I know it was discontinued but….

Possibly implying this will fit in a 1U rackmount case…. Can’t find the CR-95C anywhere either.

prototype3a
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Grote tried to tell me that their PAR36 units are well engineered and use proprietary high performance LEDs that operates at 130lm and 3watts. Oh and of course they’re really reasonably priced at ~$100 per unit. I’m guessing they’re using some Luxeon 3’s or something positively ancient.

I found a few youtube reviews of the NoFan heatsinks. Seems they do actually work but they’re HUUUGE. They actually made a CR-100 (100w class) unit and it looks positively massive.

I honestly think my best option for the Battle Lantern is to use the giant Cree and just under-drive it at maybe 25w.

On the other hand, I still want to build the hand cannon that can do the full 3.6A at 36v.

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
Grote tried to tell me that their PAR36 units are well engineered and use proprietary high performance LEDs that operates at 130lm and 3watts. Oh and of course they’re really reasonably priced at ~$100 per unit. I’m guessing they’re using some Luxeon 3’s or something positively ancient.

I found a few youtube reviews of the NoFan heatsinks. Seems they do actually work but they’re HUUUGE. They actually made a CR-100 (100w class) unit and it looks positively massive.

I honestly think my best option for the Battle Lantern is to use the giant Cree and just under-drive it at maybe 25w.

On the other hand, I still want to build the hand cannon that can do the full 3.6A at 36v.

Why limit ourselves? Mouser seems to have gotten in some new Luminus COBs that are 95CRI, and capable of 24K lumens… just need that 300W boost driver…

As to the Cree COB – I found that it runs just fine with the Stratus LED driver and 2s 5000mAh LiPo with the dimmer pot cranked all the way. I don’t think I even need the fan on for it. Never thought to measure the voltage at the LED.

prototype3a
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I’ve been thinking about maybe making the “hand cannon” like an old school dry cell lantern except just put a strap on a carbon plate or something and then I can strap whatever LiPo I have with me to it. Then I could use either a 6s3300 or a 6s22k or one of my 7s4p li-ion packs.

Got any links to the new Luminus COBs?

I think I’m going to order some of these 82mm LEDIL ANGELINA reflectors. Somehow I had not previously noticed their dimensions and they’re smaller than I previously thought which might work well for the battle lantern.

RapidLED has two of them at what seem to be good prices and they have the mounting hardware.

F13838_ANGELINA-XW
FWHM 90.0°
Efficiency 94 %
Peak intensity 0.480 cd/lm

F13402_ANGELINA-W
FWHM 66.0°
Efficiency 93 %
Peak intensity 0.790 cd/lm

Arrow has the

F13325_ANGELINA-S
FWHM 40.0°
Efficiency 93 %
Peak intensity 1.190 cd/lm

I suspect the 66deg will be my favorite as my other favorite floody light has a ~80 degree beam and that seems to work well. Any wider than that and you can easily accidentally flash yourself.

prototype3a
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I’m also going to get a LDH-45A-1050 and maybe a LDH-45B-1050 as the battle lantern definitely won’t be able to handle anything more powerful and it’ll still make ~7000 lumens which ought to be pretty fun considering that stock, I think it’s something like a 9w incandescent.

LouieAtienza
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LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
I’m also going to get a LDH-45A-1050 and maybe a LDH-45B-1050 as the battle lantern definitely won’t be able to handle anything more powerful and it’ll still make ~7000 lumens which ought to be pretty fun considering that stock, I think it’s something like a 9w incandescent.

7000 is a LOT… I installed an LDH-45A-1050 in a cheapo outdoor 50W spotlight someone game me that had a blown driver. This actually fit the bill nicely, and now I have a nice portable outdoor work light. Just need to make a yoke for it so I can use it with my tripod.

prototype3a
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MeanWell HBG series power supplies look like fun. I wish the HBG-160 was a little cheaper though. I may have to get one anyway just for testing.

CXM-32-50-80-54-AC30-F4-3 looks more efficient than the Cree I have and probably roughly the same light quality but like your CVM series… ~52vdc.

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
MeanWell HBG series power supplies look like fun. I wish the HBG-160 was a little cheaper though. I may have to get one anyway just for testing.

CXM-32-50-80-54-AC30-F4-3 looks more efficient than the Cree I have and probably roughly the same light quality but like your CVM series… ~52vdc.

You can get one without the casing from DigiKey and save about $10 or so, which is what I did.

Yeah, these higher voltages are not the easiest to deal with for portable stuff. Might have to look into e-bike batteries. We do have a couple e-Go yard tools at home – a lawn mower and line trimmer – that use 56V batteries.

prototype3a
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Totally unobtainium but Cree CMT2890 22mm diameter die, 5000k, 80cri and 12472lm (51v 1.6A) with Cree specified 90% lumen overdrive for ~24000lm. That’s the LED to stuff in a BLF GT reflector.

prototype3a
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Does anyone make a reflector for that CXM-32? Seems to be bigger than a CXB3590 so nothing fits.

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
Does anyone make a reflector for that CXM-32? Seems to be bigger than a CXB3590 so nothing fits.

The LES diameter is 32.8 and the outer ring is 34.3… so it’s only 2.3mm larger than 3590. Could probably get something to work.

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prototype3a wrote:
Totally unobtainium but Cree CMT2890 22mm diameter die, 5000k, 80cri and 12472lm (51v 1.6A) with Cree specified 90% lumen overdrive for ~24000lm. That’s the LED to stuff in a BLF GT reflector.

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Cree-Inc/CMT2890-0000-000P0B0A65E?q...

7 week wait, but you can order just one!

6500K, 70CRI…

You can buy it in Australia cheaper, in 3500K CRI80

https://www.cutter.com.au/product/cmt2890-cree/

prototype3a
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Yeah, seems the only one that can’t be had is the 80cri 5000k one that I want. LOL figures.

F13380 Angela-M (30deg) and F13381 Angela-W (45deg) are underperformers as they have a lower efficiency than most of the other LEDiL reflectors despite their size.

I think the F13402 Angelina-W will be the best for the CXB3590 and the under-driven battle lantern project.

CMA3090 series seems to be the most “well rounded” COB that is available, high output and only ~$30-35. Though, I don’t know how I would drive it yet at full output. It appears to produce nice beams with most of the LEDiL reflectors unlike the CXB3590 which seems to be too big or not have an ideal radiation pattern. The CMA3090 does seem to be larger than whatever the ideal size is but it makes up for that with crazy output where the COBs that are the ideal size only produce ~5000lm.

Annoyingly, Arrow only sells the C14036 clamp needed for the CMA3090 in large quantities. Mouser has it but then you have to pay for shipping.

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
Yeah, seems the only one that can’t be had is the 80cri 5000k one that I want. LOL figures.

F13380 Angela-M (30deg) and F13381 Angela-W (45deg) are underperformers as they have a lower efficiency than most of the other LEDiL reflectors despite their size.

I think the F13402 Angelina-W will be the best for the CXB3590 and the under-driven battle lantern project.

CMA3090 series seems to be the most “well rounded” COB that is available, high output and only ~$30-35. Though, I don’t know how I would drive it yet at full output. It appears to produce nice beams with most of the LEDiL reflectors unlike the CXB3590 which seems to be too big or not have an ideal radiation pattern. The CMA3090 does seem to be larger or not optimized either but it makes up for that with crazy output.

Annoyingly, Arrow only sells the C14036 clamp needed for the CMA3090 in large quantities. Mouser has it but then you have to pay for shipping.

The CMA3090 is actually a_ lot_ smaller than the CXB3590, having both in-hand. I really want to use this in a portable light. Finding a DC 170W boost driver though is not easy. I suppose I could dumb it down. And I haven’t tested the voltage output of the Stratus LED driver yet at 14.4V and 24V input.

I am liking that CMT2890 for the fact that the power requirements are a lot more manageable (about 10K lumens at 60W and 1.6A.)

Found another resource for COBs and heatsinks that seems pretty reasonable. They have an active heatsink they say can dissipate 400W…

http://cobkits.com/

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OK so I set up a 3590 on my test heatsink (the screw down holes weren’t wide enough for the COB! so I just held it down with thermal paste). Attached a Stratus LED driver and 3s LiPo 5000mAh 75c… I got 42.9V at the LED contacts and the pot turned about half way before I tripped something. Still too low to drive the CMA3090 (and I tried.) Couldn’t take a current reading – my shades fell off and I flashed my eyes. That 3590 is like the sun, and it probably would’ve taken more. Not sure what it is on the Stratus driver that makes it cut off past a certain point – I’m no electronics guy…

Even with a 2s LiPo I still get a 41.5V reading with the pot at max. Even crazier, I was able to light that 3590 using a 9V battery (though it would flicker if I moved the pot more than 1/5 of a turn.) So this cheap boost driver seems like it could be a lot more versatile than just some COB driver… In fact I bought another 3-pack for $45 because I have a few projects where this would be just perfect. I even tested it on a light module I made with 3 XHP35s in series and it worked perfectly- with dimming.

So I checked again the data sheet for CXB3590 and it lists the max current at 3.6A. So not sure what circuitry I’m tripping with the Stratus LED driver. If I disconnect the power, lower the pot, and plug it back in, all’s well. But, there has to be some way of disabling this… Evil

prototype3a
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I saw that Mechatronics IceLED Ultra elsewhere recently. It looks nice except that I have no idea how they expect you to mount that to anything since the fan doesn’t appear to have any lugs or anything on the top. I didn’t dig too deep. The heat sink is just a custom aluminum extrusion cut and sold in different lengths. I question the ability to keep a really high wattage LED cool with nothing but a slug of aluminum on it. However, I’m really trying to keep these COBs COLD for maximum performance.

Driving the CMA3090 at full output AND keeping it cool is definitely going to take some math and engineering. ~150w of heat from something that small won’t be easy unless I resort to water and an AIO.

At home, I have a B&K bench PSU that my brother gave me that I’ve been using for my shenanigans. It’s nice because it displays the current and I can measure the voltage with my Fluke. I just set the voltage to ~40vdc and then use the current limit knob. At work, we have a few really nice Agilent PSUs that I can wire in series to get quite a bit of power for testing but I haven’t done that… yet.

I’d guess you’re tripping an input current limit with the lipos but with the 9v, I bet it just can’t get enough power to work properly. Boosting up to high voltages isn’t hard. Boosting up to high voltages AND high power, is… I’ll have to look at the documentation for the Stratus LED again.

Anyway, I should have some more bits in the mail to play with this weekend.

prototype3a
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I just realized that I got the Stratus LED and the Led Treiber Xtreme mixed up in my head.

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I think the design of the IceLED is such that the fins also double as t-tracks for mounting. It’s also supposedly rated for horizontal as well as vertical use, so it’d be good for a hand cannon. Pretty much all these heat sinks are extrusions. Mechatronix has passive solutions as well, which have a sintered copper heat pipe in the center and are also rated for horizontal or vertical use. And they’re sized to neatly fit MeanWell drivers (maybe I should have gotten the cased one…

The Stratus LED site doesn’t list any input current parameters. With the 9V battery the light will flicker if I turn the dimmer pot up – but I did it more as a goof than anything. Only thing I can think of is that there’s some circuitry that is limiting output at 100W – they got these drivers specifically tuned to the Bridgelux COBs I would guess. Probably it’d work better with 4s or 6s, but I don’t have either. I do have two identical 2S batteries, but I’ll have to make a series connector for them.

LouieAtienza
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Here we go… 35,500 lumens, same size as the CVM32. All we need to figure out is how to get 103.9V at 2.4A into this thing! (and it maxes out at 4.68A!)

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/citizen/CLU550-3626C1-40AL7G4-...

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@LouieAtienza, have you tried using a 8500 lumens 4000k R9050 COB LED:
https://www.digikey.ca/product-detail/en/bridgelux/BXRC-40G10K0-L-23/976...

It would be absolutely dope if I could buy one.

It would look amazing.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

prototype3a
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CXB3590 pretty well destroys those Bridgelux Vero COBs for both output and efficiency.

I won’t mess with any LEDs over about 50v. It’s just not worth the electrocution risk.

Can you post a photo of the Stratus LED board. It might be fun to study the design.

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Uhh I wouldn’t really say destroying it in efficiency.

Look at the minimum lumen numbers at 85C of the CXB3590 90CRI 3500k vs Vero SE 3500k R9050:

CXB3590 4000k: 10000 lumens
Vero SE 4000k: 9771 lumens

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

LouieAtienza
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prototype3a wrote:
CXB3590 pretty well destroys those Bridgelux Vero COBs for both output and efficiency.

I won’t mess with any LEDs over about 50v. It’s just not worth the electrocution risk.

Can you post a photo of the Stratus LED board. It might be fun to study the design.

I think though when you get to 90+CRI the efficiency goes down fast… Although supposedly not as much with the CMA3090…

As to electrocution? I’ve been zapped more than most in my lifetime. Worst was, about 20 years ago, when I co-owned a cabinet shop in an old industrial building. The wiring was really shoddy, and we had a band saw by the window next to a standpipe. It was over 100 degrees outside and I was working with my shirt off, sweating. I turned to complete a cut, and my back rested against the standpipe. I couldn’t move – I was paralyzed and shaking. If my buddy didn’t pry me off the pipe with a 2×4 I wouldn’t be here typing this I’m sure. Now, it’s almost as if electricity passes through me. When we still had rabbit ears on the TV (never had cable till about 10 years ago) I could actually improve the reception by holding the antenna – and disrupt it bys imply waving my hands around the TV. I would change a fixture without shutting off a breaker, ask someone to hand me a screwdriver, and shock them – I don’t even feel current passing through me. Maybe that’s a bad thing… A couple guys even called me Mr. AC. Should’ve called Stan Lee for his TV show.

I’m actually more afraid of playing with my CFT-90… 40A scares me more than 100V. I was swapping out the connectors on one of my LiPo batteries, because it had those barrel connectors and everything I have has XT60s. I accidentally shorted the leads with my utility knife, and watched the arc cut through the blade. That’s not fun. And that’s only a 2s battery.

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