FW3A, a TLF/BLF EDC flashlight - SST-20 available, coupon codes public

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raccoon city
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teacher wrote:

So, in summary; there are plenty of flat top batteries that will fit the FW3A even ‘if’ no button tops fit at all. Beer

Now I don't feel so bad about buying flat top 18650 cells!  ;)

I wanted button tops, but couldn't find any for the cells I wanted.

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teacher wrote:
From my highly non-technical & less than scientific research Hat , my predictions for FW3A Battery Fitment are…..
  • Most all 18650 Flat Tops will work.

  • Most 18650 Button Tops will (most likely) not work. This will depend entirely on the height of the 'Button Top' installed on the cell... but it ain't looking good for "button tops".. . Wink

These findings are based on the stated Maximum battery length of 66mm for the FW3A. Thumbs Up

Since both pair of my calipers are hiding from me at the moment Facepalm , the measurements listed below are taken mostly from LIION Wholesale & MTN.. with a couple from Illumn & IMR.

…….
Flat Tops

  • Efest 18650 3000mAh Flat Top / 65.02mm
  • Efest 18650 3500mAh Flat Top / 65.25mm
  • Hohm Tech Life 18650 3077mAh 20.7A Flat Top / 65.12mm
  • LG HG2 Flat Top / 65.20mm
  • LG MJ1 Flat Top / 65.0mm
  • Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650GA Flat Top / 65.30mm
  • Samsung 35E Flat Top / 65.3mm
  • Samsung 30Q Flat Top / 64.85mm
  • Sony/Murata VTC6 Flat Top / 65mm
  • Vapcell 18650 20A Flat Top 3000mAh / 65.0mm
    _______
    Button Tops
  • Efest 18650 3000mAh 18650 Battery – Button Top / 67.1mm
  • LG HG2 – Button Top / 67.0mm
  • LG MJ1 Button Top / 66.8mm
  • Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650GA Button Top / 66.8mm
  • Samsung 30Q Button Top / 67.3mm
  • Samsung -35E Button Top / 66.9mm

So, in summary; there are plenty of flat top batteries that will fit the FW3A even ‘if’ no button tops fit at all. Beer

KB1428 “Live Life WOT

Yoav.Klein
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Hi,

Please sign me up for one more light (for a total of 3 flashlights).

Thanks!

DavidEF
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raccoon city wrote:

teacher wrote:

So, in summary; there are plenty of flat top batteries that will fit the FW3A even ‘if’ no button tops fit at all. Beer


Now I don’t feel so bad about buying flat top 18650 cells!  ;)


I wanted button tops, but couldn’t find any for the cells I wanted.


MOST Flat-top cells will work for MOST lights that claim to require button-top cells, if you put a blob of solder on the top of the flat cell top so it can stick above the wrapper. Wink

disclaimer: I can’t prove this. I just think it’s true. (and it probably is) YMMV Innocent

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teacher wrote:
From my highly non-technical & less than scientific research Hat , my predictions for FW3A Battery Fitment are…..
  • Most all 18650 Flat Tops will work.

  • Most 18650 Button Tops will (most likely) not work. This will depend entirely on the height of the 'Button Top' installed on the cell... but it ain't looking good for "button tops".. . Wink

Why make assumptions when Toykeeper has already said the FW3A was designed to fit both flat top and button top?

I think 66mm is the “safe” number so as to assure fitment, but I bet it will fit slightly longer cells. Not 69mm-70mm protected cells, though.

I’m sure we’ll hear more about what fits and what doesn’t fit later on..

alexirc
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I’m interested! Looks like a great EDC.

raccoon city
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DavidEF wrote:

MOST Flat-top cells will work for MOST lights that claim to require button-top cells, if you put a blob of solder on the top of the flat cell top so it can stick above the wrapper. Wink

disclaimer: I can’t prove this. I just think it’s true. (and it probably is) YMMV Innocent

I've heard that as well.

Maybe I should put disclaimer in my signature that says I'm not a modder, and I do not solder.

Firelight2
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raccoon city wrote:

...Maybe I should put disclaimer in my signature that says I'm not a modder, and I do not solder.

There's something special about having an $8 flashlight that you modded with $80 in aftermarket parts.

It's never too late to start modding! tongue-outlaughingtongue-out

 

ToyKeeper
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I’m hoping it’ll fit button-top cells, at least. Earlier prototypes did.

I’m also hoping things will happen quickly. But I’m hearing that LH351D may be delayed longer than expected, because they were apparently not ordered back in December when I thought they were. And it sounds like there’s some sort of difficulty in getting them. So I’m kind of wondering if it would make more sense to use SST-20 instead.

I know it has come up before, which is why I mention it, but what do people think of the idea?

Here’s a very brief summary of the biggest differences:

  • LH351D has a wider, flatter, floodier beam. Probably more lumens.
  • SST-20 has a narrower, throwier beam. Illuminates farther away.

Both can still have hit-or-miss tints depending on the exact bin used.

To be clear, XP-L HI 3D is still a “yes”. If I understand correctly, XP-L HI should be able to go to production as soon as the driver fit issue is worked out. The question is only about the LH351D version.

teacher
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JasonWW wrote:
teacher wrote:
From my highly non-technical & less than scientific research Hat , my predictions for FW3A Battery Fitment are…..
  • Most all 18650 Flat Tops will work.

  • Most 18650 Button Tops will (most likely) not work. This will depend entirely on the height of the 'Button Top' installed on the cell... but it ain't looking good for "button tops".. . Wink
Why make assumptions when Toykeeper has already said the FW3A was designed to fit both flat top and button top?

I think 66mm is the “safe” number so as to assure fitment, but I bet it will fit slightly longer cells. Not 69mm-70mm protected cells, though.

I’m sure we’ll hear more about what fits and what doesn’t fit later on..

I’m not making any “assumptions” at all. You left out, in your quote; the part that qualified what I wrote. Facepalm

“These findings are based on the stated Maximum battery length of 66mm for the FW3A.”

Yet you say…. “I think 66mm is the “safe” number so as to assure fitment, but I bet it will fit slightly longer cells.”

Sooo….. which of us is speculating & making assumptions??

I’ll take your bet too, if we can agree on an ‘upper limit’ of length. Wink

It may very well take a bit longer battery/cell. But what I wrote was simply written based on the stated maximum length of 66mm for the FW3A.

Personally, I don’t care either way. But I thought someone might find the data useful. Maybe they will, maybe they won’t.

teacher wrote:
From my highly non-technical & less than scientific research Hat , my predictions for FW3A Battery Fitment are…..
  • Most all 18650 Flat Tops will work.

  • Most 18650 Button Tops will (most likely) not work. This will depend entirely on the height of the 'Button Top' installed on the cell... but it ain't looking good for "button tops".. . Wink

These findings are based on the stated Maximum battery length of 66mm for the FW3A. Thumbs Up

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

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oweban
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My vote is wait on LH351D, so people have the option of throw or flood.

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Firelight2 wrote:

raccoon city wrote:

...Maybe I should put disclaimer in my signature that says I'm not a modder, and I do not solder.

There's something special about having an $8 flashlight that you modded with $80 in aftermarket parts.

It's never too late to start modding! tongue-outlaughingtongue-out 

Yea, my $11 ZY-T11 clone quad mod:

    - quad MCPCB from MtnE, quad 10621 optic (MtnE I think), 4 LH351D's from MtnE, alum S2+ spacer sanded down, 2 brass screws

    - CK OSHPark driver, Blue BeCu spring, SMD parts, wires

    - UCL lens

    - light pipe from DigiKey, switch from Digikey/Mouser

    - ohh, and can't forget one copper penny, ~1978

 

Just shipping alone? Yikes! Makes you wonder...

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I would, of course, want the XP-L version as soon as it can be done. Next, i would say do the SST-20, if it can be done sooner. Then, do the LH351D, when the good tint emitters are available. I think a lot of people would really like the SST-20, and probably plan to make that swap anyway. I would personally get one of all three, and then a second one of whichever I like best.

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Firelight2 wrote:
It’s never too late to start modding spending lots of money in flashlights that may go from junk to jewels, or spending lots of money in pieces and tools when you could be buying new flashlights!

I fixed it for you Firelight Big Smile Innocent

EDIT: what Tom E said Big Smile

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teacher wrote:

Personally, I don’t care either way, but I thought someone might find the data useful. Maybe they will, maybe they won’t.

It might be misleading.

I’d wait till later.

ToyKeeper
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oweban wrote:
My vote is wait on LH351D, so people have the option of throw or flood.

True. Though in this case it’s more like “flood or … more flood”. And if that’s still not enough flood, there are two levels of even floodier frosted optics which can be used.

teacher
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JasonWW wrote:
teacher wrote:

Personally, I don’t care either way, but I thought someone might find the data useful. Maybe they will, maybe they won’t.
It might be misleading.
Not for anyone who reads fairly well.

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

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oweban
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ToyKeeper wrote:
oweban wrote:
My vote is wait on LH351D, so people have the option of throw or flood.

True. Though in this case it’s more like “flood or … more flood”. And if that’s still not enough flood, there are two levels of even floodier frosted optics which can be used.

Also very true! SST20 with frosted optics could fit the bill nicely, and is quite quick and easy to swap out.

(that said, it won’t affect me as I’ll be going HI; 4000K is too warm for me Sad )

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ToyKeeper wrote:
I’m hoping it’ll fit button-top cells, at least. Earlier prototypes did.

I’m also hoping things will happen quickly. But I’m hearing that LH351D may be delayed longer than expected, because they were apparently not ordered back in December when I thought they were. And it sounds like there’s some sort of difficulty in getting them. So I’m kind of wondering if it would make more sense to use SST-20 instead.

I know it has come up before, which is why I mention it, but what do people think of the idea?

Here’s a very brief summary of the biggest differences:

  • LH351D has a wider, flatter, floodier beam. Probably more lumens.
  • SST-20 has a narrower, throwier beam. Illuminates farther away.

Both can still have hit-or-miss tints depending on the exact bin used.

To be clear, XP-L HI 3D is still a “yes”. If I understand correctly, XP-L HI should be able to go to production as soon as the driver fit issue is worked out. The question is only about the LH351D version.

I’d buy an sst20 version, if its a good tint.

cabfrank
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As said above, there isn’t really going to a throw/flood option, they are all “floody”. I think the SST-20 would be a great option. I honestly might even prefer it to the LD, depending on how much lumen difference there will be.

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hoping to receive it by Christmas -

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saypat wrote:
hoping to receive it by Christmas -

2019 or 2020? Big Smile

KB1428 “Live Life WOT

teacher
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Ouch….. FacepalmBig Smile

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

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BlueSwordM
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Same thing here.

Doesn’t really matter if it’s using an SST-20 setup, or an LH351D setup.

In a light with such small TIR optics, more throw is always beneficial, so an SST-20 option would be great, especially since it has even better R9 in the CRI spectrum.

I do prefer using the LH351D in lights like the BLF Q8, but for the FW3A?

Full on SST-20 4000k 95CRI.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
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KawiBoy1428 wrote:
saypat wrote:
hoping to receive it by Christmas -
2019 or 2020? Big Smile

Free Beer tomorrow !!

Im not a Pessimist …. just an Optimist with a lot of experience

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ToyKeeper wrote:
I’m hoping it’ll fit button-top cells, at least. Earlier prototypes did.

I’m also hoping things will happen quickly. But I’m hearing that LH351D may be delayed longer than expected, because they were apparently not ordered back in December when I thought they were. And it sounds like there’s some sort of difficulty in getting them. So I’m kind of wondering if it would make more sense to use SST-20 instead.

I know it has come up before, which is why I mention it, but what do people think of the idea?

Here’s a very brief summary of the biggest differences:

  • LH351D has a wider, flatter, floodier beam. Probably more lumens.
  • SST-20 has a narrower, throwier beam. Illuminates farther away.

Both can still have hit-or-miss tints depending on the exact bin used.

To be clear, XP-L HI 3D is still a “yes”. If I understand correctly, XP-L HI should be able to go to production as soon as the driver fit issue is worked out. The question is only about the LH351D version.

After hearing your comments on LH351D’s beam profile in a TIR triple/quad, and now seeing plenty of beamshots of them… SST-20 all the way.

If people want more flood a wider TIR optic is easily available, or they can just use DC Fix/scotch tape like many of us do for lights already.

Firelight2
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Agreed.

It’s all a matter of personal taste. But I find that LH351D is just a bit too floody for me. I much prefer the extra punch of XPL HI or SST 20.

I expect when I get my FW3A I’ll probably swap out the emitters for XPL HI (probably two 5000K and one 4000K) and the optic to 10507.

SST 20 is nice, but I find it looks a bit too green-tinged. Also compared to XPL HI, SST 20 with its lower Vf it draws more current which causes the head to heat up faster resulting in the driver ramping down output faster.

ToyKeeper
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Firelight2 wrote:
XPL HI (probably two 5000K and one 4000K) and the optic to 10507.

That’ll produce a pretty strange beam pattern. XP-L HI + 10507 tends to have fairly visible artifacts, and you’d be getting artifacts in two different colors.

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ToyKeeper wrote:
Firelight2 wrote:
XPL HI (probably two 5000K and one 4000K) and the optic to 10507.

That’ll produce a pretty strange beam pattern. XP-L HI + 10507 tends to have fairly visible artifacts, and you’d be getting artifacts in two different colors.


That might be exactly what he’s going for. Look at his username. Maybe he’s going to run it on candle mode and watch the artifacts flicker all over the place. Party

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funkychateau
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BurningPlayd0h][quote=funkychateau][quote=teacher wrote:
funkychateau wrote:
Nothing to lose by doing that.

Its a balancing act between fitting shorter cells (how they were designed and sold by the original manufacturers) or longer button-top/protected cells. You always sacrifice some fit on one end of the spectrum for more on the other.

No need to consider protected cells, just unprotected button- and flat-tops. It seems that this model has limited its ability to accommodate a range of cells by using a short set of springs. Resistance shouldn’t be the reason – this light should draw substantially less current than the Emisar D4, which accommodates both flat- and button-top cells pretty well.

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