[Review] 77 Outdoors D25 Headlamp (18650)

150 posts / 0 new
Last post
gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 13 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 1678
Location: Central IL

I just measured the reflectors: 15.9mm wide by 7.0mm tall. I haven’t shopped for TIRs much. Is something close to that available?

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY

I tried a few more times, lot more force in a wood lined vise and nothing. Almost broke my best needlenose, and I got an adjustable spanner tool - bent the points on it, then sanded the off to get a better fit in the holes, got plenty of leverage and only accomplished some deep scratches off the holes. Mine seems to be sealed solidly, but it's still fine to use as-is.

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 13 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 1678
Location: Central IL
Crying
Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 24 min ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 9426
Location: nyc
gchart wrote:
I just measured the reflectors: 15.9mm wide by 7.0mm tall. I haven’t shopped for TIRs much. Is something close to that available?

Stock “20mm” TIRs sometimes actually run about 21mm. I’ve only really seen 20mm and 26mm (barring triples/quads), but someone mentioned another light that took smaller TIRs.

I wonder if boring out the bezel a coupla mm would let regular TIRs fit…

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 24 min ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 9426
Location: nyc

Well here ya go…

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5050-LED-Lens-Diameter-17mm-45-degrees-CREE-XML-T5-T6-U2-Lens-XLamp-XM-L/2035917021.html

Little doodads around the periphery and at the pointy end, can probably be shaved down a bit to fit the bezel nicely.

7bux (+3bux shipping) for a 20pak. Gee, that’s enough for 10 headlamps…

Eh, wotdahell. Ordered a pak of the 60s…

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 13 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 1678
Location: Central IL

I was actually glancing at those. I think the diameter will be fine with a little sanding, but I’m concerned with the height. I’m curious to see what comes of them. Let us know (in a month or so!)

Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 24 min ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 9426
Location: nyc

Wellp, with TIRs in there, I ain’t gonna need the front glass, so that’s at least a mm gone. I figure it should fit as-is for the most part.

Worst case, lap the living Hell out of the back of the replacement mcpcbs.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

D25 is not as good for modding as D10: non standard, hard to remove led plate; non standard lenses, plastic bezel and you have to buy 2x leds and lenses instead off 1 like in D10. In my practical use D10 is getting to hot already on 1A, witch is no good , because, it overheats lithium battery! I’m pretty sure, D25 with 2 leds will overheat even faster so. D10 & D25 have cooling ribs inside battery tube Facepalm

everydaysurvivalgear
everydaysurvivalgear's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 11 min ago
Joined: 07/31/2015 - 10:25
Posts: 3460
Location: sydney australia (GMT+10)

Good review mate!

My story i bought one of these a few months ago and i ordered the 2 XML option of course more LEDs = more power lol. They sent the single LED option of course lol. So i argued with Aliexpress and i got $11 AUD back from the $20 AUD i spent probably the best $9 AUD light ever lol.

Its built well and the stock driver is on the better side for a headlamp and stock it is plenty bright for a headlamp i wanted your edition the double LED to make one side red and one normal output for fishing but oh well. Ill probably buy another i think.

Now i lost it i don’t know where and how but its gone i think my niece moved when she was playing with my lights. I am planning when or if i find it to put a new driver in it with the 3v XHP50.2. Probably need to hire Liam Neeson to find it lol.

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT
Tom E wrote:

I tried a few more times, lot more force in a wood lined vise and nothing. Almost broke my best needlenose, and I got an adjustable spanner tool – bent the points on it, then sanded the off to get a better fit in the holes, got plenty of leverage and only accomplished some deep scratches off the holes. Mine seems to be sealed solidly, but it’s still fine to use as-is.

It opens clockwise…

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY

wut? Back in post #23 it says CCW - could there be 2 types?

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

I have 2 D10, date on boxes 2018-11-19 and 2018-12-01 , both opens clockwise, should be same on D25, no? Manufacturer definitely is the same.

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY
Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

Unscrewed mine and find out that copper ring on 17mm driver is almost broke off. Facepalm I need another solution and it will be not cheap one, because there is no onesided programmable drivers on the market.. there is no cheap dedicated and efficient, low current (1-1.5A), drivers for L shaped headlamps like H03 or H30 Sad

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY

Boy, wish I could get my open and see - I do lots of OSHPark ATtiny85 based one sided drivers, accept for the batt+ contact area of course.

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

Man.. Just turn hard clockwise and don’t mind scratches…

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY

Quadrupel wrote:
Man.. Just turn hard clockwise and don't mind scratches...

Yea, that's the plan for this eve - 10 hrs or so from now... I'll clamp it up and use my newly tweaked spanner tool.

This is the kind of tool I have/used: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DSLR-Lens-Spanner-Wrench-Opening-Tool-Stainless-Steel-For-Camera-Repair-open-Tools-Kit/32750613438.html

 

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

This worked for me
!IMG-20190306-170010!

Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 24 min ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 9426
Location: nyc

I got a set of these

from Amazon a ways back, but they’re now like twice the price.

Goggle “tekton snap ring pliers”.

Set of 4: all 4 combos of bent/straight, spring-open/spring-closed.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 13 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 1678
Location: Central IL

Tom E wrote:

wut? Back in post #23 it says CCW – could there be 2 types?


As I laid in bed trying to sleep last night, I realized that I lied Sad I usually talk about this in terms of normal vs reverse threaded. These are reverse threaded… so they unscrew going clockwise Facepalm
Quadrupel wrote:
D25 is not as good for modding as D10: non standard, hard to remove led plate; non standard lenses, plastic bezel and you have to buy 2x leds and lenses instead off 1 like in D10. In my practical use D10 is getting to hot already on 1A, witch is no good , because, it overheats lithium battery! I’m pretty sure, D25 with 2 leds will overheat even faster so. D10 & D25 have cooling ribs inside battery tube Facepalm

I agree, I think I would have liked the D10 better due to increased mod-ability. Those internal “cooling ribs” are actually channels for the LED wires to run through without interfering with the battery. I doubt they’re intended for cooling, but I’ve been known to be wrong on occasion. Big Smile
Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY

No prob. I tried reversed early on, but I probably already had tightened it up, so didn't try hard enough.

Edit: took all of 2 secs to loosen the end cap now - CW, reverse, etc. smile.

So I see the driver and the issues - tight space, plastic ring it fits in, switch on the back side.

Looked carefully at it - probable a PIC, SOIC-8, Vcc on pin #1, switch on pin #2, FETs on pin #4, and GRND on pin #8. And that seems to be it. The FETs are two in parallel, 3 pins, output goes thru a bank of parallel current limiting resistors.

So, 4 wires, that's all. I'm thinking of removing the MCU, using an 85 in it's place and hand wiring up the 4 pins needed. Should be enough spare room on the driver. Dunno how well it will work. I'll probably replace the 'D1' diode they have with a 4.7 ohm resistor which the 85 typically needs.

These are the tools I used/tried:

It lives in pieces!

The driver:

The (my fault) damage:

 

I'll sand down the end cap to bare - should mostly hide the scratches, not too concerned about them - this light will get used.

NarsilM has one channel support, so should work - might jumper the resistor bank though for more power, or leave as is since normally I don't need power so the lower the max amps, the more efficient it should be.

 This pic datasheet on page 4 shows the pins where Vcc and Vss are: https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/268/PIC16(L)F1831318323

 

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

This driver is total crap . Zero stabilization , output depends on voltage: 4.2v- 2A, but on 3.8v output already dropped to 1,4A. And it overheating fast and dropping output even more to 1A and keeps dropping …to 0,7A! Facepalm Its real 10$ hi tech Big Smile I never stop wondering why Chinese engineers cant use few AMC7135…

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 42 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 12248
Location: LI NY

Hhmm - the current limiting resistors can't help but maybe those parallel FET's are pretty bad then. Maybe the cost issue of the FET's because our good FET's are not cheap even in China, in fact they are almost all counterfeit there because of the high cost.

They probably have a cost cap for the driver, probably about $1 - $1.50

I may have to re-plan this - try to get a stock OSHPark driver in there. 7135's would be great - don't need hi power, better regulation, but not sure.

pc_light
pc_light's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 min ago
Joined: 03/24/2017 - 16:19
Posts: 314
Location: United States
Tom E wrote:
… I’m thinking of removing the MCU, using an 85 in it’s place and hand wiring up the 4 pins needed. Should be enough spare room on the driver. Dunno how well it will work. I’ll probably replace the ‘D1’ diode they have with a 4.7 ohm resistor which the 85 typically needs…

@Tom E, that’s inspirational. More details with progress, please.

Seeking the light.

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 13 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 1678
Location: Central IL

Well… thermal control is working, but appears to be a bit conservative. The body stayed at 45°C (113°F) throughout the run. I think I need to kick that up a notch and hopefully avoid the initial big drop. I will say that when I ran this test with the stock D25, it got hot! I need to find the middle ground. Thoughts on an ideal temp?

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

45C looks good. Do we need 1000lm in headlamp? I think more important thing is long run time and stabilization of modes.

…where Frugal meets with Flashlight! Big Smile

skinny_tie
skinny_tie's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 16 hours ago
Joined: 09/23/2017 - 03:14
Posts: 332
Location: Australia
gchart wrote:
Thanks guys! Oh, and if anyone isn’t up for flashing the firmware but is interested in doing this with their D25, I might be able to send a pre-flashed attiny412 to drop in (once I get the temp calibration straightened up… we’ll see how that goes though, because this thing doesn’t have a very good thermal path to the driver).

If you decide to sell pre-flashed MCUs I’d be interested in a couple.

sochi111
sochi111's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 10 hours ago
Joined: 02/21/2017 - 14:59
Posts: 179

Quadrupel wrote:
45C looks good. Do we need 1000lm in headlamp? I think more important thing is long run time and stabilization of modes.

…where Frugal meets with Flashlight! Big Smile

I think 1000LM would be great for the outdoors, personally I can never get enough light in the dark.

Quadrupel
Quadrupel's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 13 hours ago
Joined: 12/03/2017 - 10:40
Posts: 97
Location: LT

Yes . 5000lm would be great even more . But first of all you have to understand technical parameters like heat dissipation. This tiny body can not handle more than 1A. 1A is about 300lm of warm 3000k HI-CRI light. And if you need more throw , you can always use narrow angle optics

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 13 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 1678
Location: Central IL

Ok, another thermal runtime test. The previous one had the temp limit set to 60°C, resulting in a body temp of 45°C. I’m guessing this is due to the poor thermal path from the driver to the body. I had calibrated the MCU’s thermal equation using room temp (21°C) and my oven at 85°C. I ran another test with the temp limit set to 70°C, which resulted in a stabilized body temp of 53°C – definitely hot, but not scalding. Here’s what the resulting graph looks like. BTW, it takes the about 12 minutes for the body temp to reach it’s max and stabilize.

I’m curious about turning off thermal management to simulate the stock driver and take temperature readings since I didn’t do that initially.

Pages