blue light associated with prostate and breast cancer

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clemence
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I’m more concerning about the excessive light we continuously put outside our “caves”. Human evolved with day time/night time cycle. Face it, we’re currently in the progress of day time/not-so-dark night cycle evolution. It’s impossible to get back to the stone age. Let the science and technology slowly find the answer. In the meantime you can try your best to minimize the harmful effect (if there’s any) in sensible and practical ways.

I myself don’t have any problem sleeping/trying to sleep under any light source. The problem is when I wake up, CW hurts my eyes more than warm white.

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/68002

[Clemence]

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Life itself is deadly, everything can kill you, eventually.

I’ll be BBQing tomorrow.

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jon_slider wrote:

so, do you have any quantifyable blue light levels data for
an Incandescent, and the
sw45k N219b 9080, and the
sw35 9080, and the
E21a 3000k, and the
Optisolis 6500k (I expect this one is best used as a worklight, when staying awake is desireable)

fwiw, my computer and iPhone have NightShift enabled, and my house lights are incandescent

I don’t have an incandescent to test but I tested a heat lamp with 100CRI and almost no blue light and 0.000 DUV at 2800K. I think incandescent is similar.

SW45K 219B 9080 has very high blue light intensity. I can’t find a 70CRI 4500K to compare with at the moment but it is definitely not a light to shine directly in your eyes.

I haven’t tried the SW35 yet. I haven’t tried Optisolis 6500K. I never go above 5000K unless it is for a pure thrower. I measured sunlight from 3000K to 5700K depending on time of day. Cloudy day can be 6000K+ but I prefer sunlight over cloudy day.

E21A, 2070K, 95.5 CRI, blue peak intensity of 0.07
E21A, 3061K, 96.2 CRI, blue peak intensity of 0.45
E21A 2×2000K and 2×4000K, 2828K, 94.5 CRI, peak intensity of 0.40
The SST-20, 2910K, 96.9CRI has a blue peak intensity of 0.38
The XP-L2 HD V4 7A, 3168K, 72.1 CRI, blue peak intensity of 0.76 and a DUV of -0.0029 (tint is real good btw).
XP-L HD, 2958K, 70.1 CRI, blue peak intensity of 0.39
XP-E HEW Q3 7A2, 3311K, CRI 89.8, blue peak intensity of 0.57
Nichia 219B 3000K 9080, 3391K, CRI 95.2, blue peak intensity of 0.57
Yuji, 3191K, CRI 96.6, blue peak intensity of 0.060
Optisolis 2700K, measures 2973K, CRI 97.5, blue peak intensity of 0.41
Oslon Square 92 CRI 6X tint, 2746K, CRI 91.3, blue peak intensity of 0.29
Oslon Square 96 CRI 6U tint, 2831K, CRI 95.9, blue peak intensity of 0.26
Oslon Square 92 CRI 5Q tint, 3346K, CRI 94.9, blue peak intensity of 0.61

It’s real hard to quantify blue light. The blue peak intensity above is relative to the rest of the spectrum for that emitter. The actual amount depends on the lumen output also. In order to get a good comparison of blue wavelength, you would have to overlay the graphs, which is too difficult and too much work to do. However, I think the blue peak intensity is a pretty good indicator of how much blue wavelengths is emitted by the emitter for these warm white CCTs.

hank
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If you want to experiment, visit a professional photography or theater lighting store that carries colored filter sheet material.
20 × 24 inches, sheet costs about $7ish. Pricier from Amazon etc.
https://us.rosco.com/en/products/catalog/filters-diffusions

Ask for a little sampler pack, often given free, with strips of all colors, big enough to cover a 20mm flashlight lens.
You can see the transmission spectrum for each filter type too.

I have a sheet of this one taped so I can flip it over the computer screen in the evening:

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Nobody has suggested just dimming your lights to reduce the blue? I have trouble falling asleep, and recently installed some very dim indirect lighting and began dimming my monitor’s back-light to minimum at night. It has definitely helped. Same ratio of colors, just far less of everything, including blue.

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Here’s a comparison of the effect on melatonin of ordinary room light (less than 200 lux) compared to dim (less than 3 lux) light:

J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2011 Mar; 96(3): E463–E472.
Published online 2010 Dec 30. doi: 10.1210/jc.2010-2098
PMCID: PMC3047226
PMID: 21193540
Exposure to Room Light before Bedtime Suppresses Melatonin Onset and Shortens Melatonin Duration in Humans

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3047226/

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pinkpanda3310 wrote:
More likely the lack of exercise is the reason which totally gets ignored because it’s too hard.

FYI that’s completely untrue. Reducing caloric intake by even a small amount is equivalent to a huge amount of exercise.

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Tally-ho wrote:
bob_mcbob tested the Nichia 219B in a FW3A, if you look at his TM-30 tests you will see that it has a blue spike.

Here’s the spectrum plot for that light at the ramp ceiling.

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pinkpanda3310 wrote:
who is going to change their lifestyle because of the Blue Light Fear . Turn the house lights down dim in the evenings and don’t look at screens 2-3hrs before sleep.

EDIT- Looking at my last sentence makes me wonder if that has anything to do with the world population growth rate slowing down

I think youre on to something, blue light associated with reduced sex drive.. LOL!

or, am I reading something into it that was not there?

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BurningPlayd0h wrote:
pinkpanda3310 wrote:
More likely the lack of exercise is the reason which totally gets ignored because it’s too hard.

FYI that’s completely untrue. Reducing caloric intake by even a small amount is equivalent to a huge amount of exercise.


You’re missing the point I was trying to make. Let’s delete the exercise part of what I wrote (because obviously it’s too hard Facepalm ) If one is overweight and consuming too much are you going to entirely blame it on the occasional burger and chips???

jon_slider wrote:

… or, am I reading something into it that was not there?

Nope Wink

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BurningPlayd0h wrote:
pinkpanda3310 wrote:
More likely the lack of exercise is the reason which totally gets ignored because it’s too hard.
FYI that’s completely untrue. Reducing caloric intake by even a small amount is equivalent to a huge amount of exercise.
Please clarify. Are you referring to this in relation to losing weight??

Because as far as I know “reducing caloric intake” has no effect on building cardio strength or the other benefits of exercise.

TIA

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https://www.mhealthtalk.com/how-light-affects-melatonin-and-sleep/

How Light effects Melatonin and Sleep
Posted by Wayne Caswell

You heard me mention color temperature before, and the effect of watching TV or reading on the iPad before bed (See Sleepy Yet? — How Light from Electronics Effects Sleep), but here’s why it’s important.

This WebMD article examines the hormone melatonin, which helps regulate sleep & wake cycles (the circadian clock). Melatonin production in the body is triggered by darkness and inhibited by light, and that explains why we have trouble with jet lag, shift work, and winter months with fewer daylight hours.

This Wikipedia article describes light therapy and melatonin supplements as treatment for sleep disorders like insomnia. It also describes the light color temperature, from the warm yellow of incandescent light bulbs, to blue light of the new fluorescent and LED bulbs, or the bluish tint of the iPad and TV screens.

One way to fool the body into producing melatonin earlier so you can go to sleep earlier is to select warm-color light bulbs and have them dimmed in the evening. Another way is to wear DARK AMBER or ORANGE sunglasses in the evening to block blue light (short light wavelengths). And of course, that’s why sleep experts advise against using a computer or watching TV shortly before bed.

Because my wife and I often watch TV immediately before bed, and she likes to look at videos of our granddaughter on her iPad then, I checked the iPad Settings and found a way to dim the backlighting intensity and set it to somewhat adjust automatically depending on the ambient light. Go to Settings / Brightness & Wallpaper.

I’d also like the iPad to change the color temperature at night but found nothing native in the iPad, so I searched for a reliable iPad app for that. I found iJetlag and TheSleepApp but was disappointed with both of them. One even used the wrong color of light to encourage melatonin production and encourage sleep.

Additional sources of sleep information include the two articles on this site by PhD sleep consultant Bruce Meleski (Sleep Balance – Your Path to Better Sleep and Brain Entrainment for Better Sleep and Health) and in Jeanie Wolfson’s article on Sleep: Timing of Melatonin, Light, Dark, & Use of Other Aids. Wolfson lists many suggestions for improving sleep, including these few:

  • Keep bedroom dark or wear an eye mask.
  • Keep room cool and feet warm.
  • Find a mattress that works for you, trying harder, softer, coil, foam, gel, waterbed, or hammock.
  • Block distracting sounds with white noise.
  • Use lighting controls to simulate dawn before alarm sounds.
  • Don’t watch TV, use a computer, or do homework within an hour of going to bed.
  • Avoid caffeine and snacks that can cause a blood-sugar drop during the night.
  • Establish a strict sleep/wake schedule.
  • Exercise regularly.

………

My take is some magical CCT of light is not the magic bullet that fixes it all. Light, any light; hinders melatonin production. Darkness promotes melatonin production.

This could be ‘scientifically’ discussed & analyzed probably forever.

But for those of us who are not really that ‘scientific’ maybe there is another way.

  • Get plenty of light in the daytime. [or ‘your’ daytime if shift working]
  • Get some type of exercise.
  • Sleep in a DARK place.
  • Anything else that ‘works for you’.

Yeah, that is simple & not real exciting…. but it has been working for ages.

ymmv

edits for spelling corrections

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Tally-ho wrote:
Scallywag wrote:

My understanding is that blue light specifically is the type of light that impacts the sleep cycle, as opposed to red or green. And for this reason, warmer/cooler CCT lights have different effects. I’ve easily observed this in my own life: one room of my house has 2700K lighting, and I will fall asleep if I try to read a book in that room. The other areas of my home have 4000K to 5000K lighting, and I have no issues reading and staying awake there. 

Yes, this is a known effect which is measured and light sources can be ranked by impact on ipRGC (melanopic function). See below a list of light sources with different CCT, blue %age and their relative melanopic potential : (Source)

Thanks for this post.

It’s interesting to see moonlight mentioned. Would this explain full moon associated disorders?
I’ve long been trying to sort out what is ‘real’ and what is just popular belief on that matter without much success.

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patmurris wrote:

It’s interesting to see moonlight mentioned. Would this explain full moon associated disorders?

Hehe now you know where the word ‘lunatic’ comes from

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Blue Light Is Not the Only Culprit It Seems… Sad
.

.

.
Part of the problem…

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So….as I said (somewhere). The root of the problem is all the artificial lights we created, NOT only the blue light.
Use just enough light at night, sleep in the dark, limit night gadgeting.

I’ve seen many under developed villages in my country. Almost complete darkness in the whole village from 18:00 o’clock, no other than wood/kerosene fire at night. When it’s dark they stop their outside activities, sleeping or making babies. Yet their average life expectancy is below 50 y.o. Much lower than in the Canada or US, countries with almost no dark nights. There are more important factors outside blue light hazard.

What’s more concerning is the lights we created outside our buildings. Those light ruin our non human brother and sister.

[Clemence]

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clemence wrote:
So….as I said (somewhere). The root of the problem is all the artificial lights we created, NOT only the blue light.
Use just enough light at night, sleep in the dark, limit night gadgeting.

I’ve seen many under developed villages in my country. Almost complete darkness in the whole village from 18:00 o’clock, no other than wood/kerosene fire at night. When it’s dark they stop their outside activities, sleeping or making babies. Yet their average life expectancy is below 50 y.o. Much lower than in the Canada or US, countries with almost no dark nights. There are more important factors outside blue light hazard.

What’s more concerning is the lights we created outside our buildings. Those light ruin our non human brother and sister.

[Clemence]

Personally, I agree with you completely. Thumbs Up

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Tally-ho wrote:
Yes, this is a known effect which is measured and light sources can be ranked by impact on ipRGC (melanopic function). See below a list of light sources with different CCT, blue %age and their relative melanopic potential : !{width:100%}https://i.imgur.com/9gCxXFX.jpg! ("Source":https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2016/11/f34/royer_spectral-power...)

Thanks for that chart!

As for the rest of the thread:

Avoid blue light when you go to bed, for a while before bed, and during your "night". Like I said, I have blackout curtains, so despite living near a very brightly, LED-lit area that would otherwise significantly intrude into my home, I receive nearly zero outside light at night.

 

The biggest thing people should take away from this isn't blue light, but sleep. Sleep is incredibly important, and having a good sleep cycle is critical for your health. Not getting enough good sleep will affect you long-term. There's a lot of studies to support that in a lot of different ways.

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Scallywag wrote:

Tally-ho wrote:
Yes, this is a known effect which is measured and light sources can be ranked by impact on ipRGC (melanopic function). See below a list of light sources with different CCT, blue %age and their relative melanopic potential : (Source)

Thanks for that chart!


As for the rest of the thread:


Avoid blue light when you go to bed, for a while before bed, and during your “night”. Like I said, I have blackout curtains, so despite living near a very brightly, LED-lit area that would otherwise significantly intrude into my home, I receive nearly zero outside light at night.


 


The biggest thing people should take away from this isn’t blue light, but sleep. Sleep is incredibly important, and having a good sleep cycle is critical for your health. Not getting enough good sleep will affect you long-term. There’s a lot of studies to support that in a lot of different ways.

Agree! Without proper sleep you don’t have time to regenerate your broken cells. I wish I could also regenerate my telomeres

[Clemence]

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clemence wrote:
Scallywag wrote:

The biggest thing people should take away from this isn’t blue light, but sleep. Sleep is incredibly important, and having a good sleep cycle is critical for your health. Not getting enough good sleep will affect you long-term. There’s a lot of studies to support that in a lot of different ways.
Agree! Without proper sleep you don’t have time to regenerate your broken cells. I wish I could also regenerate my telomeres

[Clemence]

+1 . Quality sleep is essential! . Thumbs Up

As far as “telomeres” go, check out the article below. You probably already know all this….. but it sure can’t hurt. Smile

How to Lengthen Your Telomeres & Unlock the Key to Longevity

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Thanks, yup I knew most of the practices but still a useful link for easy sharing

[Clemence]

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clemence wrote:
Thanks, yup I knew most of the practices but still a useful link for easy sharing

[Clemence]

Your welcome. Smile

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

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To quote the web page of “Doctor” (not a MD) Axe :

Quote:
All readers/viewers of this content are advised to consult their doctors or qualified health professionals regarding specific health questions.

And an earlier caution:

Quote:
Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint.

— Mark Twain

Or you may die of alternative medical facts, as Steve Jobs did recently.

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Kinda like reading much of the mumbo jumbo in this thread……

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

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teacher wrote:
BurningPlayd0h wrote:
pinkpanda3310 wrote:
More likely the lack of exercise is the reason which totally gets ignored because it’s too hard.
FYI that’s completely untrue. Reducing caloric intake by even a small amount is equivalent to a huge amount of exercise.
Please clarify. Are you referring to this in relation to losing weight??

Because as far as I know “reducing caloric intake” has no effect on building cardio strength or the other benefits of exercise.

TIA

Yup, I just meant as far as excess fat gain/loss. Not being obese/overweight has it’s own intrinsic health benefits, especially cardiovascular too of course. It takes FAR less time and effort to get enough exercise for those other benefits than it does for weight loss as well: “It is recommended that you exercise within 55 to 85 percent of your maximum heart rate for at least 20 to 30 minutes to get the best results from aerobic exercise.” Burning a decent amount of calories could take MUCH longer depending on the form of exercise.

pinkpanda3310 wrote:
BurningPlayd0h wrote:
pinkpanda3310 wrote:
More likely the lack of exercise is the reason which totally gets ignored because it’s too hard.

FYI that’s completely untrue. Reducing caloric intake by even a small amount is equivalent to a huge amount of exercise.


You’re missing the point I was trying to make. Let’s delete the exercise part of what I wrote (because obviously it’s too hard Facepalm ) If one *is overweight and consuming too much *are you going to entirely blame it on the occasional burger and chips???
jon_slider wrote:
… or, am I reading something into it that was not there?
Nope Wink

If you’re consuming too many daily calories a “occasional burger and chips” ISN’T occasional, that’s the whole point. Your caloric intake is higher than what you burn during the day. It is true that a single meal, or even a few days worth of eating won’t cause huge changes for any person of decent health though.

What I was getting at is a very small calorie intake can defeat the weight loss benefits of a looootttt of exercise. It takes a huge amount of time and effort to burn calories, and if you are having a daily calorie surplus no amount of exercise will prevent weight gain or lead to weight loss. You’re quite simply putting in more than you’re using. 10 – 2 + 3 = 11

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Facepalm Facepalm

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teacher wrote:
clemence wrote:
Scallywag wrote:

The biggest thing people should take away from this isn’t blue light, but sleep. Sleep is incredibly important, and having a good sleep cycle is critical for your health. Not getting enough good sleep will affect you long-term. There’s a lot of studies to support that in a lot of different ways.
Agree! Without proper sleep you don’t have time to regenerate your broken cells. I wish I could also regenerate my telomeres

[Clemence]

+1 . Quality sleep is essential! . Thumbs Up

As far as “telomeres” go, check out the article below. You probably already know all this….. but it sure can’t hurt. Smile

How to Lengthen Your Telomeres & Unlock the Key to Longevity

For sure Neutral and cool white Leds are responsable for melatonine supression and wake up more than others lights types.They should be ban on night.
It’ very bad for healt alter byorithms.There not be any artificial light after Sunset for a good sleep,just Orange monochrome are more tollerate.But you know the buisness of Leds…
Rusty Joe
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The idea that blue light disrupts sleep and/or causes cancer is bogus. I know it’s fun to get off on the statistical stuff, but it’s nonsense. The same people say that Splenda causes cancer. Utter nonsense. More fear-mongering. We humans need an enemy!

SKV89
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There has been plenty of reputable sources that say exposure to blue light at night time increases risk of cancer.

For me, after years of experimenting with ceiling bouncing flashlights at night time, I can confidently say CW keeps me awake and alert much more than WW lights. I currently use the E21A 2200K for ceiling bounce while watching TV before bed and I get sleepy pretty quickly. Using a CW or even NW 4000k light keeps me awake.

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