TK's Emisar D4V2 review

The only people who can send out email notices to customers of the D4v2 are Hank and MtnElectronics. Nobody else really has access to those emails. Unfortunately there's no guarantee people will read those emails. When car manufacturers issue recalls or notices they send snail mail.

Easiest way to get there is losen tailcap (wait ~3 seconds), tighten back up again. Click to turn the light on and it will be at max regulated output.

If you want to use that level often you can save it as manual memory (5 clicks from ON while you are at that brightness).

I sell a lot of lights. This is also a concern I have. I don’t want this liability.

This incident has pressed home that only manual lockout is safe.

I know that ruins the fun of aux lights but you cannot have it every way.

please don’t , there is nothing wrong with them ,they work just fine.

Nev it’s a new MCU, I see you are still crapping on every post. That isn’t new :slight_smile:

I’m not crapping on every post as (you keep pointing out again ) that’s not new either ,
But bless you for keep commenting on my posts ,
I’m asking for it not to be tampered with because it’s a fine ui that actually does what it’s suppose to , by all means bling it up & call it something different , but there’s a saying that goes like this , IF ITS NOT BROKEN , DONT FIX IT.
I’d like it to stay as is because when /if a program key is made available then I might be able to put ramping v2 on my d18 ,because I haven’t got a spare £100+ to buy another d18 that may or may not work properly in the thermal department ,I’m not rich enough to take the risk.
There ,I haven’t mentioned the A word because I know that upsets you , sometimes I wish people were brave enough to speak out when there’s a problem ,that’s how progress works. but unfortunately some people are to worried at upsetting people to speak the truth ,I’m sorry if you think I’m standing on your toes ,but I’m sure you will get over it, I’ll probly see you on my next post :smiley: , over & out.

As far as I’m aware, this issue is only present on the D4V2, as it is the first with the new MCU. You seem to be responding with what I’d consider to be a little too much haste if you threw all your Anduril lights out over this.

The bug is not apparent unless the light is configured/set in a very specific mode (explained repeatedly and at length in this thread) and condition. Toykeeper does test the code and from what I can tell, she really does care to “do it right”. It is easy to see how this particular bug wasn’t caught. You have to have the light set in Muggle mode with a less than full battery and then leave it off for a full 15 minutes before you might notice it.

“Muggle mode” is something I’ve never cared to try, and I imagine that many here have little interest in it. It was included to give the flashlights a wider appeal. I don’t think she has been “nonchalant” in the least. I’ve seen her respond to these reports with humility and a serious tone. She puts many hours into developing this, and does so without any compensation, then she sticks around and puts up with all the silly questions/rude remarks/and ignorance as well. She is well regarded around here because she does so much for the community and because of her pleasant attitude.

I haven’t spoken to Hank personally, but I see his posts from time to time, and I have tried a few of his lights. They are high quality, low price, and enthusiast focused. He is always polite, and I’ve seen him be very accommodating to some of the members here. He is working to provide a solution for this issue, and I believe it will all work out.

I’d hate for either of these fine people to feel uncomfortable here because of the hostility in some of these posts.

I haven’t even received my light yet, but I expect it to be as awesome as everything else Toykeeper and Hank have been involved in creating. I purchased the tools to flash these newer style drivers because I wanted to flash the newer Anduril versions to this and other lights anyway, and if I feel comfortable enough with my abilities (haven’t tried the pogo pin style yet), I’d be happy to offer help to others that need to flash the fix for this issue.

Based on some of the talk around here from some of the alarmists though, I might need to get my lawyer to draft a solid disclaimer/waiver of liability if I am able to help. Wouldn’t want someone trying to sue me because they neglected to properly lock out their light that I helped them fix for free.

Mistakes happen even with big corporations. Taking responsibility and limiting possible damages is all you can ask of anyone at this point. If this wasn’t such a niche product, I could imagine the Consumers’ Products Safety Commission becoming involved and demanding a recall on all of these effected lights. However, that’s not likely to happen unless somebody actually gets injured by one of these lights.

I hope that TK and Hank will do what needs to be done to warn every owner of these lights of the possible danger. Sending out emails with a more explicit danger warning along with a response request that the message was read should be the first step to preventing damages or injuries.

Hum…I’m starting to think that the “muggle” mode is not “”muggle”:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muggle” after all! :expressionless:

Surely “this” muggle could be magical :smiley:

Potentially saves lifes.

I like it! I may take a similar approach. I bought a bus pirate a few months ago, this will be perfect to try it out.

My take on the situation:

  • Anduril is excellent. It is a full-featured extremely well designed UI. It’s a vast improvement over the days when us flashlight enthusiasts had to buy 5-mode clicky UIs or maybe pay to special order much cruder e-switch UIs. With Anduril, we have first-class firmware that’s every bit as good or better than that of the best premium lights, like Zebralight, Acebeam or Olight. And better yet, the firmware is usually open-source and readily available. Anduril is also quite complex. The version in the D4V2 is using the 1634 processor because it was too big for the ATiny85. I suspect that it is much, MUCH bigger than “a few pages of code”.
  • Toykeeper is a true treasure to our community. She provides her awesome firmware to the community for free and has a great attitude. She spends a lot of time here on the forum, which is a good thing for us.
  • TK’s firmware allows new small budget flashlight manufacturers to get in the game. The result is some of the most fun hobbyist flashlights around, such as the Emisar series, FW3A and Fireflies series… all at prices vastly cheaper than what “premium” flashlight manufacturers charge. Without her involvement and the dedication of these small manufacturers, these lights simply wouldn’t exist.

The muggle mode bug:

  • While the chances of the bug occurring are low, the consequences of it triggering could be high. Most purchasers of the D4V2 like “pocket rockets” and do not use muggle mode ever. As such, the bug should not be a problem for normal operation the way almost everyone actually uses the light. However, there is a risk of mis-clicking and accidentally entering muggle mode. There have been no reports of fire yet, however two customers reported serious damage to the head of the light from overheating.
  • Clearly this is a serious bug. It’s not good when a flashlight has a hidden “self-destruct” mode. It’s not surprising that some purchasers are angry. Even for those who know how to avoid the bug triggering, there’s a bit less peace of mind in knowing that if you misclick you could trigger it.
  • Hank and TK are true flashlight enthusiasts. They put their all into their lights and tested them in good faith. Unfortunately a bug sneaked through the testing plan. A mistake yes… but an understandable one and TK fully explained it. This isn’t like the CPF Cometa where the manufacturer in bad-faith substituted in a cheaper host at the last minute after testing was done.

The question then is what to do about the bug:

  • Number of lights affected - this bug only affects first run D4V2 lights sold before July 19. My guess is anywhere from 500-1000 lights worldwide only.
  • Recall? - International Outdoors is a small business. The D4V2’s list price is $45. Given the feature load and overall build quality, my guess is the profit margin is quite small. No more than $5-10 per light. If a recall is done and IO has to pay for international shipping, they could be looking at a colossal loss. Say shipping both ways ends up being $30 per light. Multiply that by 1,000 lights and you get the idea. A loss like that could potentially sink a small business. At the very least it might mean a hold on new models coming out or higher prices in the future to make up for possible future losses. Do we really want that to happen to International Outdoors and Emisar? … NO!
  • Send everyone a replacement? - same issue as a recall. Far too expensive for such a small manufacturer to absorb.
  • Send customers a warning - This I think is what I recommend. Send customers a warning of the issue via snailmail and email. Advise them not to use Muggle mode until the issue is fixed. The warning should be VERY strongly worded so it isn’t missed.
  • How to fix the bug - Their idea to offer flashing kits at costs seems reasonable given the small business nature of the manufacturer. That said, I know from own experience figuring out how to flash the ATiny85, it is not easy. I expect many owners are not going to be able to figure it out unless the kit comes with a USB-ASP fully preassembled and pre-wired to the pogo-pin thingy.
  • It may also help to involve members of this community - for those who aren’t comfortable reflashing themselves, having people around the world available to reflash for them would help. It would also save time and shipping back to China for service.
  • For the few who feel really strongly they can’t wait - well these people did receive a defective light. I think they should open a warranty claim with IO. I understand under IO’s stated warranty terms, they can ask for a replacement to be shipped within something like 10 days of receipt of their light, or if outside of the return period, send it back for repair within 3 months? I suspect the vast majority of purchasers will decide it’s not worth it to open a warranty claim, but for the few who do, I believe IO should honor the warranty.

If this bug happened with a big manfucturer like Fenix or Zebralight, I wouldn’t cut them as much slack. But I really like Emisar and TK and understand that it is a small business, and know that TK donates a lot of her time for free. I think they deserve more slack.

We on this forum also understand that first-run hobbyist lights often have problems. Over the years I’ve purchased around 15 Zebralights via pre-orders and over half had major issues out of the box. There’s simply a higher risk of defects with cutting edge products than there is with tried and true … especially when you pre-order or buy from an early production run.

For myself, I am satisfied that I know how to avoid triggering the bug and deem the chances of accidental triggering too remote to worry about. I have no concerns about carrying the light in my pocket without any lockout activated. I’ll likely get the flashing kit when it becomes available and will update the firmware then.

I’m hoping a video will be made on the D4 going nuclear just to see what would happen when left unattended, it will obviously set fire to any combustibles close by , but will the actuall light melt & catch fire or will it act as a pipe bomb?

This has already happened to 2 people. The head of the light suffered damage such as melted optic, damaged wiring, button popping out. No other significant damage occurred. The lights did not explode and no nearby combustibles caught fire.

That said, I suppose combustibles could catch fire if something flammable happened to be in front of the head of the light.

So. It does not work. And my D4V2 which is not mine. Bought for a friend now always starting in ramp max. No mode memory left. I flashed many lights but this is something went wrong. The flashing does not run down once. The pop up window closed immediately and now I have a flashlight not working as it shoud and someone paid me for it to order to him. And I am here with this mess. Sorry guys cancel my offer. I don’t want to ruin anybody flashlight and now what should I do? :confounded:

I don’t know how TK and Hank want from unexperienced people in flashing to do this at first time.

Could there possibly be a short in your adapter? What command did you use?

+1 The more I think about it, the more sense Hank’s original desire to not have muggle mode on his lights makes more and more sense.

I don’t think that’s the issue. The bug could have happened with a different portion of the UI besides muggle mode and we’d have the same problem we have now.

Muggle Mode by itself is fine. The only problem is the bug.

You have reflashed many lights, but had no success here? I have no experience in mods,flashing, or soldering, yet I am told that with the proper equipment, it should be easy. I saw in your previous post that you put together your setup. I’ll bet that when Hank’s setup becomes available, you can successfully reflash this light. It’s too bad your friend may need to wait for his light.