Sorry guys for answering so late but some personal stuff came up today. Thanks to Lux-Perpetua for jumping in. And i can not say more than he already said about the questions. I talked with Jacky about the option to measure the output. . . but his boss is still not sure if its profitable for him to make their own lights.
If we can make it a success he will be willing to spend more and then we maybe get the infos. But thats something we can discuss if this is going well.
I hope Lexel will answere a few more questions about his driver so we can get everything ready. The factory is working on the D80 right now in night shift to get everything ready for sale. And if everything goes well they could be ready in 4-5 days.
If i can not get the driver information soon the manual has to be printed without them. Not what i would like to do but they also can not send the light out without a manual.
The original FET driver with Bistro showed a glitch when going high power, like a triple or quad or even the more power hungry SST40 ( which can go over 9A). The driver would not hit Turbo but instead would bump down to level one. I believe the OTSM is a revision that corrects this problem for error free use under high current draw. I seem to remember this but could be wrong.
Many of my early Bistro triples and quads in the X6 had this issue and there were a few ways to address it on the original boards, some quite tedious. This, fortunately, should no longer be a problem after Del and possibly Lexel used oscilloscopes to identify the problem and create revisions to the board design.
The firmware is mostly untouched from v1.7.1 flintrock
Modegroup is 4 with Turbo in the regular mode loop, while normal Bistro has MG12 with hidden turbo (long press from Moon, which also works in MG4)
Lexel can you provide a few more infos abou the driver?
1.Polarity Protection Yes or No
2. Overtemp protection and at what temp Or does it use stepdown (timecontrolled and when yes after how many seconds)
3. LVP at what voltage
4. Driver Name FET+5+1?
5. Bistro UI chart 100% usable for Bistro OTSM?
Makes Bistro sound plain and simple, when in fact itās far from thatā¦
OTSM as explained by Flintrock himself HERE
And TKās Bistro Manualā¦ the āplainā Bistro
The Bistro normal UI is copied from a listing made by CRX, thanks S. 
1. Its standard Bistro driver so yes
2. standard Bistro Temp setup
3. 2.7V Bistro standard
4. I count 6 AMCs total and see a FET
5. standard Bistro with triple v1.3 plus
Lexel,
I'm grateful for your support in this project and I think I can speak on behalf of the entire BLF/TLF that we all greatly appreciate your contribution. However, it would be much more helpful if you gave us some more detailed answers than the ones we see above. Please keep in mind that not only LuckySun's success is at stake but also every buyer's satisfaction with the BLF D80 V2. We need to get the manual finished by yesterday, so we are a bit in a hurry. Therefore, please have a look onto the following questions and reply as distinct as you can once again:
- Does this very driver has overheat protection?
- If so, at what temperature? (what is "standard bistro temp setup"?)
- Is this driver a FET+6 or a FET+5+1 driver? Do all AMCs run on only one channel?
- In terms of the UI and usability: Is there any difference between Bistro and Bistro OTSM and if so, is the UI chart (see some posts above) affected, so that we cannot use the Bistro chart for this flashlight?
- Will the temperature calibration (i.a.w. with the manual Dale kindly posted above) also work with Bistro OTSM?
Thank you very much!
1.+2.
- the driver has Bistro temp sensing, needs to be calibrated by user, there is a default of like 50Ā°C but the MCUs spread up to +/-20Ā°C
ā> 5+1
Mode groups:
- TA made those as far as I know
If I say Bistro standard it means itās all in the topics related to the firmware
The only difference to TA or OTSM is default Mode group is set to 4
Jacky has already printed the last draft version. So that's the version you will get along with your flashlight. I have supplemented the latest information Lexel provided yesterday and created a final version of the manual. This one will probably be shown on LS's website on AliExpress. You can also download it for more convenience from my Google Drive Sharepoint.
āŗ BLF D80 V2 Manual (English only) ā
Hi Lux-Perpetua, appreciate your efforts in writing this Wildtrail D80v2 manual.
In the last part, is this a typo? āB duildingā or is that āB Buildingā?
I asked about the battery previously, but am not sure if thereās a possible answer ā regarding the SST40 version, it says not to use >10A high-drain 18650s.
Does that mean, using a fully-charged high-drain battery (eg. 30Q or VTC6) will definitely burn out the LED when going to Turbo mode?
Iāve been running SST-40ās on FET lights since the 40 became available, using the hottest cells I can find. Have yet to blow an emitter but have seen them draw over 9A regularly. Doubt youāll have to worry about which cell to useā¦
Like DB Custom said. Most SST-40 can even handle 9A. The led should survive even a high drain cell. They tested with a fully charged 30Q. We tried to limit the current arround 7A with the 30Q.
But its a commercial sold light and by recomending to not use a high drain battery gives them a bit more safety.
For the SST-40 version they are not using the spring bypass to keep the current down. And not using a high drain battery should keep the current also in a save reagion.
I must confess I do not have any idea if this strange look comes from a typo by Jacky or if it is really meant to be "B duilding". I took the address "as is" from Jacky's original first draft of the manual. As we had to get everything sorted so quickly, especially about the specs, there was no time to have it checked and possibly rectified. Sorry for that. :-(
The full diagram can be a little intimidating, since thereās a lot of stuff in it. Iāve been meaning to make a tutorial which starts with the basics and then expands to the other features gradually, to help people understand that the core usage is very simple. The text of the tutorial is already half-written, but itāll take a while to make all the images needed.
Yeah, it needs some changes to make it more intuitive. And even then, I find itās still awkward. Ramping just doesnāt work very well with a power-disconnecting tail clicky. So on most of my tail-clicky lights, I still use some of my oldest firmwaresā¦ S7 and Cypreus. I like them more than my newer and more general-purpose interfaces.
There is no firmware called Bistro OTSM. It appears to be a customized version of Flintrockās Bistro HD.
As for differences, the names make it seem like the two are very similar, since itās just āBistroā and āBistro HDā. But they only actually share a few lines of code. If I understand correctly, Flintrock tried to make the user interface very close to the original, but the underlying code differences are so large that it would be a good idea to test the firmware very thoroughly on a prototype of the light.
I havenāt really used Bistro HD much, since it never really worked correctly on any drivers I tried, but I can at least say I already see at least one UI difference between the diagram and whatās documented in Flintrockās thread. Menu items 3 and 4 are swapped. Itās also likely that the number and details of the mode groups are different, and the manual really should have a list of what the mode groups are.
The difference is about 4000 to 7000 lines of code, depending on which parts are measured. For reference, the original Bistro is only about 1000 lines total. So itās probably easier to list what they have in common, instead of whatās different: They share a similar user interface, and a few scattered stanzas of code.
As far as Iām aware, Bistro HD has only been used by a few people. This light will be the first time it has been used at a larger scale.
About OTC (original) vs OTSM (HD), the difference is:
- OTC (Off Time Capacitor) measures the voltage of a capacitor to determine how long the button was pressed. The driver fully shuts off at each button press, and boots fresh each time the light turns on. The button timing may vary with temperature though, since this uses the analog decay rate of the hardware as a way to measure time. Requires a bleeder resistor when a lighted tailcap is attached.
- OTSM (Off Time Sleep Mode) keeps the driver running for a few seconds during each button press, using the control chipās internal timer to measure time. When power is restored, it continues from where it left off, without rebooting. Timing is much more consistent, but the chance of bugs increases since the driver doesnāt reset its state as often.
Yes, this is required by the license. The exact code shipped on the light needs to be provided.
āMostly untouchedā means itās modified, and counts as a derivative version. GPLv3 sections 5 and 6 apply, āConveying Modified Source Versionsā and āConveying Non-Source Formsā. Ideally, the license terms would be resolved in the manual, so the retailers would not have to care about the license. If the manual doesnāt include the right information though, retailers will have to carry the relevant information on their product pages.
But itās not standard Bistro, not a standard Bistro driver, etc. Itās different hardware with different firmware.
The information may be in other threads somewhere, but itās not here. The people running the project need exact, specific detailsā¦ not a suggestion to look it up themselves and make guesses about which information is relevant.
TheOnlyDocc and Jacky were talking about the odd looking address but it's correct as it is shown in the manual. So, no corrections necessary.
Some more news I'm glad to tell you: I was also told that Jacky will print and supply the final version of the manual with the D80 V2.
Thanks Toykeeper for clearing some things up. I wanted Bistro in the first place because it is a proven version. Now i can only hope that everything goes well.
To everybody on the no ano list. Please check your mails. If you are on the list but have not get a message from me please contact me.
And for everybody else. Jacky told me that the sale will start this weekend. I have no exact date or time. But i was told Saturday or Sunday.
Yay, preparing my wallet!
Perhaps a stupid question so very late in the game, but do we have any known runtimes available for this light with either emitter? Iāve looked at the final manual and see nothing thereā¦
Also, in general, should the XP-L HI run ācoolerā than the SST 40 given the less amp draw?