Thanks, hank. I would add that, in addition to looking at the excess death rate across the USA, due to the much higher death rate from COVID-19, there are some other symptoms that are more common with COVID-19 than with a seasonal flu, for example swelling of the heart, and loss of ability to taste and smell. There were probably some cases of COVID-19 mistaken for the flu, but not a lot, or they would have figured out quickly that it wasn’t just the seasonal flu going around.
In addition, there has been enough reporting of positive tests in various locations around the world that scientists have a pretty good idea through contact tracing when and where the first people became infected in the USA with COVID-19. There is now some evidence being investigated that there might have been a few cases of infected people in the US a month or two earlier than previously thought, but we know there were not a large number of cases of COVID-19 infection in the USA before they could tell it wasn’t the flu. By the end of the year, when the death count in the USA is projected to be twice what it is now and the infection count also much higher, those early cases that weren’t distinguished from the flu will be an even smaller percentage of the total number of infected and dead than they are now.
I was hoping for more international input. I get the question everything. 1918 is relevant and should be understood — if only! Seems to me if we are going to talk about dealing with it just maybe we should start with what the most successful have to say. Hong Kong, South Korea, Norway, Japan… they clearly have something figured out that we just don’t get in America.
I recently heard on TV that only 45% of Americans wear a face mask when they are around people that they don't live with.
Also, I think the U.S. might be one of only a few countries that have politicized science.
That and the lack of good leadership at the very top is part of the reason why the U.S. is doing so poorly.
The people in countries that are doing very well most likely wear face masks around people that they don't live with, trust science, and have good leadership at the very top.
It's not rocket science.
Hank
Here is the part of that same article that drives all of us crazy.
That sums it up well, along with nationwide social distancing mandates, and high compliance rates. See also the above posts about New Zealand a few screens back.
You’re missing the point. It’s not a simple matter of determining what dosage & mixture with other substances is appropriate to be effective and safe. You approve HCQ and then wait for the chaos to reign as many doctors don’t come up with the “winning” combination, if at all. It failed in France & other countries in this regard so they abandoned it.
Politicization. “You can’t take away my freedom to not wear a mask!” That’s the difference. Ignorance. And arrogance: “Your wearing a mask is a political statement. Take it off!” PIC.
No other country has fallen into the quagmire of politicizing medical & earth sciences, like the USA. A certain someone has been at the figure head of doing that, unfortunately the POTUS, with grave results. USA has become a laughing stock to the international community.
In Victoria and I think most other states of Australia, flu season has been a non-event. A combination of high vaccine uptake in March/April and Covid induced improvement in hand hygiene, social distancing and mask wearing as suggested and/or legislated by state governments. Ymmv in USA flu season
Sigh. I know.
Yesterday’s Nevada super spreader is a good example of poor leadership during a pandemic.
I think there’s plenty of blame to go around, look at what some of the governors did with the nursing homes. In NY and NJ more than half of the deaths early on happened to people in nursing homes.
The politicizing of the sciences has been going on for decades. It’s driven mostly by the government grant money on both sides. As far as being a laughing stock to the International community. They have plenty of egg on their faces, the WHO is the biggest joke.
Attacking WHO and laying blame at their feet is in itself politicizing. A small amount of research on the topic will give a clearer picture rather than talking points. I agree that old people in homes were not protected.
Ah, the all-american political defense. “I can be a p.o.s. because I think you are a p.o.s.”
Freedom of the press is guaranteed only those who own one
Some nursing homes were ill prepared & didn’t react fast enough. Those became the showcase that made it seem like the entire collection of NY/NJ nursing homes were death traps. Just like the few protests that suffered riots, painted as the entire movement was violent (it hasn’t been). Of course, politicizing of science has always happened—it’s the degree of it. Especially on critical factors. There are still climate change deniers scoffing at the wild fires of the west in the USA, claiming “poor forest management”. No. Management policies & manning haven’t had any drastic changes. The climatology data is the only dynamically changing factor here. Droughts like never before seen in those regions. The WHO has its notable share of problems, but their interfacing with China was flawed. Not transparent as with other countries, and too much info directly given, without proper scrutiny. So the WHO echoed China’s messaging, the worst about their allegedly being “very limited risk of human-to-human transmission of the virus.” However, in 2003, the WHO properly called out China for its lack of preparedness & transparency. The organization does work & serve a purpose. It needs “correction.” USA refuses to lead on this.
To be fair, the governors in NY, PA, etc. were following guidance from the federal and state health authorities, who feared a shortage of hospital beds and recommended putting a priority on keeping hospital beds free for new admissions. The nursing homes were told they should isolate people who tested positive from the other residents. Many nursing homes failed to do that, for various reasons. Also, many nursing home residents were infected by staff, not by other residents.
Some states, like MN, actually had a higher percentage of their COVID-19 cases in nursing homes without an order from the governor similar to those issued in other states. That was in part because their health departments were moving active COVID cases to nursing homes due to the same concern about hospital bed capacity being inadequate to meet the coming demand.
If they were active covid cases then why be moved at all. Just because of their age?
Well 007, looks like this tread has outlived it’s usefulness. More politics than science.