No, Aliexpress is not an American Company. It’s part of the Alibabagroup (taobao is another part) which is Chinese (only 20% owned by Yahoo - 80% owned by Chinese).
Chris Reeve has always expressed a continuing desire to be informed of knock-off/fake Sebenzas. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to shoot Lisa an email.
These are blatant rip offs. They use his name and trademark.
Just sent him an email with a link to the listing and this discussion.
Scaru,
Thanks for informing CR. I saw those knives and immediately knew they were total phonies. I’ve seen real Sebenza’s, can’t afford one but I certainly don’t support piracy/knock-offs. I agree w/ Speedsix, most of us know they’re fakes but there are many folks that will buy one thinking they’ve scored a huge savings.
Scaru thanks for sending an email as well.
After a little more poking around on that site it looks like Rick Hinderer is being knocked off as well.
Piracy aside, these ripoffs certainly look the part, wow.
i think is the model number, is a knife i read about here on blf. it is a “clone” of the hinderer xm-18 (i think that is the model), right down to the slotted pivot screw. it doesn’t say hinderer though, it says inron. it sells for around $20, or less. those are two big advantages over ripping off the name and selling for $70. they (the inrons) are pretty good knives, probably very good when you consider the price, and worth it. $70 for an obvious fake with a counterfeit name is definitely, positively not.
what mean is i think is it is probably okay to produce an homage/clone/copy if you put your name on, it but not at all okay to represent an item as authentic if it is not. in a case like this it is even more so, because it would take anyone who has owned or handled a chris reeve knife approximately one second to tell the difference.
budget lights and chrise reeve knives go together like a tall glass of milk and a hot steaming plate of oysters.
People who interested in a real CR, know the real price (and material). If someone think to buy a real CR Sebanza for $20-80 - he must be crazy. I think 98% know, that the aliexpress CR are fakes, 1% ist stupid and think it could be real and 1% buy it, because they like the design and have never heard about Chris Reeve.
If you have a low interest in knives you would’n know CR or Rick Hinderer.
Another brand which is often faked is Extrema Ratio (a famous high-price italian manufacturer). A real ER costs about 100€-300€, on Aliexpress you can buy cheap fakes for $7.
If someone buy such a knife for himself it would be ok for me. If he wants to sell such a knife on ebay or somewhere else for a high price (wanted to fake people, sell such a CR clone for example $200 and make profit with the brand, name and reliability of CR), it is criminal and must be stopped.
But I think it would be impossible to stop the selling on aliexpress. You can find a solution if it enters a country, which fight against fakes, but in China it would be impossible.
i think it is a much higher percentage than 1% of people that may be stupid, as you say, or more likely just want to believe they are being told the truth, or are getting a great deal.
If you're going to rip somebody off, at least do it to someone who deserves it - like that thief/liar/scumbag Mick Strider...
Buw,
I had not heard of ER knives, looked at the ER home site, really impressive tactical knives w/ price to match. So,again AliX sellers list LOTS of ’em, all faux-knives…
I heard back from them and they are currently trying to get them removed from Aliexpress and they thanked you guys for finding it. :)
there are lots of strider fakes on aliexpress as well. there are even rick carillo fakes! it is interesting since i own most of the brands that are being ripped off except strider but that is another story.
ken
ps got a small sebbie for sale if anyone is interested. just back from a tune up at cr, nice folks
Hello everyone, first post here. I read the forums a lot but don’t usually post anything. I joined BLF today b/c I’ve thought a lot about this topic.
I have two of the ‘Chibenzas’ being sold online currently, and I have two more on the way. I wanted to have a couple of ti knives to tinker with and anodize, but balked at most of the prices for a decent ti folder. IMO, these fakes are hands down the best value for a ti framelock on the market. Personally, I would prefer it if these were unbranded or being sold under their own brand name (enlan or sanrenmu?), without being an exact copy, but after reading what I could about them in a thread here ( Does anyone have the expensive Fakes (Sebenza / Strider) ) and elsewhere around the net, I finally couldn’t resist and had to see for myself what the quality was like.
First off, they are NOT perfect. (After all, they are selling for 80-90% less than the real deal.) My large has a stainless clip and some kind of plastic washers. Also, the lanyard pin on both are stainless (magnetic), I think they are ti coated and then anodized. The lockup on my large is perfect, but the lock sticks and it is tough to open and close one handed. This can probably be fixed by carbidizing the lock face. The action on it is very smooth and overall I was very impressed.
The small I have is also very nice. The clip on this one is stainless too, and it has slight lock rock. I do not fear lock failure at all though, and it should be fixable with some adjustments. The small came with bronze washers, rather than the plastic ones on the large. The action was a bit gritty on this one at first, but I had fun going over the handles and washers with some high grit automotive sandpaper. This and a light oiling smoothed out the action considerably. It is easy to open and close with one hand and is in my regular EDC rotation. I also got a great “scotchbrite” finish on the stonewashed scales with just a minute or two of effort.
Both blades came shaving sharp and I believe they are D2 as advertised. (There is a slowly developing patina on my large from food prep.) There are some vendors selling variations that they claim are either 12C27 or actual S35VN.
So yeah, I do have some scruples at about it, but I now have large & small Chibenza 21s, with a small star-benza (going to look great in bronze) and ’zaan clone on the way. I’ll have 4 solid quality (not perfect) ti framelocks, shipped, for less than half the price one real large 21.
To me, that’s a crazy deal that was too good to pass up. Ymmv.
Value,
I’m rather skeptical that any of the “Chibenza” clones [or similar Extrema Ratio, Strider, etc.] have blades made of D2, 12C27 or S35VN. The cost of those alloys exceeds the price of the clones. I’ll stick w/ an “honest” budget SRM or Enlan that stands on its own merits.
An update on the steel of my fake sebenza, i now think it’s NOT D2, i actually tested it’s edge retention and it’s crap, i never suffered from a dull blade with it before because i gave it 2 or 3 passes on the strop every evening like i do any knife i EDC but after testing it with cardboard cutting i can say with confidence that the steel is complete crap.
Gurthang,
You may be right, who knows what they are, but I don’t think materials cost is going to be much of an issue. When I was looking for ti knives to anodize, I looked up raw materials (blade stock, handle materials) on alphaknifesupply com, and they are much lower than what I expected to see. You can get a 11.5” X 1.5”piece of .150” S30V for $18, that’s enough for 2 blades. And the Chinese know how to make (some) good things really cheap. Just sayin, lol.
JamesB,
Again, who knows what it is? I haven’t used mine much either. All I know for sure is that mine have stayed hair popping sharp with nothing more than an occasional strop under regular use (mail, food prep, etc), and that they are a semi-stainless alloy. I was thinking it might be Cr12MoV, or some other similar Chinese version of D2, but even then you don’t really know about their heat treat.
-Just thought I would offer my experience on these since there doesn’t seem to be much info out there. There is definitely RISK in any purchase of an unknown maker, no warranty, foreign, item. For my purpose, they offered the best value that I could find in a ti folder. I may try to crater out the logo’s, a decent bit shouldn’t be too expensive.
You’re right, who knows what steel it’s made of and what the heat treat has been.
All i know is my fake sebs edge retention is non-existent.
I agree that cost of material is casually blown up to explain the cost of “high end” knives, especially if bought in large quantities like is the case for knife makers, i wouldn’t be surprised if i learned that a sebenza entire production cost is well below 50$ (material, labor and equipment factored in)