Im still new to flashlights and especially Li-Ion cells so im kinda confused about this.
A few days back i got an order from DX and one of the 14500 TF Flames came reading 0.00v and within 20 minutes later i found one of my 18650 Flames reading 0.00v also. I know the 18650 hadn't been used more than once or twice and never over discharged. So i hit both with some voltage in a charger and they came to life.
Today i test the 18650 on my Hyperion 720i and it wont hold no more than 250mAH, I cycle it 5 times at .5 amps with no luck in reviving it. I then got to test out my newly fixed light i put a new driver and emitter in and it doesn't fire with 2x 14500 cells. I test the cells and it was the one DX sent me that was at 0v was again non responsive. I may cycle it tonight a few times if you think this will help?
Can it be the protection circuits kicking in and cutting the cell off? I can remove that and try it unprotected.
I have a good amount of Panasonic 18650 2400mAH cells i got from a guy here that are great, So im not to worried about those. But what would be a good replacement quality and price wise compared to the TF Flame cells? $5 a cell isnt bad, $15 a cell is horrible imo. But i may be able to get some good prices on 14500's of higher quality and not such a high price since that cell is usually alot cheaper.
So any suggestions from the China connections on replacement cells? Or if i want higher quality will it have to be the AW's , EX Cells, KalliesCustoms?
sounds like a bad cell ( s ) to me..i've had TF grey's do this to me..never the flames though..charge it up and put a muti meter on it..check voltage every 2-3 seconds..if it drops consistantly from 4.2v all the way to 3v then 0v it is a bad cell that will not hold a charge..get rid of it immediately..with Chinese QC you never know what's going to happen..this is a major concern with low cost cells..
I just got a pair of 14500 last week TF Flames, also from DX. No issue, its good on both low powered Q5 and high powered XM-Ls at 1.7A.
Perhaps can try the bestinone.net IMR 14500s. 600mAH and it was tested to be very close to that so capacity's great, performs well naturally since its LiMn so you can suck any amount of current from it safely. Really cheap too, 7.80/pr shipped with registered mail.
Toss it in the charger and see if the light goes red [ charge cycle ] , might take a few tries ...
After light goes red check voltage .. If bellow 3v you can charge but monitor the cell for signs of heat , if it gets hotter than mildly warm , the cell may be damaged ..
You can let it cool , and try again , some times the cells come good ..
Lower current charging is better in such circumstances , as higher current may make the cell warm [ false alarm as far as a damaged cell may be concerned ]
Im gonna hit them with my Pila charger and see how that goes and do a discharge on the Hyperion. The Pila brought them back from 0.00v the last time, But it didnt last long before they started this last round of issues.
Last resort ill pull the PCB off both and try them unprotected.
I bought a pair of TF Flames 18650 from KD a couple of months ago. One of them arrived reading 0 volt but took charge without a problem, probably just a tripped protection circuit I thought. But when I tested it about a week later it read 0 volt again and it had just been laying on the shelf. I tried to cycle it a few times but I couldn't make it hold a charge.
The other cell works but it only delivers 1,5 amps to my XM-L light while my green unprotected UltraFire and my AW 2900 delivers 2,5 amps. The cells looks the same as the pictures on DX so I guess they are "genuine". Genuine crap cells...
From now on I will only buy quality cells such as AW and XTAR 2600.
Ive not been into the flashlight hobby long enough to test the longevity of anything, But these two different TF Flames are the first items ive had die for no reason.
I just pulled out the Fluke meter as i put both cells in my Pila charger last night with hopes it may have some magic it could work.
Flame 18650: I charged to 4.2v and is now down to 4.13v and im pretty sure it wont hold any capacity once i run a discharge cycle on my Hyperion. Most likely this cell is toast as last tested showed it at 250mAH capacity.
Flame 14500: Was also put on the Pila and it came back to life once it was hit with juice, But is back too 0.00v this morning. Ill be removing the PCB protection on this cell to try and revive it.
On a side note, The 14500 cells that came in this last order earlier this week are much larger cells than the first ones i got. But i think those came from Ebay.
Ill slowly be replacing these Flame cells with higher quality ones when i can. I have a bunch of Panasonic 18650 cells so im ok on them, But i only have Flame 14500's. Im really disappointed as from what ive found while researching the web that the Flames were the highest quality Chinese cells available.
I have six trustfire flames, 4 14500s and 2 18650s, all work the best of all the cells I've tried...
Could be you got defective cells (quality control is often lacking), or maybe they sat on the shelf for too long and self-discharged too far, hence reading 0.0 on arrival.
If you just got them, report to DX that they're defective, and they'll get another pair in the mail, probably within a few days.
I have over 40 18650 Trustfire Flames all from DX I have only had 3 out of those with problem. I got a two of the bad protection circuit ones they work fine as long as you don't pull more than one amp and one with a cooked protection circuit that I took off and it works fine. I got 2 unprotected ones from Manafont that deliver 4.5amps to my UF980L. I have about a dozen of the Trustfire flame 16340s from DX only one DOA that I was not able to revive. I have about a dozen 14500 Trustfire flame 14500s from DX not a single problem with any of them. To me that is pretty good quality for cheap Chinese products.
2x 18650 flame and 2x 14500 flame have served well.
BUT these are not a recent buy, so quality of these could be going down…
Suggestions, Solarforce? Basic choice of AW? Something else
I know DX may replace the one cell or at least refund me, But its not worth the hassle. I dont hold it against them anyhow.
As to further investigate the issues i pulled the wrapping off of both cells. The Flame 14500 was reading 0.00v before and now 4.196v, So im pretty sure the protection system went bad. Im gonna cycle it on my Hyperion and make sure its good to go. Now here comes the part that irks me, Its a 750mAH cell they relabeled at 900mAH. Its clearly printed right on the side.
The 18650 cell seemed odd, I couldn't find no PCB anywhere. It turns out the cells from Ebay that i bought were all unprotected. This was one of my first flashlight related purchases so i took for granted that these would be protected. But that doesn't explain why the cell died.
If i switch to another brand i know it will be more expensive so ill just have to see what i need and can afford at the time i buy more cells.
BTW the Flame 14500 with the PCB removed is doing fine while being cycled so it must have been the PCB that was the issue, The 18650 is junk tho.
Do lithiums even go to 0v? That's basically a short so either the batteries are FUBAR (which doesn't seem to be the case) or the protection circuit is jacked.
I think your right as they shouldn't ever read 0v. As the 14500 cell i tested after removing the protection PCB tested out to: Dishcharge 784mAH and Charged 765mAH
As for the 18650 cell all i know is it would only hold a charge of 250mAh, So its been junked. Why it died i don't know, My chargers wont over charge and ive never run the cell in a light that didn't have built in voltage protection. That is my Olight M20s Warrior.
Im not to pleased TF listed this cell as 900mAH when its clearly stamped 750mAH under the pretty flame wrapper.
Got 4pcs protected 14500 flames a few weeks ago from DX, they all came in at between 3.8v to 3.85v. Gave 2 to a friend for his e-cigs - he says the 2 are longer than his older flames and run out faster too.
While mine does seem a tight fit for my TF SA-2 and UF C3, but I can't really tell since this is my first time using 14500s.
My first set is smaller and will fit in a 4xAA battery case, But these dont fit in it. Despite me being upset of the 750mAH marking on the cell under the wrapping, It did do 760-780mAH under very light testing at 4.16v down too 3v so had i pushed the cell it would have done 900mAH+ easily. Both sets are protected cells, But they cant be the same ones underneath.
The unprotected 18650 that died i bought off Ebay 6 weeks ago, And i bought 4 and the other 3 work great and test out to perfect specs.
I think im gonna chalk this up to bad luck, That 18650 was slowly going as i noticed it only holding 4.13v for a few weeks. But it should have held up to the 1.5A tests i ran on it im doing to all my cells and keeping records of. As long as nothing else flips out and keels over ill stick with the Flames, As they have been good up until this.
People have gotten counterfeit *fires on ebay... It's a sad comment on chinese industry when people are counterfeiting brands that are themselves counterfeits...
If DX is shipping them though, that'd be annoying...