Jaxman Z1 Discussion

Oh man you just made that?
it is a shame the underscore makes thngs italic since this screams for a smiley that cannot be shown O
let me google it
YES this is what I want to show or

That looks beautiful.

It will be interesting to know what thermal improvement results.

TBH, all my engineering knowledge tells me that a decent aluminium alloy pill should also outperform anything made of brass.

Whereas Al vs Cu is a trickier one. Thermal conduction, thermal mass, weight, cost, ease of machining, and doubtless other factors, all need consideration and trad-off.

I suppose, the bottom line, is the price and availability, compared with $5 for the standard brass pill, and what true benefits will be gained, and whether it will make any practical difference, except in extreme modifications.

How much would you estimate that your copper pill should cost, as a commercial proposition ?

Happy Birthday America! :smiley:

Sharpie, the cost is probably 3-4 times higher, Hoop can probably make the pills for around $15-18. In normal scenario’s this is probably unwarranted, but this Luminus SBT-70 is not efficient and burns a LOT of current as heat, so it’s necessary here to go the extra mile.

18.75A seems to be about the peak here on an Efest 4200mAh cell. At the 43 second step down point with this particular driver, it’s just about burning my hand, copper or no copper.

Happy 4th to you, Dale and the Gang!

Nice pictures!

That makes sense, you do like to push things “to infinity, and beyond”.

It looks like a big chunk, how many grams ?

The brass pill, built, weighs 43 grams. The copper pill, built, weighs 68 grams.

Sorry, I must have missed that post.

Hoop mentioned the fingernail test. I don’t recall that you did.

It is a standard test, and not about whether “there’s any roughness that can be felt”.

That would set a ridiculously stringent test.

By comparison with a calibrated set of samples, the fingernail can be a remarkably precise way to compare surface finish.

And is accepted as such.

To not feel any roughness would require an almost mirror finish.

We have people here that take the shelf to a mirror finish. I personally don’t like to as it prohibits the Arctic Alumina Thermal Adhesive from adhering to the slick surface and can allow the mcpcb to shift once heated. It is certainly easier to remove a glued mcpcb from a mirror polished shelf.

So I tend to focus more on how flat it is and not worry much about some slight surface imperfections. I REALLY don’t like a dimple directly under the emitter from a pre-drill situation being plunged too deeply.

Miller, I appreciate it but really I’m just a hack still. I can manage to make something that works, Hoop can make it look like Art. :wink:

I think you already have nearly 60% more thermal mass. Copper and Brass are much the same, per gram. I’ll do an estimate c.f. Aluminium tomorrow.

PS: Aluminium has by far the best specific heat of any metal. Over twice that of copper. But being so much less dense, it takes a much larger volume of it.

Plain old water of course, is more than four times better, and if allowed to change phase (into steam) vastly more so.

Steampunk extreme torches ?

With the exception of Magnesium and of course Beryllium, yes Aluminum is up there pretty high. But like Magnesium, the weight or mass is so low that it’s disproportionate for real world usage in many cases. Made the same size, copper blows the doors off virtually anything else commonly available. I did some testing concerning this a couple of years ago with the Trinity in C8’s, once the copper was brought into the picture prolonged high output and run time (output at life of cell) really showed the difference.

Water will come to play in a handheld flashlight, sure enough, it’s just a matter of time. Pretty sure Bucket already did that, some time back. But it’ll happen as we continue to see improvements in LED’s and the power supplies that run em.

Yes, you got me there.

Practical magnesium alloys , not much difference.

Beryllium, well, yes. But the toxicity, and expense.

That’s why it even was banned from Formula One.

But until then, was the thing for brake callipers, for those who could afford it, and handle it safely.

Nevermind inside the engine, e.g.

Hank is sending me his Z1 so I’ll get some pills worked out pretty soon. :smiley: I’ll be sending it back with a copper pill in it.

The tooling marks visible in photographs of my pills probably give the impression of a rough surface, so I mentioned the fingernail test just to say that you can’t feel any roughness even though you can see distinct tooling marks because of how they interact with light. As for what is really necessary for production standards, I’d say just flat and fairly smooth. A normal finish facing pass with a decent insert should accomplish this in a matter of seconds on a lathe, but that seems out of reach for a lot of manufacturers. :confounded:

Hi,

I used an 17-20mm Adapter for the LD-1 driver instead of piggypack it which fits perfect in my Z1.

http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_72&product_id=672

But a little extra weight with copper is welcome :wink:

Regards

Kenjii

I have a question about tooling marks, or even slight minute tooling ridges that one could actually feel with a fingernail in the MCPCB pocket of the pill. ( I am not talking about super grossly rough tooling marks mind you ).

If it they were flat, would the slightly rough tooling ridges along with a proper amount of Arctic Silver 5 Premium not give better heat transfer from the MCPBC to the pill than if it were smooth.

My though is the slight tooling ridges would indeed give more surface area for the heat to be transferred from the MCPCB to the pill, by way of the Arctic Silver 5 Premium of course. That is my theory anyway, same as cooling fins on the outside of the light dissipates much more heat than a smooth surface with no fins.

Yeah, the super smooth and polished pockets on the pills look very nice indeed… I agree with that. But, they also have less surface area to transfer the heat to than a pocket with slight tooling ridges.

Just my thoughts…….

No
Article silver is purely for filling tiny gaps.
The smoother the better since less paste is needed.

Hi, I did the resistor mod on the stock Z1 XHP50! As I only had a R100 at hand this was added to the original R150, giving a total of 0.06 Ohm instead of 0.15 Ohm on high.

Tailcap readings BEFORE:
L:0.05A M:0.5A H:2.5A

Tailcap readings AFTER:
L:0.05A M: 0.5A H:5A

I shaved the XHP50 at the same time so I can only say it got a significantly brighter projection :slight_smile:

Thermal paste is nowhere near as effective as a good metal to metal contact.
There are some adhesion losses with a mirror finish, but this usually doesn’t mean a lot to us inside a flashlight. For a light like the Z1 there is a cover plate that holds the emitter/mcpcb down so it’s not likely to move even if dropped or hard use EDC.

The key to a paste at optimum efficiency is filling microscopic differences, eliminating air. I tend to use the microprocessor instructions and apply a small ball of paste in the center, then lay the mcpcb on top and press it so that the paste spreads out. The trick here is to use enough without using too much, but even if too much is applied a good bit of pressure can push it out and the excess removed. Too little and there are air gaps around the periphery of the mcpcb.

Some small tooling ridges from a fast feed aren’t particularly of issue, as long as the surface is flat and true… true being important so the emitter faces the optic as perfectly as possible. What has to be weighed is the ability to reduce these marks while maintaining a flat true surface, it’s all too easy to mess up the paradigm while trying to improve surface contact, trading one issue for a more serious flaw.

Maybe maybe not. Tiny gaps are what I am referring to.

Does this stuff, Arctic Silver 5 Premium; actually transfer heat or not? I think it does… but how good does it? That I do not know yet, but I shall find out by calling them right now. :+1:

EDIT: / Just called them they are closed for facility maintenance this week reopen 11 July 2016.