Have you seen this type of counterfeit 18650 battery before? UltraFire

115 posts / 0 new
Last post

Pages

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO
Have you seen this type of counterfeit 18650 battery before? UltraFire

Fist time I saw it here   Photos were posted on 5th of December 2013

Locally I keep saying to people do not buy Ultrafire 4200mAh is fake like any other Ultrafire no matter what capacity is claimed, but unfortunately no one really gets anything like internal resistance, capacity at different loads, etc so Ultrafire is a very popular brand even with warnings.

However I have not ever imagined this thing as a possible cause for the UltraBad quality of this brand.

 

Edited by: Hikelite on 01/05/2014 - 15:24
unknown00101
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 53 min ago
Joined: 08/16/2013 - 11:53
Posts: 4248
Location: USA

Creative… There’s another disassembly thread on CPF iirc they pull some little sealed bag and the cavity around is filled with white power.

I’ll see what my Junkers that wouldn’t charge look like when I shoot them full of holes later. Smile

MRsDNF
MRsDNF's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 3 min ago
Joined: 12/22/2011 - 21:18
Posts: 11314
Location: A light beam away from the missus in the land of Aus.
Smile Living up to its reputation and possibly in name as well. Nice dissection.

My current and or voltage measurements are only relevent to anything that I measure.

Budget light hobby proudly sponsored by my Mastercard and unknowingly paid for by a hard working wife. 

djozz said "it came with chinese lettering that is chinese to me".

old4570 said "I'm not an expert , so don't suffer from any such technical restrictions".

Old-Lumens. Highly admired and cherished member of Budget Light Forum. 11.5.2011 - 20.12.16. RIP.

 

Jayc
Jayc's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 6 months ago
Joined: 03/17/2012 - 01:01
Posts: 93
Location: Vancouver BC, Canada

Only in China.

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

Saw something on CPF actually a post from a fellow countryman here

3000mAh on the wrap and 1000mAh under the wrap. They do not seem to have any gas-release vents!

Ouchyfoot
Ouchyfoot's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 2 days ago
Joined: 09/01/2012 - 06:15
Posts: 5087
Location: Canada

Hikelite wrote:

Looks like a fishing lure now.
freeme
freeme's picture
Online
Last seen: 7 min 37 sec ago
Joined: 11/14/2013 - 22:00
Posts: 4668
Location: freedailydeals.org

Not even 1/3 of the claimed value.

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 6 months ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 1378
Location: North Carolina

Its not the first time for ultrafire surprise.
http://laserpointerforums.com/f67/fake-ultrafire-18650-s-72833.html

phsinvent
phsinvent's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 48 min ago
Joined: 01/24/2013 - 18:30
Posts: 585
Location: Ohio

This is a new type of ultrafire surprise to me. Im used to seeing the old school ultrafire 3000mah red batteries that say they are protected on the label and have no external protection pcb on the negative. They claim internal protection on the wrapper. Lol. The really bad fakes had some weird 14500 type cell inside and the rest filled with a drywall type powder.

If I ever run across ultrafires. I usually throw them on a gram digital scale first. The suspects usually weigh very little. They also have a hollow clay pot sound if you tap them against each other.

Ive had a few trustfire flames lately from us sellers that weighed less than the fasttech trustfire 3000mah flames. Sometimes 34 grams versus 29 grams.

unknown00101
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 53 min ago
Joined: 08/16/2013 - 11:53
Posts: 4248
Location: USA

phsinvent wrote:
This is a new type of ultrafire surprise to me. Im used to seeing the old school ultrafire 3000mah red batteries that say they are protected on the label and have no external protection pcb on the negative. They claim internal protection on the wrapper. Lol. The really bad fakes had some weird 14500 type cell inside and the rest filled with a drywall type powder.

If I ever run across ultrafires. I usually throw them on a gram digital scale first. The suspects usually weigh very little. They also have a hollow clay pot sound if you tap them against each other.

Ive had a few trustfire flames lately from us sellers that weighed less than the fasttech trustfire 3000mah flames. Sometimes 34 grams versus 29 grams.

I received some of the mystical protected ultrafires but in blue wrapping with my first personal Liion flashlight purchase.

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

unknown00101 wrote:
phsinvent wrote:
..............They also have a hollow clay pot sound if you tap them against each other. Ive had a few trustfire flames lately from us sellers that weighed less than the fasttech trustfire 3000mah flames. Sometimes 34 grams versus 29 grams.
I received some of the mystical protected ultrafires but in blue wrapping with my first personal Liion flashlight purchase.

And to think that the blue UltraFire used to be recommended by Goinggear in their older videos.

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

moderator007 wrote:
Its not the first time for ultrafire surprise. http://laserpointerforums.com/f67/fake-ultrafire-18650-s-72833.html[/quote]

I will post the photos here too so anyone can see them.

hex4def6 photos:

 

 

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

Browsing BLF I have found another example of some small ii-ion cells put inside a 18650 shell.

Suncoaster
Suncoaster's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 59 min ago
Joined: 02/22/2012 - 07:14
Posts: 2097
Location: Where the girls are green and the grass is pretty.

Is it safe to cut an old Ultrafire up to see what’s inside ?

"In the land of the blond the one eyed man is king."

*This message is protected with ROT26 encryption.Old Lumens

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

This guy found his UltFire 3000mAh to have in fact 887mAh.

But that is actually quite irrelevant because the max  discharge the Pro Peak Prodigy 2 can do is 1Amp, so at 3Amps like what we all need the cells should not do more than 400mAh. That is assuming the discharging was done at 1A, maybe was done at 0.5A. In any case 1A is pretty irrelevant in the flashlight world.

 

 

Lower in the comments you can read (even after the guys shows how bad they are)

"i am going to buy a new battery for my flashlight ,i find a pair cheap battery on ebay ,ultrafire brc18650 2 for $3.10 ,should i buy it or not ?

Don
Don's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/12/2010 - 16:32
Posts: 6617
Location: Scotland

Suncoaster wrote:
Is it safe to cut an old Ultrafire up to see what's inside ?

 

If it's a fake, perhaps.

 

If it's genuine it could be a bad idea - there is quite a lot of energy in there and if it gets out all at once it could spoil your entire day.

At the very least do this outdoors, downwind of things like people that you care about.

Wear hand, eye and face protection and make sure you stay upwind of the cell.If it does get energetic, the fumes are really nasty.

 

Most likely, nothing will happen, but it could get a bit exciting.

 

The numbers from my light tests are always to be found here.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0ApkFM37n_QnRdDU5MDNzOURjYllmZHI...

Yellowhorse
Yellowhorse's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 2 months ago
Joined: 11/26/2011 - 19:16
Posts: 432
Location: Deepest Darkest West Virginia

This is but one of the many reasons I NEVER buy anything but genuine Panasonic or AW batteries (mostly AW) from reliable, easy to reach vendors I have dealt with for many years. Yeah, they cost more but I could care less. They always meet spec and I never have any problems with them. It’s bad enough that most here buy the very cheapest lights available (strike one), the cheapest batteries available (strike two) and then go on to complain that they got screwed (strike three). DUH! What in the world did you expect? You fell for the false advertising, the unrealistic pricing and ignored the countless battery reviews. No sympathy here. Think of all the poor people buying and using this junk that never even realize they’ve been had. Ignorance is bliss, I guess.

On the bright side (pun intended), maybe that great warranty that came with that unbelievably great deal on those crappy batteries and lights will save the day. Smile You KNOW that’s not gonna happen. Heck, most of that stuff isn’t even worth the shipping to and from wherever it came from.

Let me know how those new $20 car tires worked out for you. Seems legit, eh?

All that being said, I too occasionally buy some junk to play with in an attempt to make them better/brighter (lights – never batteries) and when it all goes south, which is usually the case, I chalk it up to cheap entertainment. Sort of like panning for gold. Lots and lots of work for little to no return.

CAVEAT EMPTOR

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

Suncoaster wrote:
Is it safe to cut an old Ultrafire up to see what's inside ?

Maybe this could help with opening a cell.

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

The shear popularity of this cells is incredible and nu-informed people will buy what most people buy.

For example check out this German seller, he sold 989 packs of 4 cells. That is 3956pcs UltraFire cells, fake 4000mAh capacity!

Check how many watchers, 401 users watching that sale.

Or this other seller proud of 4200mAh capacity (fake) has sold 64 packs of 10, that is 640pcs UltraFire.

This seller has the newest 18650 cells, 5800mAh capacity, fake of course.

Luminous
Luminous's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 7 months ago
Joined: 11/08/2011 - 16:37
Posts: 121
Location: Bay State

Amazing photos. Crazy the market that creates this crap.

If anything, it’s a reason to own a hobby charger. Run them down and fill them back up. You’ll know then what you’ve really bought before loading the Kung full of grenades.

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

Since these ads showed up in my ebay account I will post the stats.  The popularity of these cells is just incredible and the capacity claim has nothing to do with reality. I bet they don't have 2000mAh at 1Amp discharge.

617packs sold at 8pieces, that is 4936 UltraFire cells at 5000mAh

1860packs sold at 4pieces, that is 7440 UltraFire cells at 5000mAh

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 6 months ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 1378
Location: North Carolina

Hikelite wrote:

Since these ads showed up in my ebay account I will post the stats.  The popularity of these cells is just incredible and the capacity claim has nothing to do with reality. I bet they don’t have 2000mAh at 1Amp discharge.

617packs sold at 8pieces, that is 4936 UltraFire cells at 5000mAh

1860packs sold at 4pieces, that is 7440 UltraFire cells at 5000mAh


The only thing we can do is try to inform the general public. As long as the demand for these exaggerated capacity cells are available the unaware public will by them. The only defense against this china marketing is being well informed. If everyone knew how crappy and dangerous they are, they would simply disappear from the market. This thread is definitely a step in the right direction.
.
Posting all these pictures will help and hopefully move up to the top of google’s search engine.
.
Another battery surprise story. http://budgetlightforum.com/node/13539
gords1001
gords1001's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 1 month ago
Joined: 05/07/2012 - 14:02
Posts: 5272
Location: wigan england

I’ve linked this on a load of vaping sites today.

We have all known for a long long time to stay away from the brc3000 ultrafire cells, vapers are no where near as savvy.

The response has been overwhelmingly positive, which was the hope, we really baby our cells compared to some vapers so I’d rather people were aware.

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 6 months ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 1378
Location: North Carolina

Thanks a lot gords1001 Wink , that’s about all we can do to help. I suppose the market for these type cells is greater in the vaping market than anywhere else. If we could all pitch in I’am sure we could make a dent in the numbers sold.

Hikelite
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/13/2011 - 16:18
Posts: 3591
Location: RO

moderator007 wrote:
Thanks a lot gords1001 Wink , that's about all we can do to help. I suppose the market for these type cells is greater in the vaping market than anywhere else. If we could all pitch in I'am sure we could make a dent in the numbers sold.

Yeah thanks gords1001. And moderator007 yeah that is all we can do.

The rather weird part is you can s ee those German sellers sell a lot of them. To most of the emerging markets and even developed countries the fact that a German seller offers those cells means everything is correct and tested, but that is just and old cliche. That is also why some of those companies even try to use German sounding names like Heider to sell ultra cheap flashlights.  So what I am trying to say that US and German sellers selling thousands of these cells is actually a guarantee for many people to buy from local sellers anywhere in the world UltraFire cells.

 

Illuminaria
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 11 months ago
Joined: 10/01/2013 - 11:57
Posts: 325
Location: Slidell, La.
Don wrote:

Suncoaster wrote:
Is it safe to cut an old Ultrafire up to see what’s inside ?

 

If it’s a fake, perhaps.

 

If it’s genuine it could be a bad idea – there is quite a lot of energy in there and if it gets out all at once it could spoil your entire day.

At the very least do this outdoors, downwind of things like people that you care about.

Wear hand, eye and face protection and make sure you stay upwind of the cell.If it does get energetic, the fumes are really nasty.

 

Most likely, nothing will happen, but it could get a bit exciting.

I have cut open a few. As above but bring battery down to 0 volts as you are going to destroy it, no? To cut into a charged or partially charged cell could get interesting.

The cells I cut were the brown and gold wrapped “protected 4000 ma” batteries. Well, it did say so on the label! Reviewers on Amazon give this cr@p 5 stars?

Hopefully some slick lawyer could nail Amazon then it could start to roll down hill on the importers to stem the flow >)

Illuminaria
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 11 months ago
Joined: 10/01/2013 - 11:57
Posts: 325
Location: Slidell, La.

Some one has to get hurt first?

Amazon policy

FlashPilot
FlashPilot's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 59 min ago
Joined: 05/10/2010 - 16:07
Posts: 4401
Location: USA

You’d have to search for a while, but there have been several reported incidents of ultrafire “BRC” cells (in all of their various iterations & colors) exploding, leaking, overheating while charging, and reporting some of the lowest capacities of any “new” 18650 we’ve ever seen. This one certainly stoops to new lows. Regardless of which version BRC you might find or how new they might appear, please do not use them and recycle them immediately. That can probably be said of most Chinese lithium cells… pure garbage sold to the unsuspecting.

pod7381
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 07/19/2011 - 22:42
Posts: 252
Location: USA
Illuminaria wrote:
Don wrote:

Suncoaster wrote:
Is it safe to cut an old Ultrafire up to see what’s inside ?

 

If it’s a fake, perhaps.

 

If it’s genuine it could be a bad idea – there is quite a lot of energy in there and if it gets out all at once it could spoil your entire day.

At the very least do this outdoors, downwind of things like people that you care about.

Wear hand, eye and face protection and make sure you stay upwind of the cell.If it does get energetic, the fumes are really nasty.

 

Most likely, nothing will happen, but it could get a bit exciting.

I have cut open a few. As above but bring battery down to 0 volts as you are going to destroy it, no? To cut into a charged or partially charged cell could get interesting.

The cells I cut were the brown and gold wrapped “protected 4000 ma” batteries. Well, it did say so on the label! Reviewers on Amazon give this cr@p 5 stars?

Hopefully some slick lawyer could nail Amazon then it could start to roll down hill on the importers to stem the flow >)

What did you find inside when you cut open those Brown & Gold wrapped 4000 ma cells?

Suncoaster
Suncoaster's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 59 min ago
Joined: 02/22/2012 - 07:14
Posts: 2097
Location: Where the girls are green and the grass is pretty.

I notice that 18650s are beginning to appear in other products such as this radio:
Tecsun pl-880
I’m sure the radio community will receive the 18650(kHz) message.

"In the land of the blond the one eyed man is king."

*This message is protected with ROT26 encryption.Old Lumens

BanglaBob
Offline
Last seen: 2 days 22 hours ago
Joined: 10/11/2010 - 23:09
Posts: 895
Location: The Little Red Dot

When I first started “playing around” with cree lights I bought some grey/blue trust~ultrafire 18650’s as I didn’t know any better back then. It’s only when I got myself some lights with some serious firepower that I realized that those ****fires were junk. These days I’m more picky about the cells I use. I would also avoid any super-cheap deals on batteries as well. More likely than not they’ve been pulled out of old laptops and re-labeled. Flat Stare

Lights out! That's when things get interesting...

Pages