Roche F6 hacking

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Cereal_killer
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Yup, thats fixed real good now!

 RIP  SPC Joey Riley, KIA 11/24/14. Now I am become death, the destroyer of worlds.

comfychair
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http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08448.jpg

RaceR86
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Looks tasty! Smile

BLF LED database – collaboration spreadsheet and latest news about where to buy LEDs
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/19342

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comfychair wrote:

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08448.jpg

OOOOH SNAP!
comfychair
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It's also got two battery level indicators with separate limiting resistors, run by MCU pins 3 & 5... though I have no clue how to alter the code to make them work. Blushing

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08453.jpg

I think the switch pads are set up to work with either the SMD or thru-hole switches though I haven't checked yet. I have both switch types on hand already.

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Helios would have to ‘splain

comfychair
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Well I understand the PCB layout, the indicator cathodes are both tied to ground, and the anodes come from the resistors. So outputting voltage on pin3/5 will turn the LEDs on. It can use the original Nanjg voltage divider for sensing, and the rest is all in the code for how fancy you want it to be. With the two LEDs both shining at the little faux-fiber optic pickup thing in the light you could even get a third color by turning on both pins at the same time.

comfychair
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I have one assembled and working after more than a little frustration. First try, I relocated the capacitor to between the B+ spring pad and the tab on the frame of the switch... it didn't work. A short press would give the shortest, dimmest blink from the LED, it'd do that once every time the switch was pressed. A long press would give 100%, but then any press of the button of any length would turn it off. I went poking around with the DVOM and found the switch frame isn't ground, and there's really no practical place to put the cap where it can connect to B+ and ground anywhere on the board without blocking something else. So, I tried the cap-in-parallel-with-D1 version... still didn't work. More poking, checked the cap with the meter, found I somehow picked a 1uF cap out of the little parts organizer bin instead of a 10uF. D'OH! OK, so swapped in the correct cap and... guess what? Still didn't work!

I eventually got it running, but only by putting the cap back in the original spot (after the diode) and using the stupid 130 ohm gate resistor. It's stable like that, which I guess is better than not working at all. Blech. Sick

comfychair
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Ignore the ugly, this is the first one built ever and it took more than one try.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08456.jpg

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08458.jpg

Nothing at all to see here, which is kinda neat. Smile

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08460.jpg

XML2 T6 3B, 10* TIR (disassembled until the mucking around is finished), .020" thick x 7.5mm centering ring. Blue thing is a .028" thick spacer to go under the original o-ring, to bring it up above the top level of the TIR holder. Backside of the stainless bezel needs to be shaved down by around .025" to get it all fit together right - unless I can find a thinner lens, haven't checked that out yet. Stock one is 24mm x 1.54mm.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08461.jpg

 

wight
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I’m still tuned in and watching this, I simply have little of value to add.

I read your post, but I’m not 100% clear. I know it may not fit in the light this way, but did you try to put the 10uF cap between BAT+ & a real GND for testing?

Still fine, still on a break. One day I’ll catch up with you folks! previous wight catchup Wink
list of my drivers & variants (A17DD, FET+1 stuff, WIP stuff, etc)

comfychair
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To do that would require connecting one side or the other with a wire. Or maybe easier, use a wire to ground the frame of the switch, then put the cap back where I first tried it, on the battery side. Or put it on the correct pads, but cut the trace and tie it onto the other side of the diode. I'm not sure it would work anyway, since it didn't work with the cap+diode piggyback method that worked fine on the other boards.

wight
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Gotcha. I think I misunderstood something about the layout when I glanced, and I don’t have more time than a glance right now ;-). For now it’s useful just to know exactly what you tested (which you’ve clarified for me, thanks).

Still fine, still on a break. One day I’ll catch up with you folks! previous wight catchup Wink
list of my drivers & variants (A17DD, FET+1 stuff, WIP stuff, etc)

comfychair
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The layout is pretty good, there's not really any one thing that blocks any other thing or makes any part of it too difficult. There's even just enough room for the programming clip without removing the LED wires. But there's not any spare space for moving things around, either.

WarHawk-AVG
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I wonder if Helios will issue a Version 1 update with the capacitor moved before the diode…if he does that then he can remove the gate resistors all together actually removing all the components from the battery side

comfychair
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The only stuff on the battery side now is for the two battery indicators. And I'm not sure yet if the relocated cap will let this one work without the gate resistor. When I tried the cap in parallel with the diode, it didn't help it even a little bit. The stupid gate resistor is the only thing that had any effect at all. Sad

I think the only way to free up more space on the topside is to switch to a smaller FET. The gate/pulldown resistors are already well out of the way, there's not really any space freed up by getting rid of them.

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I was looking for a decent small 1×18650 host with an electronic switch to use as a mod host, specifically for custom firmware. I tried to order a ZY-T29 from fasttech, but they cancelled that part of the order and marked it as discontinued.

Is the Roche F6 a good option? It looks like it may be more difficult to make it work with a different driver.

The ZY-T11 might be okay, but I don’t like its charging port. I’m hoping to find something I can leave underwater for hours at a time since at least one unit will become part of a water fountain.

I suppose the UF-T50 might be an option, though it’s a bit pricey.

Anyway, just looking for a good host which won’t be too much trouble to reflash and/or replace the driver.

syracuse
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I put DrJones simodrv in a 17mm to 20mm Brass Ring from IOS, and attached them to the back side of the original driver.

!!

!!

comfychair
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ToyKeeper wrote:
I suppose the UF-T50 might be an option, though it's a bit pricey. Anyway, just looking for a good host which won't be too much trouble to reflash and/or replace the driver.

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/30336 Smile

comfychair
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comfychair wrote:

I have one assembled and working after more than a little frustration. First try, I relocated the capacitor to between the B+ spring pad and the tab on the frame of the switch... it didn't work. A short press would give the shortest, dimmest blink from the LED, it'd do that once every time the switch was pressed. A long press would give 100%, but then any press of the button of any length would turn it off. I went poking around with the DVOM and found the switch frame isn't ground, and there's really no practical place to put the cap where it can connect to B+ and ground anywhere on the board without blocking something else. So, I tried the cap-in-parallel-with-D1 version... still didn't work. More poking, checked the cap with the meter, found I somehow picked a 1uF cap out of the little parts organizer bin instead of a 10uF. D'OH! OK, so swapped in the correct cap and... guess what? Still didn't work!

I eventually got it running, but only by putting the cap back in the original spot (after the diode) and using the stupid 130 ohm gate resistor. It's stable like that, which I guess is better than not working at all. Blech. Sick

And another D'OH! I just realized why the cap/diode piggyback version didn't work, I totally forgot that one still needs a 10uF cap in the original spot. So, effectively, I never did either the V01 or V02 version fixes correctly, so it still may work with one of those and without the gate resistor.

wight
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Good. While that’s a “DOPE!!” type moment, I bet it makes you feel waaay less crazy, right?

Still fine, still on a break. One day I’ll catch up with you folks! previous wight catchup Wink
list of my drivers & variants (A17DD, FET+1 stuff, WIP stuff, etc)

comfychair
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The F6 tail spring sucks donkey balls. It needs to go away unless you like adding resistors to your lights. With a DD driver I don't want to think about how hot the stock springs will get.

Cut a copper round to the same size or a little smaller than the stainless plug.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08501.jpg

Before removing the spring, mark the spot to cut so that when reinstalled it won't overlap at the ends.This part needs to go back in to fill in the groove, otherwise the copper round can shift out of center.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08502.jpg

Stick the spacer ring back in the groove. Once in it can stay there, shouldn't ever have to worry with removing it later.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08503.jpg

File down the copper until it'll fit inside the spring-ring-filler thing, it has to sit flat on the lip at the bottom of the bore.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08504.jpg

Solder on your favorite spring, drop in the new spring plate, add a little silicone grease down in the corner between the copper and the bore, and hammer the stainless plug back in. It's not that tight, but it seems to be tight enough that it shouldn't need Loctite or anything of the sort... if yours is a bit loose, some Loctite wouldn't hurt anything. The electrical connection will be between the copper plate and the tube, so anything you put on the other side won't affect that part.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08506.jpg

comfychair
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Helios has done gone missing. :_(

comfychair
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Nothing succeeds like success, or so I've heard.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08517.jpg

Close-up of the fix. Of course, as with nearly everything, once you've figured it out it's simple.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08450.jpg

 

By the way, this is NOT a good combo. It's OK on a normal low-drain cell, but stick a 25R in it and the li'l 219B turns blooooo. It's been a really long time since I've seen that happen, with any LED.

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08522.jpg

wight
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I checked your diagram. Looks like this is the move-the-cap-before-the-diode fix after all, right? What did it turn out was the problem with that fix the first time around?

I’m posting a link to your post over in Mattaus’s Medusa thread, he recently torched a 219 DD IMR cells so he’ll be a little interested in more evidence that you “shouldn’t do that”, heh.

Still fine, still on a break. One day I’ll catch up with you folks! previous wight catchup Wink
list of my drivers & variants (A17DD, FET+1 stuff, WIP stuff, etc)

comfychair
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Yep, cap on B+ instead of Vcc.

The first attempts were a pile of fail, between not checking to see if the switch bracket was actually ground, and using a 1uF cap instead of 10uF, and then to top it off, trying the cap with the diode piggybacked but forgetting it still needed a second 10uF at the original C1 spot.

wight
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Gotcha, sounds like a normal evening at the workbench for me (hooking things up all kind of crazy and then realizing it later).

I’m glad you got it working now, and no smoke came out!

Still fine, still on a break. One day I’ll catch up with you folks! previous wight catchup Wink
list of my drivers & variants (A17DD, FET+1 stuff, WIP stuff, etc)

comfychair
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I think I know what happened with the blooo Nichia... and it's another D'OH!

I ran out of the 10* TIRs and re-used the original reflector. But I forgot that my XP-to-XM adapter centering pieces are really really REALLY thin, the flat the reflector sits on is only around .010-.012" thick. These F6's originally used the semi-transparent butterfly centering pieces, and those are around .035" thick on the flat part. I completely totally utterly forgot to do anything to compensate for the dramatically thinner spacer, and the design of this light makes the stack height there critical.

The lens o-ring sits on its own little shelf around the OD of the reflector, so even with no reflector in the light the bezel & lens compress the o-ring, and the bezel feels nice and snug when you screw it down. The MCPCB+insulator+reflector have to be tall enough to clamp it all together, yet not so tall that the o-ring under the lens doesn't get compressed enough to seal. Get it wrong and heat transfer goes all to shit. Which is exactly what happened. When I swapped the 219B for the XPG2 I used a different, thicker centering piece and never gave any consideration to the effect on the stack height. Which is why the XPG2 handles a 25r just fine, but the 219B didn't.

The 219B will survive DD from a 25R, which I should have known since I have a Kung (so one cell per LED) with 219Bs on the same 16mm Sinkpads and I only run that light on 25Rs, and it doesn't turn blue. Because in that light, the four MCPCBs are clamped down nice and tight by the Kung's center screw from the pill to reflector. Sheesh!

comfychair
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http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08578.jpg

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08600.jpg

http://75.65.123.78/RocheF6/Dsc08581.jpg

 

The machined step in the head is just to locate & center the 3XP board, it's cut deeper than where the top surface of the plug/spacer will end up.

priest77
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I’ve just received F6 that I’ve ordered from FT but it seems to me to be the same as the one on banggood.
It has memory and my biggest problem is that I can’t find any lens for low battery indicator, and I don’t want it without that.
Can I turn it back or ask for refund?
Here are some pictures:

P.S.
Does the one from banggood has that low battery indicator or no?

Here is the difference:

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http://blackshadow.en.alibaba.com/product/1920725783-218694099/StarryLig...

Black shadow makes the F6 also and has the same driver pictured above. Their version has 4 little resistors and one missing.

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