Convoy S2+ failing a ~75cm drop...

29 posts / 0 new
Last post
MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™
Convoy S2+ failing a ~75cm drop...

Well, was on my bedside table and while putting it on it, I missed the table. Fell head first on the floor and stopped working. I unscrewed it and this is what I saw….The LED has detatched so has the plastic…

Anyways how to fix it? This has been my EDU flashlight but I am less than impressed it did not survive such a low fall when Simon shows much much more on falls….
This was bought from Gearbest. I doubt it will be worthwhile to engage with CS for a replacement/fix Big Smile

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

bmwsancho
bmwsancho's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: 05/08/2015 - 12:56
Posts: 531
Location: California, USA & EU

i have dropped my S2+ several times already, even in my garage onto a tile floor. nothing happened.

guess you have to reflow the emitter.

if you don’t have a reflow hot air station you can make do with a hot plate or a regular heat gun.

MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™

bmwsancho wrote:

guess you have to reflow the emitter.

if you don’t have a reflow hot air station you can make do with a hot plate or a regular heat gun.

No clue how to do this (reflow) and I don’t have any of those….What you mean by hot plate?

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

pilotdog68
pilotdog68's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 1 week ago
Joined: 05/30/2013 - 23:31
Posts: 6420
Location: Held against my will in IOWA, USA

Wow, never seen that before.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

bmwsancho
bmwsancho's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: 05/08/2015 - 12:56
Posts: 531
Location: California, USA & EU

check whether the LED is still working (I use a multimeter or a test station)

clean the emitter base plate if necessary, I would then use a no clean flux pen (or similar), put solder paste on the pads and then position the LED. you can either put this on a hot plate (like a mini oven) or reflow with hot air (gun or reflow station). Old-Lumens also had a cool video somewhere with it, found it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0IbGDyeHZ4

Otherwise example temperature profile would be here:

I never stick exactly to these temperatures but try to be as close as possible.

edit: if you don’t have solder paste try it with regular solder, it should work.

Dallas
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 9 months ago
Joined: 11/11/2015 - 22:12
Posts: 116
Location: TX
hank
hank's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 35 min ago
Joined: 09/04/2011 - 21:52
Posts: 8682
Location: Berkeley, California

A curious aside, what driver do you have in that S2+ and is the driver held by a retaining ring, or solder blobs, or both?

LAB
Offline
Last seen: 3 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 07/28/2012 - 20:39
Posts: 109
I have seen two Convoy M1’s do the same thing.
ReManG
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/25/2015 - 22:52
Posts: 2541
Location: Between the Mexico's

You could just order another LED on a Noctigon from IOS

3D XM-L2 on Noctigon

It looks like the drop did what it did by hitting just right… it is amazing how sometimes the smaller things can do such things like dedome the LED.

To replace the LED is just two wires to desolder and resolder on the new LED, about as hard as the reflow of the current LED.

ALL of my links are non-affiliated for your pleasure...

My Reviews

Lithium Ion Battery Safety 101

 

The Last Katun
The Last Katun's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 11 hours ago
Joined: 04/29/2011 - 04:34
Posts: 342
Location: Rome, Italy.

MountainKing wrote:
Well, was on my bedside table and while putting it on it, I missed the table. Fell head first on the floor and stopped working. I unscrewed it and this is what I saw….The LED has detatched so has the plastic…

Anyways how to fix it? This has been my EDU flashlight but I am less than impressed it did not survive such a low fall when Simon shows much much more on falls….
This was bought from Gearbest. I doubt it will be worthwhile to engage with CS for a replacement/fix Big Smile

!{width:75%}https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/54700356/Flashlight/Convoy%20fail%20...!

It happened to me, I have analyzed the fact and I arrived at these conclusions: (in my case)
The LED is not original Cree; for soldering is not used a good solder; LED is slightly off center and this causes a lateral thrust from the reflector, when there is a collision, even banal, the lateral thrust separates the LED from the base. Briefly: the LED was assembled cheaply and approximate.
I remedied solder it again, with good solder, and placing well in the center. The LED have not changed, but is closely supervised! Smile

pilotdog68
pilotdog68's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 1 week ago
Joined: 05/30/2013 - 23:31
Posts: 6420
Location: Held against my will in IOWA, USA

The Last Katun wrote:

It happened to me, I have analyzed the fact and I arrived at these conclusions: (in my case)
The LED is not original Cree; for soldering is not used a good solder; LED is slightly off center and this causes a lateral thrust from the reflector, when there is a collision, even banal, the lateral thrust separates the LED from the base. Briefly: the LED was assembled cheaply and approximate.
I remedied solder it again, with good solder, and placing well in the center. The LED have not changed, but is closely supervised! Smile


Cree isn’t the one that mounts them to the mcpcb. I don’t see a reason to believe they aren’t genuine Cree emitters. It looks like whoever Simon buys his emitters from is either not using enough solder paste or not heating them high/long enough in the reflow oven.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

Halo...
Halo...'s picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 6 months ago
Joined: 12/15/2011 - 02:39
Posts: 3304
Location: Halo island

But this was from gearbest. They could be buying hosts and adding their own leds. Who knows with them. Led might not have been relowed by Simon’s suppliers.

pilotdog68
pilotdog68's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 1 week ago
Joined: 05/30/2013 - 23:31
Posts: 6420
Location: Held against my will in IOWA, USA

Halo… wrote:
But this was from gearbest. They could be buying hosts and adding their own leds. Who knows with them. Led might not have been relowed by Simon’s suppliers.

Good point.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

freeme
freeme's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 58 min ago
Joined: 11/14/2013 - 22:00
Posts: 8234

It happened to my initial fake C8 batch. I suspect power quality of solder being used.

I later reflowed it with Cu MCPCB and it works fine till now.

MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™

If that counts, the light has been used on max power (10 mins or so at times) and medium modes (25-30mins average) at times.
If I just add solder and solder back the led to it, will it work again?

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

ReManG
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/25/2015 - 22:52
Posts: 2541
Location: Between the Mexico's

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/26665

Make sure the Negative pad on the LED is aligned with the negative lead pad on the board. The thread above is a good reference for figuring it out.

ALL of my links are non-affiliated for your pleasure...

My Reviews

Lithium Ion Battery Safety 101

 

MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™

The led die (square) came off the plastic too. The plastic is not properly marked + or -. I will have a closer look tonight if there are markings on it.
Thanks for this thread link.

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

LowLumen
Offline
Last seen: 18 hours 36 min ago
Joined: 09/01/2012 - 21:15
Posts: 389
Location: Sierra Foothills, CA

I didn’t think it was possible to separate a good solder bond like that.
A cold solder? Yes.

will34
will34's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 1 day ago
Joined: 12/18/2012 - 00:12
Posts: 3694

Chinese manufacturers should stop using high temp solder already, my BLF A6 had the same problem in both the driver and the mcpcb, the soldering they use are the cheapest type with high melting point and fast-burn rosin, doesn’t work long enough before the solder spreads. Also tried to desolder leads from a nitecore mcpcb and even my 40W station couldn’t do the job.

I’ve been using low-melt solder for my reflows and haven’t had any problem even with my hot rod mods. Low-melt are more expensive, but it also saves a lot of time and headache.

MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™
Dallas wrote:

Thanks. Just watched it. Looks doable!!

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

Boaz
Boaz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 8 min ago
Joined: 11/07/2010 - 09:31
Posts: 7245
Location: Birthplace of Aviation

you can do them on the stove top . use some folded up tin foil to make a small metal spatula / plate with a longish handle .. retin the star add flux and add solder …add flux onto the led base ..and the star again and put it up on the heat … pull it when you see the solder go shiny and u’ll see it ….flow
..small thin tin plate gets cool and hot ..fast

       καὶ τὸ φῶς ἐν τῇ σκοτίᾳ φαίνει καὶ ἡ σκοτία αὐτὸ οὐ κατέλαβεν

                            

       Dc-fix diffuser film  >…  http://budgetlightforum.com/node/42208

vēer
vēer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/07/2012 - 14:23
Posts: 2838
Location: N Europe

Thats odd! I hope it wont happen to mine :D!

hank wrote:
A curious aside, what driver do you have in that S2+ and is the driver held by a retaining ring, or solder blobs, or both?

Not MK, but Ive seen this question asked before and I checked mine today when changing batteries -its both ring AND solder to the ring on my red S2+ ;)!
Ordered in june, delivered somewhere in august(first came the fake one, then the genuine one).
hank
hank's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 35 min ago
Joined: 09/04/2011 - 21:52
Posts: 8682
Location: Berkeley, California

Anybody in touch with Simon?

I hate to bother the guy, I recall reading he’s busy more than full time with childcare as well as Convoy
and I know looking at the Ali Convoy page they handle far more stuff than he could possibly be handling personally.

So I don’t want to add another straw to his camel, as the saying goes.

But I’d sure like to know what he thinks is normal for the S2+ lights — and what he can identify as some third party’s changes.

It would be good to know what kind of solder is specified for the emitter-to-board — is that why this one broke off when dropped?
and whether using the threaded ring, the spots of solder, or the ring plus solder are all normal variations from him, or unexpected from some third party, in the S2+ (and other?) lights.

I complained to GB about the soldered driver I got in my last S2+, and the reply was they don’t have any more of those to send me, do I want wallet and points credit. Feh.
I’d guess that means no more cheapened ones from their cut rate supplier …. but that’s for a different topic.

vēer
vēer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/07/2012 - 14:23
Posts: 2838
Location: N Europe

Perhaps ask JDub to read this thread, he seems to have pretty good contact with Simon so he could ask?

J-Dub74
J-Dub74's picture
Offline
Last seen: 10 months 1 day ago
Joined: 03/14/2015 - 17:17
Posts: 2231
Location: Michigan

Here I am.
This is the first I’ve heard of this happening on any Convoy light. I don’t think I own a convoy light that hasn’t been dropped and I’ve never had an issue. I would like to confirm a few things before I contact Simon about this as he probably gets a thousand emails each day. Were the lights this has happened to purchased directly from Simon? As previously mentioned, items labeled Convoy coming from other sources (particularly Gearbest) may not have been assembled by Simon and several fakes have been found. As far as fake Cree emitters coming from Simon, Nope. Simon knows his stuff, would not be fooled by a fake and would never knowingly use anything that wasn’t genuine. That said any company can have a QC issue from time to time so if these are purchased from Simon’s Ali store I will certainly let him know. Simon takes pride in the quality of his products. If this is something that has happened to 3 out od 3000 lights I would suggest contacting him through his store but if this is happening to multiple genuine Convoy lights I will definitely contact him.

MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™

Thanks for chiming in.

J-Dub74 wrote:
Were the lights this has happened to purchased directly from Simon? As previously mentioned, items labeled Convoy coming from other sources (particularly Gearbest) may not have been assembled by Simon and several fakes have been found.
J-Dub74 wrote:
That said any company can have a QC issue from time to time so if these are purchased from Simon’s Ali store I will certainly let him know.

No they were purchased from Gearbest when the first batches of Convoy S2+ were released and are the genuine ones.

J-Dub74 wrote:
As far as fake Cree emitters coming from Simon, Nope. Simon knows his stuff, would not be fooled by a fake and would never knowingly use anything that wasn’t genuine.

I am positive this is an XM-L2 T6 neutral led as it compares really well to my Fenix BC30 light. No problems with that part.

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

MountainKing
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/01/2011 - 03:20
Posts: 2273
Location: Lost Islands ™

slightly OT: Can the BLF A6 A17DD-L FET driver be used in the S2+ flashlight? Does it fit? Thanks guys. Currently on promo.
http://www.banggood.com/BLF-A6-A17DD-L-FET1-2_8-4_35v-74-Modes-Flashligh...

Never ever forget and forgive. Niwal**er new kid on the block trying to act tough.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/24847
Do not support this brand.

DINODIRECTSCAM COMPANY. DO NOT BUY
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/11324?page=2#comment-254983

snakebite
snakebite's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 days 14 hours ago
Joined: 11/20/2013 - 20:21
Posts: 1883
Location: dayton oh

that had to be a incomplete reflow.i would place the emitter on the pads in the proper polarity and use a heatgun on low.
i have reflowed many emitters this way.even with a harbor freaight 5.99 special.stand it on its rear with the nozzle pointing up and hold the star at the very edge with hemostats.when the reflow occurs the led will align itself perfectly.that the stop point.let it cool and it should work again.since it didnt flow the first time there should still be enough flux in the paste.

joel95ex
joel95ex's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 1 month ago
Joined: 12/26/2013 - 21:09
Posts: 297
Location: East Texas

I would simply buy an led on a noctigon from RMM and be done with it. I have dropped my s2 many times and the only issue was a slight flicker BUT that was before I had info on pre-soldering the pill—as a result the ground was compromised