New Convoy C8 – Clearly better

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J-Dub74
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Enigma_1977 wrote:
hi,

Another question on Convoy C8, is this unit passed the IPX-8 standard for waterproofing? TIA! Smile


Yes. All versions of the Convoy C8 are rated IPX-8.
stephenk
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stephenk wrote:
roughrider wrote:
stephenk wrote:
He has said yes to both installing AR glass, and the new driver/firmware. Party Just awaiting paypal invoice info now.

Awesome. Thumbs Up


Very awesome!
Still awaiting response over PayPal details, but I’m Simon is very busy, so I’ll wait a few more days before reminding him.

All sorted. Cost $1 extra for new firmware in each Black S2+. Big thumbs up to Simon for going out of his way to keep us Flashaholics happy.
Beer Party Party Party

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J-Dub74 wrote:
Biscotti dunked in Espresso

I like that.

patmurris wrote:
I think i’d rather have it bare aluminum…

It looks like it’s silver-anodized (silver dye used instead of black). So, it should be a lot harder than bare aluminum but visually similar. A bit more shiny, and a lot harder to scratch. And if you wear through the anodizing it should be difficult to spot.

On another note, my empty Convoy C8 seems to weigh a bit less than an empty Kronos X6. It’s slightly bigger but slightly lighter. I haven’t tested throw yet but the C8 reflector is significantly larger so it likely throws a bit better. It’ll be fun fine-tuning the focus before I measure it… I kinda took it apart right away to get the driver out.

J-Dub74 wrote:
I could use a bit of help from the BLF crew here.

Life has been a little turbulent lately, but I got some pictures… A capacitor and diode are a little too close to the MCU so they prevent contact with four of the pins (of which two are needed). Someone probably just didn’t realize that SOIC8 keep-outs were needed around the MCU. It’s pretty unusual for customers to want to reflash ROM like we do.
DB Custom
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About 15 seconds with a file and your SOIC clip will fit right on there. Wink

The cap can be moved over to the next set of pads, and the diode can be swung around a bit, maneuvered to give clearance. Looks like it really is true what they say about the devil being in the details. Wink

gchart
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TK, I’ve heard the blue clips are nicer, but do you happen to have one of the cheapo black clips to test? Mine doesn’t seem to have any plastic extending out beyond the width of the MCU.

Also, do the two components (resistors?) in the center of the board interfere as well?

J-Dub74
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ToyKeeper wrote:
J-Dub74 wrote:
Biscotti dunked in Espresso

I like that.

patmurris wrote:
I think i’d rather have it bare aluminum…

It looks like it’s silver-anodized (silver dye used instead of black). So, it should be a lot harder than bare aluminum but visually similar. A bit more shiny, and a lot harder to scratch. And if you wear through the anodizing it should be difficult to spot.

On another note, my empty Convoy C8 seems to weigh a bit less than an empty Kronos X6. It’s slightly bigger but slightly lighter. I haven’t tested throw yet but the C8 reflector is significantly larger so it likely throws a bit better. It’ll be fun fine-tuning the focus before I measure it… I kinda took it apart right away to get the driver out.

J-Dub74 wrote:
I could use a bit of help from the BLF crew here.

Life has been a little turbulent lately, but I got some pictures… A capacitor and diode are a little too close to the MCU so they prevent contact with four of the pins (of which two are needed). Someone probably just didn’t realize that SOIC8 keep-outs were needed around the MCU. It’s pretty unusual for customers to want to reflash ROM like we do.

Let me address these things…

The color:
To the best of my knowledge there is no dye used at all. I believe the metallic look is caused by the light being bead blasted prior to clear anodizing. For example, If you bead blast aluminum and then clear coat it, the result is a silver look. I am awaiting official confirmation of the details of the procedure and am also seeing if we can get a just machined look in the future which should involve nothing more than skipping the bead blasting process prior to anodizing.

Throw:
My C8 lights do out-throw my Kronos X6 though I don’t have any equipment to test the numbers. The Convoy C8 with the XPL-HI throws pretty well stock but can definitely be improved if you can get the emitter a bit further into the reflector. The simplest method I’ve heard of to achieve this (modders correct me if I’m wrong) is to sand down the centering ring to make it thinner. This allows the reflector to sit a bit lower, then replace the stock o-ring at the lens with a little thicker one to make up for the difference which will probably be 0.5mm or so. I may get brave and test this over the weekend. That would be my first real mod. LOL

Chip clip:
Thank you for the pictures! That is exactly what I needed to see. I’ve already sent them to Simon along with an explanation of what would need to change to make this home-user-flashable. I don’t know how difficult it will be for them to rearrange things on that board and I can’t make promises but I will try to make this happen. If it’s not doable does anyone know of a smaller clip or clipping method?

Edit: Once again proof that I type too slowly. I see there were two possible clip solutions posted while I was typing! Facepalm

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got mine. My first light (it is convoy!!!) have few problems here and there including few scratch, just consider it “additional features”. Keep up the good work.

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Yes J-Dub74 a C8 out throws amd stays cooler then the Kronos x6
I have a Convoy C8 with the exact same driver, led and tail pcb of the X6 so have compared them side by side.

Manulous
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Just ordered mine on Ali. Waiting on the order processing now. I’ll report any QC issues here when it arrives.

BLF A6
Fenix e12
Convoy C8
Skilhunt H03
Olight S2A

Jerommel
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Flashy Mike wrote:
The Thorfire tailcap is much better.
But it’s ugly.
It’s not the “C8 look”.

2Q19

Jerommel
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Xoden wrote:
Serp wrote:
Tangra wrote:
I saw poject driver in which every 7135 was switch on end off individual. So in this case there is no PWM and efficiency is hifher in low modes because work as many 7135 as neccecary for each level.
Is there any problem using this driver in new Convoy C8.

http://forum.fonarevka.ru/showthread.php?t=28412

This. This is very convenient and easy mod for 105c. Two extra wires and new firmware. Too bad it didn’t get done here.
Though I guess even slightly altering a PCB layout is a too massive undertaking for a budget-friendly flashlight.

+1 !

It seems (to me) to be the obvious thing to do, in stead of pulsing 3 Amperes.
.
edit:
It’s been discussed further, should have read on..

2Q19

Jerommel
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So i read the whole topic, only skipped some of the chip programming stuff.
For all i care LOWMEDHIGH is enough, maybe a ‘moon’ mode too.
Finally on this page i read this, which i think is a kind of an issue:

J-Dub74 wrote:

Throw:
My C8 lights do out-throw my Kronos X6 though I don’t have any equipment to test the numbers. The Convoy C8 with the XPL-HI throws pretty well stock but can definitely be improved if you can get the emitter a bit further into the reflector. The simplest method I’ve heard of to achieve this (modders correct me if I’m wrong) is to sand down the centering ring to make it thinner. This allows the reflector to sit a bit lower, then replace the stock o-ring at the lens with a little thicker one to make up for the difference which will probably be 0.5mm or so. I may get brave and test this over the weekend. That would be my first real mod. LOL
So this is not solved in this newest version, unfortunately.

It seems the C8 is made for XM-L(2) with dome.
The base of the XM-L is thicker than of the XP LEDs, and the XP-L HI has no dome to optically raise the die.

I recently got a black C8 with XP-L HI and not only was the spacing between reflector and MCPCB too big, on the top the centring spacer shrouded the LED.
So i filed down both sides, and now it’s okay.
Looking in the head (at a certain angle) i can now see the edges of the die reflected in the reflector.
So it would be good to use a flatter centring spacer ring, with 0.7mm maximum spacing between reflector and MCPCB and lower rim around the emitter.
But, indeed, you will need a thicker O-ring in the bezel too
Or two normal ones on both sides of the lens maybe (haven’t tried that).
But the reflector now rests on the head, it can not go in deeper, even if you remove the centring spacer.

Another solution would be a thicker MCPCB, say, 2+ mm thick in stead of the regular 1.6 mm
Maybe you can discuss this with Simon, it would improve the C8 for XP (3535) LEDs.

For the rest:
I’m not too sure about the clear anno looks..
I would personally prefer it as seen here: http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/997196#comment-997196 from member vwpieces

But this seems to be polished bare aluminium, which scratches easily (or is it anodized?).
I could de-anodize my UltraFire C8 with the ‘American oven cleaner’, but haven’t found it here in NL yet..

For the other rest:
I saw a picture of a Convoy C8 with a 18350 battery tube and i love the idea.
Anyone know of a short tube that fits the C8?

For the remaining rest:
Great stuff, i’m a Convoy fan, especially the C8. (actually, i only have 2 C8s by Convoy)
Will get a grey one too at some point and hoping for that SS bezel to become available.
Simon is cool and so are all of you who participate in creating these lights.

2Q19

unknown00101
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I was getting kind of annoyed that Simon wasn’t replying to my message, but it appears he had actually replied within 4 hours and I didn’t receive an alert notification from aliexpress. Facepalm

He offered to send me a new piece of glass.

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unknown00101 wrote:
I was getting kind of annoyed that Simon wasn’t replying to my message, but it appears he had actually replied within 4 hours and I didn’t receive an alert notification from aliexpress. Facepalm

He offered to send me a new piece of glass.


I’ve noticed that you don’t always get notifications from existing message threads on Aliexpress.
Jerommel
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So i have 2 Convoy C8s, an old one and a new one.
Yesterday i braided the tailspring of the old one.
It has a brass hat (in which i drilled a hole for copper wire), it has a high current switch (parts of thick metal)
Now i’m gonna do the new one.
It has no brass hat but only a conical spring, it has a rather tiny Omten switch with thinner metal parts.
I would say, not clearly better.
In the latest version it is the same as in my new one.
But maybe (apparently) it is good enough.
Any thoughts?

2Q19

pilotdog68
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The little Omten can handle much more power than you would think. People have taken them over 20amps in real-world use. There is a thread of tests floating around by Djozz as well.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

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pilotdog68 wrote:
The little Omten can handle much more power than you would think. People have taken them over 20amps in real-world use. There is a thread of tests floating around by Djozz as well.

This^. I have used the stock tailswitch in an S2+ (same as C8 I am pretty sure) to over 17 amps and had no issues besides melting the spring before I braided it.

IIRC in the Djozz test the little switch lasted longer then the large one and only had something like 100mv of voltage drop @ 15 ish amps (been awhile since I looked it up).

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I destroyed one back in Augdue to unknown short-circuit. 

pilotdog68 wrote:
The little Omten can handle much more power than you would think. People have taken them over 20amps in real-world use. There is a thread of tests floating around by Djozz as well.

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freeme wrote:

I destroyed one back in Augdue to unknown short-circuit. 


pilotdog68 wrote:
The little Omten can handle much more power than you would think. People have taken them over 20amps in real-world use. There is a thread of tests floating around by Djozz as well.

Did the switch itself fail or just the springs?

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

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Alright, thanks for the reactions.
It’s good enough then.
Cool. Cool

2Q19

freeme
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Both. It was my very first failed switch due to high current iirc.

pilotdog68 wrote:
freeme wrote:

I destroyed one back in Augdue to unknown short-circuit. 

pilotdog68 wrote:
The little Omten can handle much more power than you would think. People have taken them over 20amps in real-world use. There is a thread of tests floating around by Djozz as well.

Did the switch itself fail or just the springs?

©freemex1thedeals.com

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If you have a spring bypass in place and get a short circuit, you can then easily melt down a switch internally, maybe even externally. That’s the thing we need to keep in mind when bypassing springs, where’s the weak link? A direct short and at some point the cell is the weak link and then we have big trouble. On really big current drain lights I like to use Arctic Alumina Thermal Adhesive on top of the contacts on the mcpcb just to make sure that if I heat it up enough to flow the wires off the board they’re still not going anywhere. Smile

Jerommel
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Decided to put in a bigger Omten anyway..
Have some in stock.
Skipped the switch PCB too, the braided spring soldered to the long contact strip (braiding inside the spring).
Only have to figure out the best way to isolate the long strip from the tail-part yet.
(edit) done. (/edit)

Did i already say how much i like the deep matte anodizing? It’s Thumbs Up Cool

2Q19

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A quick question – is that the correct .hex file that I could use to flash old convoy drivers to have new UI? Or is it adopted to the new HW already?
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~toykeeper/flashlight-firmware/trunk/view/he...

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Woytas wrote:
A quick question – is that the correct .hex file that I could use to flash old convoy drivers to have new UI? Or is it adopted to the new HW already?
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~toykeeper/flashlight-firmware/trunk/view/he...

That’s the one I used to flash some old Nanjg 105D and 105C drivers and it worked fine.

9mm/40cal/45cal bullets and large/small pistol primers available for sale in San Francisco Bay area

J-Dub74
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SIGShooter wrote:
Woytas wrote:
A quick question – is that the correct .hex file that I could use to flash old convoy drivers to have new UI? Or is it adopted to the new HW already?
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~toykeeper/flashlight-firmware/trunk/view/he...

That’s the one I used to flash some old Nanjg 105D and 105C drivers and it worked fine.

Correct. The updated firmware for the new red drivers is not available yet. When TK posts the revision that’s adjusted for the new driver both versions will remain available. There will be some info added to help people figure out which one they should use based on which driver they have.
Woytas
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Thank you very much for quick answer!

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pilotdog68 wrote:
The little Omten can handle much more power than you would think. People have taken them over 20amps in real-world use. There is a thread of tests floating around by Djozz as well.

Wellp, a 1A switch can probably handle 5A-10A or so without failing catastrophically (melting, fusing, etc.), but it absolutely does affect lifetime. Every time a switch is, well, switched, small arcs form and make small pits in the contacting surface. This ever-so-slightly increases the resistance across the contacts. And the more pitted and more irregular the surface, the worse it gets with each actuation, and the faster it degrades. That’s why mercury-wetted switches are a must for hi-rel circuitry. Thee Hg “reforms” the surface each time.

It’s like LEDs. Their lifetime isn’t rated ‘til they just up and go pouf! Instead, it’s about lumen-maintenance, and when the light output decreases to L70 (formerly L50), or 70% (50%) of its initial brightness.

So when everyone’s bypassing springs and going crazy trying to squeeze out every extra microohm of resistance to maximise current through the LED, the switch will start climbing up and up in resistance, from milliohms to fractional-ohms, and max current will drop until the switch is replaced.

And yeah, that’ll happen probably over hundreds (or even thousands) of cycles, not dozens, but it still happens. By the time it gets to that point, though, unless you’re flicking that switch a lot each day, it’ll be time to toss that light and get an XM-L5 in a Z6 brightness bin.

Eh, here ya go. Not complete, but I just took a quick look around…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relay#Undesired_arcing

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So, in other words, worry more about the carpal tunnel surgery than the $0.30 switch replacement. Wink

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I’ve seen people here grexing about limited current through their LEDs, swapping cells, bypassing springs… and they they measure a too-high resistance in the tailswitch. Well there ya go…

At 10:1 or 20:1 overcurrent, that’ll happen for sure, and every mode-change counts as an actuation.

But hey, those LEDs will be happier with lower current, so have fun!

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