New Convoy C8 – Clearly better

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J-Dub74
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JasonWW wrote:
Is the 2 speed (alternating rate I presume) strobe the new thing that helps identify the Rev 2 driver?

Yes. That’s the easiest identifier IMO.
stephenk
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Can we have the old strobe back please?

ToyKeeper
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You can have any strobe you like, if you’re willing to flash the firmware.

DB Custom
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I seem to have been remiss, I built up an old C8 with ryansoh’s copper pill and a new Luminus SST-40. This is the light that is bored for an 20700B Sanyo cell. In this configuration, it does 2628.9 lumens at start, 2280.45 at 30 seconds, pulling 9.08A at the tail.

Seems the SST-40’s are some serious little monsters!

Dale

d_t_a
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ToyKeeper wrote:
A general request for anyone who has a new C8: Could you help me check the driver speed?

All you have to do is get a clock, put the light in biking mode, and then count the pulses like measuring someone’s heart rate. Like, count the pulses for 15 seconds and multiply the number times 4, or count for 30 seconds and multiply by 2. Then tell me the number.


It should be pretty close to one pulse per second. So if it’s 40 to 80 bpm, it’s probably normal. If it’s faster than 80 bpm, it’s probably overclocked. I think mine is doing about 110 bpm.

FWIW, the approximate driver speed in MHz is: BPM * 4 * 1.28 / 60. (or, pulses-per-minute times 1280 ms per pulse at 4.0 MHz, over 60 seconds per minute)
So, if you measure 110, that means about 9.4 MHz. A value of 40 would mean 3.4 MHz. The code assumes the chip runs somewhere near 4.0 MHz.

Just saw this discussion about the driver running too fast.

I got a Convoy S2+ Desert Sand (7135×6, 3A tint) w/ the Biscotti firmware (from AliExpress Convoy store).
I also got a Convoy C8 Clear w/ Biscotti firmware (from Banggood).

I notice the Convoy S2+ is more difficult to use due to it’s running too fast..

So I did your above measurements using my cellphones stopwatch for 1 minute, bike flasher mode:
Convoy S2+: 115 times (this seems to be too fast — twice as fast)
Convoy C8: 55 times (this is within the normal range you mentioned)

ToyKeeper wrote:

Aggressor wrote:
Can you please describe all possible implications of driver running twice faster than expected?

A few implications come to mind:
  • The blinky modes blink faster
  • Bike mode’s pulses look less intense
  • The config mode has shorter windows in which to press the button
  • The “buzz” for each config option looks less like a buzz and more like a steady low
  • Changing mode groups takes half as long
  • Moon mode is probably a bit more voltage-sensitive, but I haven’t tested how much
  • The driver is basically guaranteed not to make an audible whine, since it’s oscillating too fast for humans to hear
  • The light output should look extra-smooth with no visible pulses (except maybe in moon mode)
  • LVP step-down should happen in half the time
  • The lowest modes might be very slightly less efficient, maybe a few percent

Basically, for normal illumination purposes it doesn’t make much difference. But anything involving timing goes faster. A 25 Hz strobe is outside the ideal range for tactical purposes, and when the UI blinks out numbers they’re harder to count, and configuring the light requires faster reflexes.

Chances are, the factory can fix it by changing a single digit in a script somewhere. But I’ll be sure to send in other updates too, since these new drivers appear to have nicer 7135 chips than the old ones and I want to make sure everything is calibrated correctly.

Changing mode groups is really difficult for my Convoy S2+, because the “window” to press the button is very short.

One other thing that you didn’t mention above, is regarding the voltage blinking: on a fully charged battery, I get 4 blinks with the Convoy C8, but on my Convoy S2+, I only get very fast 3 blinks (or it could probably seem like the 3rd and a supposed ‘4th’ blink are concatenated together though) Any idea if this can be fixed?

Some other measurements I did (my Mastech MS8229 multimeter is not calibrated, also I’m just simply doing tailcap current measurement which may not be that accurate):
on a freshly charge INR18650-30Q (around 4.15+ v):

Convoy C8 Clear Hi (7135×8, XP-L Hi, V2-1A tint) w/ Biscotti:
moon: 0.005A (my multimeter probably isn’t accurate/precise enough to measure this correctly though)
low: 0.050A
med: 0.30A
high: 1.20A
turbo: 2.79A

Convoy S2+ Desert Sand (7135×6, XP-L Hi, U6-3A tint) w/ Biscotti :
moon: 0.008A (my multimeter probably isn’t accurate/precise enough to measure this correctly though)
low: 0.059A
med: 0.34A
high: 1.19A
turbo: 2.11A

How come the 7135×6 and 7135×8 are using almost the same current in the various modes (other than in Turbo mode)? Actually, the 7135×6 S2+ is using slightly more current than the 7135×8 C8…

(the lowest mode or ‘moon’ in the S2+ seems to be brighter than the C8, although the C8 has a very tight hotspot)

When I look inside the Convoy C8 head, it has markings “Convoy v2” and “7135 35K”
Inside the Convoy S2+ head, it has markings “FX-12” and “7135 35B” ( not sure if those mean anything.. )

how crazy is this
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Still lovin my clear C8. One minor issue that I am wondering if anyone else is seeing. Does anyone loose the mode configuration they chose? I personally prefer mode 2. Every once in a while (I think this is the 3rd or 4th time) the mode selection goes back to default.

Not a huge deal but I have to dig out the programming instructions and it may take a few tries to hit the mode I want. Might I be doing something to cause the driver to revert back to default? It has stayed where I want it for a long time this last time but I use the light less during the summer. Pocket space;-)

Thanks,

Wade

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how crazy is this wrote:
Does anyone loose the mode configuration they chose?

No. It hasn’t happened yet, for me.

Granted, I have not used it all that much in general.

Jack Kellar
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I have two Biscotti Convoys (not the clear C8, but same driver as it) as my go-to EDC’s since May, and never had my chosen mode reset on me. Although one thing I noted on both is that if I do 3 or 4 full clicks (far less than the usual 10 rapid half-clicks), it goes into the click-buzz of config mode. Not an issue for me, though, as I only did that twice for testing purposes.

DB Custom
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Jack? Did that dude get knocked out when he hit the floor? Looks like it!

Dale

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how crazy is this wrote:
Does anyone loose the mode configuration they chose? I personally prefer mode 2. Every once in a while (I think this is the 3rd or 4th time) the mode selection goes back to default.

Yes, happend to me several times… with biscotti programmed nanjg105 drivers.

 

mortuus
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okay so i got yesterday my second c8, silver XP-L HI and i also have the gray version with XML2, so i asume i dont need anymore c8s for the moment ? is there a new version of the c8 coming up with a more powerful emitter then 1000lumens anyone knows?

thulfiqar
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mortuus wrote:
okay so i got yesterday my second c8, silver XP-L HI and i also have the gray version with XML2, so i asume i dont need anymore c8s for the moment ? is there a new version of the c8 coming up with a more powerful emitter then 1000lumens anyone knows?

There is a C8 that uses a Cree XHP-50.2 (2600 Lumens) , it was released 3 months ago by KaiDomain
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-KDLITKER-C8-2-Cree-XHP50-2-White-Neutral-White-Warm-White-2600-Lumens-5-Mode/708513_32817…….

Jack Kellar
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DB Custom wrote:
Jack? Did that dude get knocked out when he hit the floor? Looks like it!

Nope, he was fine after some 10 seconds. His Raptors suit still had some air and took the brunt of the impact. Now his ego is another matter Big Smile

DB Custom
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Good to know, thanks. I’ve fallen on an oak floor before and I know it hurts big time! Nobody saw me though, so I can only imagine the scenario in front of a large audience… Wink

Dale

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how crazy is this wrote:
Still lovin my clear C8. One minor issue that I am wondering if anyone else is seeing. Does anyone loose the mode configuration they chose? I personally prefer mode 2. Every once in a while (I think this is the 3rd or 4th time) the mode selection goes back to default.

I bought two of the new C8’s this summer, and haven’t experienced that issue.

As a wild guess, I’d say it sounds like faulty or worn-out eprom memory?

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Where can I purchase the new style c8 ? In the states

JasonWW
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Lights-Out wrote:
Where can I purchase the new style c8 ? In the states

Mtn Elec sells something close.
http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=80&pr...

It shows an xml-2 instead of xpl, though. You should ask them for details on the firmware also. Biscotti might come stock or it might be an option.

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware, lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/54477

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! http://budgetlightforum.com/node/55746

6 NarsilM user videos
http://bit.ly/narsil-vid1

sith_lord
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I just got one Convoy C8 and another Convoy C8 is en route; I am also thinking of taking 3rd Convoy C8. Smile

About the same time I ordered, I realized I could’ve bought from Simon too, however Russian site and the myriad of options turned me down – I just wanted things simple as I am very new to all this and am still learning.
Only yesterday I found out Simon’s Skype which would make things a tad easier. I read that Simon’s customer service is great and he’s willing to make a custom order or tweak some things upon request.

As I was reading about Convoy C8 in general and experience from other people who ordered from the places I did, few questions popped into my head:
1.) Are people still receiving fake Convoy flashlights, namely C8? Last time I read about such cases was 2 years ago, so I guess things got in order. (?)
2.) How does one even check if he got a fake or not? I was looking at some pictures and usually the springs are a dead giveaway, but surely a good counterfeit won’t be so easy to notice, so what should I check to be 100% sure that I got the genuine product?
3.) And what to check in general? I’ve noticed that C8 went through couple of iterations and can come in different flavors, so what kind of innards one can expect to find?
I believe that Simon has a larger offer (such as all kinds of drivers which might or might not be displayed on his Russian-written Alibaba site) than online stores who buy from him, but so far I learned of only these:
- normal and AR-coated lens
- SMO and OR reflector

I also know there are the drivers, but it seems there are many of those (from factory/stock, 3rd parties and custom-made) and people around here, who know their stuff, use all kinds of those to enhance or tune to their taste the flashlight. For example, I heard about Biscotti, AK-47, 7135×8…but I really don’t know if it’s the best/newest model out there, how to figure out the differences…and if I am already in the market for a lamp, I want to get the most for my money.

How can a newbie like me figure out which one is the right for me, especially if I focus only on this specific model?

Sorry for all the questions, but I couldn’t find answers around, let alone on one place. I am really a newbie in all this and I just started out, so any help is appreciated…

Thank you!

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Finaly got mine. Amazing beam, works like a charm. Did not expect that much from it. Just great

d_t_a
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sith_lord wrote:
I just got one Convoy C8 and another Convoy C8 is en route; I am also thinking of taking 3rd Convoy C8. Smile

About the same time I ordered, I realized I could’ve bought from Simon too, however Russian site and the myriad of options turned me down – I just wanted things simple as I am very new to all this and am still learning.
Only yesterday I found out Simon’s Skype which would make things a tad easier. I read that Simon’s customer service is great and he’s willing to make a custom order or tweak some things upon request.

As I was reading about Convoy C8 in general and experience from other people who ordered from the places I did, few questions popped into my head:
1.) Are people still receiving fake Convoy flashlights, namely C8? Last time I read about such cases was 2 years ago, so I guess things got in order. (?)
2.) How does one even check if he got a fake or not? I was looking at some pictures and usually the springs are a dead giveaway, but surely a good counterfeit won’t be so easy to notice, so what should I check to be 100% sure that I got the genuine product?
3.) And what to check in general? I’ve noticed that C8 went through couple of iterations and can come in different flavors, so what kind of innards one can expect to find?
I believe that Simon has a larger offer (such as all kinds of drivers which might or might not be displayed on his Russian-written Alibaba site) than online stores who buy from him, but so far I learned of only these:
- normal and AR-coated lens
- SMO and OR reflector

I also know there are the drivers, but it seems there are many of those (from factory/stock, 3rd parties and custom-made) and people around here, who know their stuff, use all kinds of those to enhance or tune to their taste the flashlight. For example, I heard about Biscotti, AK-47, 7135×8…but I really don’t know if it’s the best/newest model out there, how to figure out the differences…and if I am already in the market for a lamp, I want to get the most for my money.

How can a newbie like me figure out which one is the right for me, especially if I focus only on this specific model?

Sorry for all the questions, but I couldn’t find answers around, let alone on one place. I am really a newbie in all this and I just started out, so any help is appreciated…

Thank you!

Just sharing regarding the Convoy C8. I suppose I’m even a more newbie than you, since you knew about Convoy flashlights at least 2 years ago. I first saw a Cree LED flashlight earlier this year (or actually, ‘fake Cree’ as I later find out. My “real Cree” LED flashlight is only a few months ago.)

But anyway, I’ve read about the Convoy C8 from here and purchased them when I saw them on sale in Banggood and GearBest.
So I got my Convoy C8 Clear with the new Biscotti firmware from Banggood. It uses XP-L Hi, SMO reflector and has AR lens. It appears to be exactly the same as it would have been in Simon’s AliExpress store (was $1 cheaper from BG during the flash sale, if I factor in discount request from Simon — I’ve bought from Simon directly twice, previously for the Convoy S2+ Desert Sand he gave a 15% discount for BLFers if you request; recently I ordered a different flashlight from him and he gave 7% discount for it, I suppose price increased or depends on model).

The next Convoy C8 I got was from GearBest recent flash sale (I could only get the ‘flash sale’ price, but not the ‘discount voucher’ prices which are slightly lower since the discount codes unfortunately didn’t work for my country.) — anyway, I just received it — it has XM-L2, SMO reflector, and non-AR lens, and the old (5/3-mode group) firmware.

I’m not familiar with fake Convoy C8s since I ordered only from Banggood, GearBest and also Simon’s AliExpress store (I got Convoy S2+ Desert Sand with Biscotti firmware from Simon directly).

The 7135×8 refers to how much amperes max current (it affects how much total light output), but from what I’ve learned (I think the available models are 7135×3, x4, x6, x8). Each is 0.35A, so:
7135×3: 1.05A
7135×4: 1.40A
7135×6: 2.10A
7135×8: 2.80A

That’s for the max light output. But of course, the flashlight can be set to lower modes, which will then use less than max current. Less current = more runtime.
Since you’re looking for a C8 most likely for a ‘thrower’ type of flashlight, I would think you’ll be looking at the higher amps versions (2.1A or 2.8A) for max throw — you can set to lower modes anyway.

For the “old” firmware (5/3-mode groups), I remember these are set to (percentage of max current):
Low = 5% Med = 40% High = 100%
(old firmware only allows changing between the group with (5-modes group) and without blinkies (3-modes group) )

For the “new” Biscotti firmware, the default 5-modes are:
0.1%, 1%, 10%, 35%, 100%
(Biscotti allows to be programmed to have the blinkies modes in the default cycling or others — check ‘Biscotti’ firmware elsewhere in the forum for more info, eg. battery check mode)

You can also select the tint from the official AliExpress store (BG and GB also has tint selection usually). I’ve grown to like a more neutral-white tint (3A or 3D), but the cool-white tint (1A) is slightly brighter.

Ok, sorry but I don’t think I answered your question: which flashlight is right for you…

a) XP-L Hi or XM-L2?
XP-L Hi + SMO reflector + AR lens = more focused hotspot (ie. light throws a bit further)
XM-L2 + OP reflector (no AR lens) = less focused hotspot (maybe slightly wider spill), but since it uses the same C8-sized reflector, it is still throwy (just slightly less than the one above)

b) new or old firmware?
The new versions of C8 (typically the “Clear” or also called “Silver Anodized”) already use the XP-L Hi + SMO + AR by default, and if ordered from Simon directly, it should be using Biscotti already (but verify to be sure).
If ordering from elsewhere (BG, GB, etc.), then you’ll need to check if it still uses the old firmware or not.

I would recommend the new firmware since it’s much more configurable (unless you don’t like too many modes — but those can be programmed in Biscotti),

c) tint
I think this is more personal and subjective… cool-white or neutral-white. There’s even a warmer white/yellow tint available (and seems slightly more expensive)

d) how much amps
7135×8 = max output (hotter), less runtime when used at max mode; but with Biscotti, you could program such that the “highest” mode is just 50% of max current
7135×6 = slightly less max output, if you don’t need
(not sure if there’s a 7135×3 and x4 for the C8 — these options are for the Convoy S2+ since some may not need max output for an EDC light, which the S2+ is. BTW, the Convoy S2+ also has the “new” and “old” versions, much like the C8. The “new” version will typically have XP-L Hi + SMO + AR and Biscotti — which combined makes for a smaller thrower; whereas the older one uses XM-L2 + OP + no-AR (typically available in “old” firmware only, unless you buy from Simon directly and ask him to use Biscotti on it), which is more of a flooder type)

~~~~~

And somewhat aside: there appear to be many other “C8”-type flashlights (ie. throwers) recently, which you may also want to check out, eg. the Emisar D1 or D1S — these are about twice the price of the C8 but has a better UI (judging from what I read here, as I don’t currently own one). (Emisar D1/D1S as of current pricing is around $40; Convoy C8 “new-type” around $20; Convoy C8 “old-type” around $14 with flash sale/discount codes)

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d_t_a wrote:

(not sure if there’s a 7135×3 and x4 for the C8 — these options are for the Convoy S2+ since some may not need max output for an EDC light, which the S2+ is. BTW, the Convoy S2+ also has the “new” and “old” versions, much like the C8.

You sure can if you message Simon. He’ll tailor any Convoy you want the way you want to the best of his abilities, even as far as switch boot color is concerned Glasses

Hunter
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I received Convoy C8 from Aliexpress store and when I disassembled it because I wanted to replace the driver with FET version I found out that they used wood screws to “secure” the led Facepalm I inspected holes in the flashlights head and they were threaded for metal screws as usual.
Before this I received one with one cracked AMC chip, almost split in half!

Lack of quality check Flat Stare

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