Convoy s2+ with biscotti driver

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Jack Kellar
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Phlogiston wrote:
You’re welcome Smile

I have a T4-7A S2+ myself, so you got me wondering what the Biscotti mode levels would be. The way to get me to answer questions is always to pique my curiosity!


Not to derail the thread too much of for too long, but how yellow is the 7A compared to, say, an incan lamp?

Also, any idea as to its CRI?

Phlogiston
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Jack Kellar wrote:
Not to derail the thread too much of for too long, but how yellow is the 7A compared to, say, an incan lamp?

Also, any idea as to its CRI?

I haven’t got any incans to compare with, so I can’t help you there.

When it comes to CRI, the XML2 datasheet says “Typical CRI for Warm White (2600 K – 3700 K CCT) is 80.” CRI-binned stuff is available at up to minimum 90 CRI in the T4-7A range, but I doubt Convoy will be spending the extra money for CRI-binning.

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i perosnally want red and blue convoy s2+ only with single led.not triple anymore.so sense of it..too small body.sadly..is good idea to use bistro driver for this light?no turbo timer….i want it for how long i need…fet from a6 reduce it..
also-is better to change also the led?are the leds fake leds in this lights?its a long long time,when i bought cheap light…:)

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Lexel
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Convoy uses real Cree LEDs not the most wanted and highest flux bins to keep cost low

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furball wrote:
Great info everyone – thank you! Yes – I love the orange/yellow tint and even run my laptop on the 2700k setting using f.lux. So I’m definitely getting the 7A. I want low, but I just can’t conceptualize how low is too low. I’m not looking for major output. I’ve pretty much already decided my next light will be the BLF A6 with the 3D tint.

This light is going to be for indoor use only. Its a bit hard to convey, but basically, I have 4 young kids who manage to leave things out, leave attic lights on, leave basement lights, etc., etc. Add to that, I’m often up in the middle of the night or get up really early.

I’m going to go a little against the grain here. Personally, I think you should go with the 4×7135. In fact, in your case, you may even want to consider the 3×7135. Even a 3×7135 gets around 350-400 lumens. That’s plenty for dedicated indoor use and more importantly if your kids will have access to it. The last thing you want is a 8×7135 that your kids get a hold of and leave it turned on at full power and on top of the bed or something. Not to mention that they WILL inevitably shine it in each other’s eyes. Remember that most people here are lumen junkies and we tend to recommend high output lights. In the middle of the night at home, all you need is a few lumens pointed at the ceiling if you don’t want to screw up your night vision and circadian.

Check out this post here showing the visual difference between 3×7135 and 8×7135. I think that when you see this picture you will probably agree that 3×7135 is already plenty for indoor use:
http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/976067#comment-976067

It sounds like you will be happy with the 7A tint. A warmer color temp will also be less jarring on your eyes when used at night. IMO it also looks more natural when you’re running the light on low modes. FWIW, my sweet spot is in the 4000-4500K range for a general usage flashlight.

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Jack Kellar wrote:
Phlogiston wrote:
You’re welcome Smile

I have a T4-7A S2+ myself, so you got me wondering what the Biscotti mode levels would be. The way to get me to answer questions is always to pique my curiosity!


Not to derail the thread too much of for too long, but how yellow is the 7A compared to, say, an incan lamp?

Also, any idea as to its CRI?

My oldschool Maglite incans appear VERY WARM compared to LED. In fact, I think that they are warmer than 2700K. The biggest difference in light spectrum sensitivity between incan and most LEDs are red tones. Incans pick up reds very well and blues poorly. This further contributes to the perception that incan is warmer because even if you had an LED and Incan that were the same color temp, the incan would still show much more red and the LED much more blue.

Check out the images in this post on Popular Mechanics here to get an idea.
www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/reviews/g164/incandescent-vs...

Phlogiston
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SoCalTiger wrote:
[…] Even a 3×7135 gets around 350-400 lumens. That’s plenty for dedicated indoor use and more importantly if your kids will have access to it. The last thing you want is a 8×7135 that your kids get a hold of and leave it turned on at full power and on top of the bed or something. Not to mention that they WILL inevitably shine it in each other’s eyes. […]

If I were letting kids use a modern LED flashlight unsupervised, I’d be gluing a diffuser on the front first. Even 3×7135 will produce a high intensity beam at point blank, verging on retinal damage.

SoCalTiger
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Phlogiston wrote:
SoCalTiger wrote:
[…] Even a 3×7135 gets around 350-400 lumens. That’s plenty for dedicated indoor use and more importantly if your kids will have access to it. The last thing you want is a 8×7135 that your kids get a hold of and leave it turned on at full power and on top of the bed or something. Not to mention that they WILL inevitably shine it in each other’s eyes. […]

If I were letting kids use a modern LED flashlight unsupervised, I’d be gluing a diffuser on the front first. Even 3×7135 will produce a high intensity beam at point blank, verging on retinal damage.

Yeah, that’s a good point. 20 years ago, parents didn’t let kids play with Maglites and people were warned about eye damage. Those were only 80 lumens max with a new battery.

Another thought is that even with 3×7135, with Biscotti he could program it to limit it to 50%. That would put max output at around 150-200 lumens. Still probably plenty of light indoors. Still also potentially damaging if kids abuse each other with it or accidentally shine it in their own eyes, but at least it’s less risk than other options without going the “cheap flashlight” route entirely.

Also, not sure if anyone already called this out but OP probably wants a version with the “Orange Peel” reflector since a wider beam is going to be more useful indoors.

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i will use bistro drivers for my..but which is better?A6 or X6?..

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Phlogiston wrote:
Jack Kellar wrote:
Not to derail the thread too much of for too long, but how yellow is the 7A compared to, say, an incan lamp?

Also, any idea as to its CRI?

I haven’t got any incans to compare with, so I can’t help you there.

When it comes to CRI, the XML2 datasheet says “Typical CRI for Warm White (2600 K – 3700 K CCT) is 80.” CRI-binned stuff is available at up to minimum 90 CRI in the T4-7A range, but I doubt Convoy will be spending the extra money for CRI-binning.


These are a couple of photos with three Convoy S2+ with 1A, 4C, and 7A tints. Obviously, a camera image never quite matches the human eye, but they are close. Unfortunately, I don’t have an incan to compare. I would estimate that they are in the lower end of the 70-80 CRI range.


Taken with iPhone



Taken with SLR

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This video really helped me see what these lights were capable of. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLjXZu5Xhng
Also i now use this driver with Guppydrv firmware in mine and it offers a very low low and other good modes. http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=67_11...
I hope this helps. As a side note ive got a light with the XM-L2 U2 5C tint and it seems like a perfect combo of warm and white.

Jack Kellar
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SoCalTiger wrote:
Jack Kellar wrote:
Phlogiston wrote:
You’re welcome Smile

I have a T4-7A S2+ myself, so you got me wondering what the Biscotti mode levels would be. The way to get me to answer questions is always to pique my curiosity!


Not to derail the thread too much of for too long, but how yellow is the 7A compared to, say, an incan lamp?

Also, any idea as to its CRI?

My oldschool Maglite incans appear VERY WARM compared to LED. In fact, I think that they are warmer than 2700K. The biggest difference in light spectrum sensitivity between incan and most LEDs are red tones. Incans pick up reds very well and blues poorly. This further contributes to the perception that incan is warmer because even if you had an LED and Incan that were the same color temp, the incan would still show much more red and the LED much more blue.

Check out the images in this post on Popular Mechanics here to get an idea.
www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/reviews/g164/incandescent-vs...



stephenk wrote:
Phlogiston wrote:
Jack Kellar wrote:
Not to derail the thread too much of for too long, but how yellow is the 7A compared to, say, an incan lamp?

Also, any idea as to its CRI?

I haven’t got any incans to compare with, so I can’t help you there.

When it comes to CRI, the XML2 datasheet says “Typical CRI for Warm White (2600 K – 3700 K CCT) is 80.” CRI-binned stuff is available at up to minimum 90 CRI in the T4-7A range, but I doubt Convoy will be spending the extra money for CRI-binning.


These are a couple of photos with three Convoy S2+ with 1A, 4C, and 7A tints. Obviously, a camera image never quite matches the human eye, but they are close. Unfortunately, I don’t have an incan to compare. I would estimate that they are in the lower end of the 70-80 CRI range.


Taken with iPhone



Taken with SLR


That, that right there, is really rad. Thanks, my people LOL I actually got an S2 in 4C, and I’m very pleased with the beam tint, it’s about as close to incan as I was hoping to get one day. Time will tell if I’ll like the M1 in 7A that’s on the mail better, though I think I will Big Smile
Phlogiston wrote:
SoCalTiger wrote:
[…] Even a 3×7135 gets around 350-400 lumens. That’s plenty for dedicated indoor use and more importantly if your kids will have access to it. The last thing you want is a 8×7135 that your kids get a hold of and leave it turned on at full power and on top of the bed or something. Not to mention that they WILL inevitably shine it in each other’s eyes. […]

If I were letting kids use a modern LED flashlight unsupervised, I’d be gluing a diffuser on the front first. Even 3×7135 will produce a high intensity beam at point blank, verging on retinal damage.


I can attest to that. Even on the low mode, the S2 with 3×7135 left me seeing stars once; I don’t even wanna imagine if it was on the highest mode if, by a rough estimation I’ve made, it reaches 370lm and you don’t need much more than 200 to consistently blind night-adapted eyes at a short distance, let alone with the surprisingly throwy cone of the S2.

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elwood wrote:
Another thing, if you buy directly from Simon’s (The creator of Convoy?)” store”:https://www.aliexpress.com/store/330416, you can request a driver with the newest Biscotti firmware for $1 more. It has a ton more modes than the previous firmware. You have to place your order and when you get to the step to pay, hold off and send him a message through his site requesting the new firmware. He’ll adjust the price automatically then you complete your payment. Also, the blue, red, and green versions come with a, IMHO, really nice metal tail-switch. However, it’s not as waterproof as the plastic switch and rubber boot on the grey & black version.

Can you elaborate on this?

I tried to do this (get new firmware) but there was no way to ‘hold off’ payment. Everything – address, payment, instructions to seller – was in one page and when I clicked proceed (expecting another page where I could ‘hold off payment’ as you suggest), the order was placed.

Should I cancel the order and try again? I don’t want to piss Simon off.

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You don’t click on “place order”. You simply don’t click anything “proceed” on the screen listing payment methods, you just back out of that screen and send Simon the message with the requests.

But with the order officially placed on AE, I don’t know. Maybe you two can still work things out?

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Jack Kellar wrote:
You don’t click on “place order”. You simply don’t click anything “proceed” on the screen listing payment methods, you just back out of that screen and send Simon the message with the requests.

But with the order officially placed on AE, I don’t know. Maybe you two can still work things out?

Maybe Aliexpress has changed but I don’t have any way to ‘back out’ of a payment screen. There’s only three steps.
1) Add item to cart
2) Click ‘Buy from this seller’ (takes to checkout page)
3) Click ‘Confirm and pay’

If I back out from step 3 then I haven’t really done anything other than add item to my cart. Is that what you are saying I should do? Add item to cart and then contact Simon?

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varbos wrote:
Maybe Aliexpress has changed but I don’t have any way to ‘back out’ of a payment screen. There’s only three steps.
1) Add item to cart
2) Click ‘Buy from this seller’ (takes to checkout page)
3) Click ‘Confirm and pay’

I mean back out of the screen on the browser itself, not through an in-site command.

varbos wrote:
If I back out from step 3 then I haven’t really done anything other than add item to my cart. Is that what you are saying I should do? Add item to cart and then contact Simon?

Yes, exactly. When you don’t complete step 3, Simon already has an ID of the items on your cart to use as reference.

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Jack Kellar wrote:

Yes, exactly. When you don’t complete step 3, Simon already has an ID of the items on your cart to use as reference.

Thanks, I did not know that. Thumbs Up
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varbos wrote:
Jack Kellar wrote:

Yes, exactly. When you don’t complete step 3, Simon already has an ID of the items on your cart to use as reference.

Thanks, I did not know that. Thumbs Up

Anytime!

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Phlogiston wrote:

Having said that, here are some rough and ready figures for a current-model S2+ with an XML2 T4-7A LED and a new driver with 8*7135, which I gather you’re considering:

table(table#posts). |Mode %|0.1|1|10|20|35|50|100| |Cree Spec. Lumens|~1.2|~12|115.4|222.8|~370|499.1|853.8| |Approx. OTF Lumens|_1_|_10_|_92_|_180_|_300_|_400_|_680_|

Is there any convoy or similar with all these modes (0.1 – 1 – 10 – 20 – 35 – 50 – 100)in one group. The biscotti seems to be missing 20% when in combination with the other modes.

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

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DoubleA wrote:
Phlogiston wrote:

Having said that, here are some rough and ready figures for a current-model S2+ with an XML2 T4-7A LED and a new driver with 8*7135, which I gather you’re considering:

table(table#posts). |Mode %|0.1|1|10|20|35|50|100| |Cree Spec. Lumens|~1.2|~12|115.4|222.8|~370|499.1|853.8| |Approx. OTF Lumens|_1_|_10_|_92_|_180_|_300_|_400_|_680_|

Is there any convoy or similar with all these modes (0.1 – 1 – 10 – 20 – 35 – 50 – 100)in one group. The biscotti seems to be missing 20% when in combination with the other modes.


It’s not “missing”, it was left out on purpose by TK. There’s far too little visible difference between 10 and 20, 20 and 35, and 35 and 50 to justify them being all present.

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Jack Kellar wrote:
It’s not “missing”, it was left out on purpose by TK. There’s far too little visible difference between 10 and 20, 20 and 35, and 35 and 50 to justify them being all present.

What you said is true when in flashlight mode, but not when in lantern mode. Wink

and on the first day he said "Let there be light"...

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Sorry if I ask a newbie question, but…

Has the new driver for some Convoy lights (S2+, C8) any other changes, than new firmware (Biscotti)? I mean, is it possible to run it using only 1 of the x (3-8) pieces of 7135 regulator, or it is still using all of them at the lowest modes (e.g. 0.1% and 1%) as well?

If I would like to use low Vf emitters in Convoy S2+ lights, do I have any driver choice with better efficiency, than using x pieces of 7135 regulator.
(These would be for bike lights, I would like to have a good set of low to mid-range levels, nothing above 2A, and no DD – sorry if I off this thread a bit.)

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The driver is still single channel, meaning it runs all 7135 chips at the same time. If you only want 2 A maximum, just limit the number of 7135 chips and you should be fine – otherwise you’ll have to swap in a driver with more channels.

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