[GB ended,discussion only] CRI > 80+ NICHIA 2000K-6500K [E21A/219B/219C/319A/144A/757GT-F1(Optisolis)]

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Agro
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I’m surprised that 119 without dedicated thermal pad is better than 219…

clemence
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Agro wrote:
I’m surprised that 119 without dedicated thermal pad is better than 219…

You can use the webplotdigitizer to check the total surface area between 119 and 219 package. But high performance non DTP MCPCB or non isolated MCPCB must be used.

- Clemence

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Another improvement in 119/219D is its thermally more stable. From -30C to 25C the output remains almost the same. Less output reduction in higher temperature too.

- Clemence

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djozz
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Happy surgery! Smile

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“I used to think that top environmental problems were biodiversity loss, ecosystem collapse and climate change. I thought that thirty years of good science could address these problems. I was wrong. The top environmental problems are selfishness, greed and apathy, and to deal with these we need a cultural and spiritual transformation. And we scientists don’t know how to do that.”   (Gus Speth)

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UPDATE 180702:

Full range CCT (2700K, 3000K, 3500K, 4000K, 5000K, 6500K) Optisolis added to the store. All 3 steps MacAdam.

The VR21P4 (Optisolis/757 series only) and VR21SP4 (E21A only) already shipped to Indonesia today.

- Clemence

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New Products:

VR21P4 (parallel only, 757/Optisolis only)

- The closest performance to DTP copper MCPCB.
- 1 Oz copper
- Diameter = 21mm
- Thickness = 1,5mm
- Compatible with Carclo 106xx
- Almost invisible (from afar and when lit) yellow marking for enhanced aesthetic
- Special solder footprint dimensions for precise LED positioning. Very easy to solder with DIY techniques. No more overflow solder – bumps which can impede optic placement.

NOTE:
Ignore those erroneous guide boxes, they won’t affect the board/soldering performance. The LEDs self align perfectly.
This board is sure overkill for 757 LED family, the board thermal resistance is much lower than the LED thermal resistance itself. But with some scrapings here and there this board can be used for other high power (2 pads) LEDs as well.

NF2L757GT-F1 sm273 P9 Rfh00


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VR21SP4 (larger version of VR16SP4)
!{width:100%}[url=https://flic.kr/p/Kg1Dun][img]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/834/2839321... by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/140459745@N04/]Clemence Ronald[/url], on Flickr!

New features:
- The closest performance to DTP copper MCPCB
- 1 Oz. copper
- Tighter LEDs spacings at 0,3mm
- Smooth backside
- 2,5mm holes can be tapped for M3×0,5 screws for alternate mounting options with thin heat sink plate.
- Diameter = 21mm
- Thickness = 2mm
- Almost invisible (from afar and when lit) yellow marking for enhanced aesthetic

- Clemence

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Nice! I like the good circuitry clearance around the mounting holes!

link to djozz tests 

“I used to think that top environmental problems were biodiversity loss, ecosystem collapse and climate change. I thought that thirty years of good science could address these problems. I was wrong. The top environmental problems are selfishness, greed and apathy, and to deal with these we need a cultural and spiritual transformation. And we scientists don’t know how to do that.”   (Gus Speth)

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djozz wrote:
Nice! I like the good circuitry clearance around the mounting holes!

So you can use ultra low profile (thin) flat heat screw up to 5mm head diameter. Easier to countersunk too, without having to break through the super hard ceramic.
- Clemence

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Do you recommend any driver or host for the VR21P4 and VR21SP4 to be used with? I’m thinking using the D4 as host for the VR21P4 but the driver will kill it in an instant. Will the VR21SP4 fit in the Convoy S2+?

adam7027
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For a Convoy S2+, I think, a VR16SP4 should be fine instead of VR21SP4 (didn’t try OP reflector of the XM L2 version of Convoy S2+, a TIR lens will work there for sure, I think).

For a host, which is compatible with Carclo 1062X series optics (thus, VR21P4), I received a recommendation, which mentioned, that kiriba has a spacer for Convoy M1 host. Would be happier, if there would be a host with out-of-the-box support for 1062X optics and any MCPCB, which fits under it, though.

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SKV89 wrote:
Do you recommend any driver or host for the VR21P4 and VR21SP4 to be used with? I’m thinking using the D4 as host for the VR21P4 but the driver will kill it in an instant. Will the VR21SP4 fit in the Convoy S2+?

Uhmm, I’m a noob when it comes to flashlight vocabulary. What I know is driving these Optisolis beyong 500mA/ LED is not a good idea if you care about lumen maintenance. You may laugh, but I only have one Convoy 18350 and that was a Djozz-lumen calibrated flashlight that I don’t want to open.

- Clemence

ma tumba
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Clemence, what do you mean by lumen maintenance?

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Cook the LEDs too hot, and they lose efficiency over time. They “wear out”.

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Lightbringer wrote:
Cook the LEDs too hot, and they lose efficiency over time. They “wear out”.

Correct, Djozz reported a loss of 0,5% initial output after 40 continuous minutes at 500mA.

- Clemence

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Any idea what’s the L70 rating on those LEDs?

It’s still so gradual most people probably wouldn’t even notice, but…

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Lightbringer wrote:
Any idea what’s the L70 rating on those LEDs?

It’s still so gradual most people probably wouldn’t even notice, but…

Optisolis designed for 25.000 L70. So far only calculated estimation available because it’s still undergoing the test. I predict it will reach 50.000 hours minimum judging from how well they can be overdriven.

- Clemence

ma tumba
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Speaking of heat, an optisolis at 1amp is by far cooler that a 219c at 5, so I am still confused

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Of course.

The die itself can’t handle so much power.

Of course the Optisolis will be cooler.

It’s about 3W of max power vs 20W.

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ma tumba wrote:
Speaking of heat, an optisolis at 1amp is by far cooler that a 219c at 5, so I am still confused

Thermal resistance: Optisolis = 21-27 C/W vs 219C = 4,2 – 6,4 C/W.
Substrate: Optisolis = polymer based vs. 219C ceramic based

Optisolis might felt cooler outside but deep inside the die, it’s hotter than 219C (same wattage)

- Clemence

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BAD news for you guys CCT mixer. Optisolis can’t be mixed in parallel configuration, the voltage between CW and WW is just too high. You can only mixed them in parallel within these two categories: (2700K, 3000K, 3500K, 4000K) and (5000K, 6500K).
The WW will suck up most of the current leaves the CW very dim. The reason is because WW uses 440nm pump and CW uses 420nm pump.
If you really have to mix those two groups you have to wire them in series or use current balancing driver (when multi strings present) or multi output driver.

- Clemence

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Thats unfortunate. I still Love Optisolis though

ma tumba
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Does anyone see an advantage of ww optisolii over e21a? I personally believe that below 5000k the difference in tint/cri is pretty much irrelevant

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ma tumba wrote:
Does anyone see an advantage of ww optisolii over e21a? I personally believe that below 5000k the difference in tint/cri is pretty much irrelevant

Optisolis:
- ultra high CRI
- Very cheap for its output & CRI
- VERY easy to solder
- doesn’t require special MCPCB (for “normal” applications)
- minimal “blue spike” for WW, no “blue spike” and cyan dip for CW.

The targeted applications are indeed geared towards general and luxury lighting such as those in museums, galleries, gem shops, printing labs, living space, etc…not flashlights

A good example is if we want to convert a gallery to very high CRI space. With E21, we would end up with very high cost with still less than perfect results. A diffused indirect lighting is required for lighting a space with minimal glare. A point source light source like E21 would lead to uncomfortable viewing experience. So, low to medium power LEDs are all it needs, distributed over larger area.
Even when spot lighting is needed, Optisolis paired with correct optic will do the job with much greater quality.

- Clemence

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ma tumba wrote:
Does anyone see an advantage of ww optisolii over e21a? I personally believe that below 5000k the difference in tint/cri is pretty much irrelevant

Yes, as lower an CCT and Illuminance that the less significant CRI. The main things is below of BBL. I do not tried optisolis but i do not seen difference between e21 r80/r9080 both 3000k
ma tumba
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Clemence, this is a very comprehensive analysis, and I understand most of your points. I am just wondering if there exist an application that requires the extreme cri at 3000k?

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nsl18 wrote:
ma tumba wrote:
Does anyone see an advantage of ww optisolii over e21a? I personally believe that below 5000k the difference in tint/cri is pretty much irrelevant
Yes, as lower an CCT and Illuminance that the less significant CRI. The main things is below of BBL. I do not tried optisolis but i do not seen difference between e21 r80/r9080 both 3000k

At anything lower than 4000K I too don’t see much difference in colour reproduction EXCEPT for the redness. This means 2000K R70/80 is very yellow while 2000K R9080 is very orange. I don’t appreciate the high 90+ in warm CCT, only the higher wavelengths it brings. Until there’s a R7080 then R9080 is the only way to go to get such warmth from WW.

- Clemence

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Late incoming shipment from Nichia arrived today:

This is a special E21A CCT I could not get. But surprisingly, this time Nichia has it. Based on my experience, 4500K in high CRI is not so easy to get from Nichia.

It’s D220, lower than I expected. But I see a pattern here. Brighter bin usually has higher voltage. For example earlier E21A sm403 D240 has M1 voltage bin. Voltage rank goes like this: L1 < L2 < M1
So D220 means its approximately as bright as the top bin D220 219B R9080 and lower than D240 219C R9050. It’s very good considering its domeless. Combined in quadtrix it should output approximately equal to the domed E900 144AM/AR.

- Clemence

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And 500 pieces is a good stash too!!

link to djozz tests 

“I used to think that top environmental problems were biodiversity loss, ecosystem collapse and climate change. I thought that thirty years of good science could address these problems. I was wrong. The top environmental problems are selfishness, greed and apathy, and to deal with these we need a cultural and spiritual transformation. And we scientists don’t know how to do that.”   (Gus Speth)

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