Headlight suggestion for dog sledding?

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MaleNurse
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Headlight suggestion for dog sledding?

A friend of mine does dog sledding at winter time.
She has borrowed my Skilhunt H02 for quite a while and likes it.

I’m now looking for a new headlight for her.

-It will be used winter time, +5 to -15 degrees celcius.
-Needs to be powerful, somewhere around the 900+ lumens mark.
-Ideally it should have no stepdown timer.

-Spill is the most important trait. She would prefer a little bit wider spill than the TIR version of Skilhunt h02 gives.
(The throw is good though)

-Runtime is also a factor. Which of course stands in contrast to the need of high lumens.

Preferably it should not have a separate, wired battery compartment, but that just might be necessary.

Any suggestions would be welcome.
Not sure about price range, but probably less than $150

bella-headlight
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Olight H35 Wave should be in budget, 1500 lumens/2.5 hours, 550 lumens/8 hours, 150 lumen/24 hours run times.
No step down.
Loads of flood/spill but a good bit of throw due to the high lumen output.
3 neutral white xml-2 leds so not to harsh a tint.
The 5200mah battery pack is also a power bank so can be used to charge mobile phones etc.
The fact that it has a separate battery pack also means the pack can be placed inside clothing & thereby possibly keep it warmer than if it was on your head exposed to the cold ?
I have had one for a while now & the fact it has no step down can be a big plus sometimes Smile
There is also the Olight H25 wave which has the same battery pack, a little cheaper, again no step down, with 1 x neutral white xml-2 led & 800 lumens/5 hours, 250 lumens/12 hours, 35 lumen/60 hours run times.
I think that either of these lamps, providing you can accept the separate battery pack, would work well.
They are both good quality & well built Thumbs Up

Ian

Lexel
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Olight H35 wave review says stepdown to 800 lumens temperature regulted about 8-9 minutes at room temperature

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teacher
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I don’t know anything about dog sledding. But if your looking for a self contained head light with no extra battery pack, you might at least take a look at one of these Nitecores.
I have all three, but the last one I purchased; the HC60 : has become my favorite. I like them all mind you, but there is just something about the HC60 that puts it first; for me anyway. Wink
The others are the HC50 & HC30.

Edit to add:
If interested, contact M4D M4X for money saving ‘Codes’. You’ll be glad you did… Thumbs Up

He has codes for both the CW & NW versions. Wink

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bella-headlight
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Lexel wrote:
Olight H35 wave review says stepdown to 800 lumens temperature regulted about 8-9 minutes at room temperature

Where are you getting that info from Lexel ?
I have an H35 wave & have never noticed it step down ?
This is the run times from the Olight site
mode 1 mode 2 mode 3
1500 lumens 550 lumens 150 lumens 2.5 hrs 8 hrs 24 hrs

No mention of step down & says 1500 lumens for 2.5 hours ?

Ian

Lexel
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http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/review-olight-h35-wave.42493/

Die Lampe soll nach ~7,5Minuten auf ~800Lumen runterregeln. Als ich das gemessen habe, hat sie das einmal nach ~9,5Minuten gemacht und bei der zweiten Messung nach ~6,5Minuten, was auf eine Temperaturregelung schließen lässt. Die Lampe wurde bei der zweiten Messung auch schneller wärmer, da sie noch nicht ganz abgekühlt war. Der Test fand bei ~25°C Raumtemperatur ohne Kühlung statt. Die Lampe ist sehr gut geregelt, bei der Messung blieb die Leistung so gut wie konstant.​

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bella-headlight
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Lexel wrote:
http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/review-olight-h35-wave.42493/

Die Lampe soll nach ~7,5Minuten auf ~800Lumen runterregeln. Als ich das gemessen habe, hat sie das einmal nach ~9,5Minuten gemacht und bei der zweiten Messung nach ~6,5Minuten, was auf eine Temperaturregelung schließen lässt. Die Lampe wurde bei der zweiten Messung auch schneller wärmer, da sie noch nicht ganz abgekühlt war. Der Test fand bei ~25°C Raumtemperatur ohne Kühlung statt. Die Lampe ist sehr gut geregelt, bei der Messung blieb die Leistung so gut wie konstant.​

I still haven“t seen mine step down, having said that it has not been used in anywhere near 25C temperatures, maybe 10C max.
In fact I am going to turn it on on max in my kitchen now & watch to see if it does step down Thumbs Up

Ian

bella-headlight
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Well 25 minutes so far & unless the step down from 1500 lumen to 800 lumen is imperceptable to the human eye mine is still on high.
Head unit is quite warm to the touch but not hot.
Battery pack was fully charged.
I will leave it running & see what happens Wink

Ian

MaleNurse
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Thanks for the input guys!

Both the Nitecore and the Olight seems to be viable options. You give some, you loose some in both cases. Compromises.
As long as there’s no timed stepdown i guess it’ll be fine. It will mostly be used in cold, windy conditions anyway, so the chances of it regulating because of heat are not so high.
I’ll talk to my friend again.

More options are still welcome of course Smile

bella-headlight
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I see that that review is from over 18 months ago, I wonder if they have altered them at all as mine is about 3 months old & I know it was from a fresh batch into the UK ?
45 minutes in & the metal housing of the lamp part is hot but not to hot to touch, still no step down.

Ian

MaleNurse
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bella-headlight wrote:
I see that that review is from over 18 months ago, I wonder if they have altered them at all as mine is about 3 months old & I know it was from a fresh batch into the UK ? 45 minutes in & the metal housing of the lamp part is hot but not to hot to touch, still no step down.

At what temperature are you testing it?

bella-headlight
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I also have a Nitecore HC60 & it is a very nice lamp & very very comfortable to wear (I have only just got it a few days ago & used it just the once so no long term experience but it does seem very well built).
The HC60 beam is narrower than the Olight although it does have quite a bit of spill.
The claimed throw of the HC60 is 117m compared to the Olights claimed 200m.
The Olight is much more powerful but not as comfortable IMO (the HC60 is the most comfortable head lamp I have ever worn).
In the specs for the Nitecore it says “Features advanced temperature regulation (ATR) ?
It depends what you want from the light but if it is lots of power & long run times (even if the Olight does step down to 800 lumens which I have still not seen) & you can live with the remote power pack I would say the Olight is the better lamp.
My Olight has now been running on 1500 lumens for over an hour & it still hasn“t stepped down.
The housing is hot but not to hot to touch.
I would guess my kitchen is about 18-20C.
I am going to turn it off now Smile

Ian

Rufusbduck
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Hard to beat an SRK for run time, even the crummy ones, but a bike light might make more sense since you can protect a remote pack from the cold.

Three Tanna leaves to give him life, nine to give him movement. But what if he eats the whole bag?

Scott

teacher
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Below is basically a copy of a PM I sent to a friend last night about the HC60…..
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
As far as the HC60 goes I checked it out after I saw what was being discussed on the thread.

Mine does step down after about 25 minutes on Turbo in a 75 F room with no air flow or air movement. It is really not perceivable to the eye (or at least my eye) as it does not step down a complete mode.

It just drops a few lumens and I have to be watching the beam on the ceiling to see the micro-second blink when it does it.

  • First time it reduces power is two “blinks”, about 1 second apart.
  • Second reduction is about 5 minutes later with 1 “blink” reduction.
  • No more reductions after that.

I seriously doubt that in a cold environment, wearing it outdoors and moving; that there would be little if any reduction.
I’ll have to volunteer to go to Norway as a test dummy and learn to dog sled to verify that. Big Smile

I found the chart below done by Budda in This Review of the HC60. It is a pretty good review with some good internal pictures of the HC60.

Mine did not seem to follow the graph below however. It was much longer before it stepped down the first time.
.

Testing the thermal regulation system / Nitecore HC60

.
PS: If you look in the thread you will notice Budda tests more lumens that is claimed by Nitecore. This does not surprise me as Nitecore is usually pretty conservative in their published ratings it seems.

      You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load. / Paul "Bear" Bryant ~/~\~ "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast"

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sedstar
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The spelling of the original question:

“Headlight suggestion for dog sledding”

made me want to be a BLF smart aleck…

“Well? see what tint the dog likes…”

lol

PS – hey, its FAIR… i still chuckle the first time someone (and i think it was on this site, lol) did the “let me google that for you” joke to me…

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MaleNurse
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sedstar wrote:
The spelling of the original question:

“Headlight suggestion for dog sledding”

made me want to be a BLF smart aleck…

“Well? see what tint the dog likes…”

lol

PS – hey, its FAIR… i still chuckle the first time someone (and i think it was on this site, lol) did the “let me google that for you” joke to me…

Haha! Preferred tint may vary between different breeds of dogs… Maybe I’ll just have to get it straight from the horses dogs mouth.

Smile

MaleNurse
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Rufusbduck wrote:
Hard to beat an SRK for run time, even the crummy ones, but a bike light might make more sense since you can protect a remote pack from the cold.

As it’s supposed to be a headlight (for wearing on top of the head) I think maybe the SRK will be a little overkill when it comes to size and weight. (Trying to picture it! Wink )

But being able to keep the battery pack warm is absolutely a good point. Actually haven’t thought about that. Thanks.

MaleNurse
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teacher wrote:
_ I seriously doubt that in a cold environment, wearing it outdoors and moving; that there would be little if any reduction. ….I found the chart below done by Budda in This Review of the HC60. It is a pretty good review with some good internal pictures of the HC60. Mine did not seem to follow the graph below however. It was much longer before it stepped down the first time. …. Testing the thermal regulation system / Nitecore HC60 . PS: If you look in the thread you will notice Budda tests more lumens that is claimed by Nitecore. This does not surprise me as Nitecore is usually pretty conservative in their published ratings it seems.

Thanks. Thats very helpful information.

Another issue is the flood. As stated in the OP, my friend would like a light that is even a bit more floody than the Skilhunt H02. (I don’t actually know the angle on the Skilhunt).

RobertB
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If it’s an 18650 inside the tube, the LED is going to keep the tube warm anyway. External battery pack is a different story.

MaleNurse
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The LED is going to keep it warm as long as the flashlight is in active use. When it is not actively used, i suspect the battery may get cold enough to freeze (in harsh, low temperatures). As far as I know, lithiums don’t really like that(?)

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MaleNurse wrote:
The LED is going to keep it warm as long as the flashlight is in active use. When it is not actively used, i suspect the battery may get cold enough to freeze (in harsh, low temperatures). As far as I know, lithiums don’t really like that(?)

They don’t like extreme temps high or low, thats for sure.

EasyB
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Just to clarify some terms since these can mean different things to different people: when I think of spill I think of the light coming directly from the LED without hitting the reflector. This is different than a floody beam, which is just a wide beam produced by the reflector.

TIRs tend to have narrow spill since the TIR collects most of the light that would be spilled and puts it in the beam. The reflector lights like the HC50 will have similar throw and maybe a bit smaller beam size but have a wider spill.

So, it depends on what exactly your friend wants. Spill is less bright than the beam, but it’s often useful because it illuminates things that are close, so it doesn’t have to be bright.

Making the actual beam much wider than the H02 while still keeping the same throw will be difficult; it would require much more lumen output. But if your friend just wants to illuminate more area up close, then a reflector light with wider spill might work well.

alpg88
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li ions do not, lithium none rechargeable do not care. -40° to 158°F. most lights that take 18650 will work with 2 cr123

EasyB
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Regarding Li ion cells in cold temperatures, my understanding is that you really should not charge them at low temperature, but discharging at low temp is not so bad. They will have higher internal resistance initially, but will warm up with use.

The 18650GA and 30Q datasheet quote -20C as the low temperature limit for discharge. +10C or 0C as low temperature limit for charge.

Regarding runtime, she can always carry an extra cell in an inside pocket where it will stay warm.

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Also, be aware that most single cell lights like the HC50 and HC60, and probably the H03, use buck drivers and so the light output will drop (in the highest mode) as the battery voltage drops as it discharged. The exact amount will depend on the battery, but it will drop to something like 60% by the time the battery is 50% discharged. It is not a huge drop and it is gradual, but if constant output is very important you will have to look at lights with boost drivers. Some zebralights and armytek lights have this.

Lexel
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The Skilhunt H03 regulates the output in Turbo 2 pretty good over 3 hours

With a protected Panasonic 18650B measured at 3240mAh 4.2-3V on 400mA

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teacher
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MaleNurse wrote:

I’m now looking for a new headlight for her.
  • -It will be used winter time, +5 to -15 degrees celcius.
  • -Needs to be powerful, somewhere around the 900+ lumens mark.
  • -Ideally it should have no stepdown timer.
  • -Spill is the most important trait. She would prefer a little bit wider spill than the TIR version of Skilhunt h02 gives. (The throw is good though)
  • -Runtime is also a factor. Which of course stands in contrast to the need of high lumens.

Preferably it should not have a separate, wired battery compartment, but that just might be necessary.

Any suggestions would be welcome.
Not sure about price range, but probably less than $150

MaleNurse wrote:

Thanks. Thats very helpful information.

Another issue is the flood. As stated in the OP, my friend would like a light that is even a bit more floody than the Skilhunt H02. (I don’t actually know the angle on the Skilhunt).


Your welcome MaleNurse, my pleasure. Thumbs Up

I did some checking around and as far as using LiIon re-chargables in cold temperatures, I checked several different brands and they are all pretty much like ‘EasyB’ said above. Thumbs Up

Ambient Operating Temperatures

  • Charge……… 10 ~ +45℃. (50 ~ 113F)
  • Discharge….. -20 ~ +60℃. (-4 ~ 140F)
  • Storage…….. -20 ~ +50℃. (-4 ~ 122F)

As far as the beam angle of the SkillHunt H02, I don’t know either & could not find it listed anywhere.

The Nitecorte HC60 is 100 degree’s.

I have a Skillhunt H03F also and personally, I like the HC60 hands down better than the H03F. But, that is just my personal preference. Wink

As I already said, if you go with the HC60, or anything else for that matter; be sure to contact M4D M4X and ask for a Code if you want to save money. You’ll be glad you did. Wink
And I know he has some good codes for the Nitecores, Skillhunts, and more.

Good luck and keep us posted. Thumbs Up .. Smile

Oh yeah, the HC60 comes with a 3400 mAh Nitecore 18650 battery also. Thumbs Up

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Not sure if a 7135 driver will work on 2 x CR123 but if it does it will be inefficient with more than a third of the voltage wasted. I’m personally not comfortable with lithium cells on my head so I would remote the pack or mount it on the sled, it’s what I do with bike lights, one on the bars and one on my head but both remoted. The risk/reward for wearing a cell on my forehead just doesn’t add up but that’s a choice not a rule. I use two so that one always points where I’m going and the other points where I’m looking. In this case the dogs path would always be illuminated as well. The bar mount is a wide beam and the head mount is narrower but not a thrower, just enough for look ahead.

Three Tanna leaves to give him life, nine to give him movement. But what if he eats the whole bag?

Scott

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7135 will work with 2 cr 123, it will be inefficient as you said, chips will heat up a lot, and if driver is hanging in the air will prbly trip on build into teh chip thermal protection. i used 7135 driver in my camping gazebo light, i had to heatsink both sides of driver, so it works from 6v battery, otherwise, it would heat up fast and chips would shut off, not all at once thou, but you can see light dim in steps as chips shut off.

i have a feeling, that drivers in the lights that work with 2cr123 are not your regular 7135 liner drivers, however with few exceptions, like convoy lights.

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SPAM SPAM SPAM

halolily17 wrote:
If you want a headlamp for dog sledding, i will suggest you to consider the “********** that contains a good quality and provide high quality services. The flashligth using CREE XP-G2 R5 LED, and 3AAA battery. only 2.52 inches in length, ****** delivers max 380-lumen output. Beautiful patent appearance design with compact size

I removed the references to the brand / model of light in the quote as it obviously didn’t meet the criteria.

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jch10400 wrote:
The flashligth using CREE XP-G2 R5 LED, and 3AAA battery. only 2.52 inches in length, ****** delivers max 380-lumen output.

And 3 fresh out-of-the-box AAAs would give you 380lm for maybe 10sec before dropping down asymptotically to 0.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

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