Just curious where these little nasties come from.
S2, 20mm 90° TIR, that’s it. It didn’t like my Boruit, as the beam was dreadfully ringy (different LED shape, I imagine), but in the S2, it’s a bit less so. When you sweep the light across the room, you can see the rings show up more, but it’s… tolerable.
I was going for something akin to a zoomie in full flood mode, and didn’t want to make it a mule, so I figured a wide-angle TIR would do. And for the most part, it does.
Anyway, what does bother me are the “hour marks” in the beam. Just like with an analog watch without numbers, just 12 marks for the hours, that’s what it looks like in the beam: small dark radial “notches” around the periphery. They’re irregular, definitely not regularly spaced, seem almost like dirt on the lens and/or the LED, but cleaning, blowing, swabbing, etc., on both the TIR and the LED’s dome, and nothing’s improving the beam.
Anyone have experience with “cleaning up” a TIR beam?
Was, then no. Strangely enough, not much if any difference. Odd, as I thought TIRs were unusually picky about placement.
In my RJ02, the same exact lens has a rather hideous beam. Like a bullseye with light/dark/light bands. Could be the shape/size of the chip itself (non-Cree G-sized, I think). It seems to be a bit smoother in the S2+. Still a bit ringy, but those nicks around the periphery are more distracting.
I’ve been testing my TIR lenses (I have 6 different that fit the S2+, with XML2 U2-1A), and the lenses that have a “clean front” (meaning, not pebbled nor frosted) have more tendency to suffer from slight misplacements and LED shapes. This may be the biggest reason, as the lenses are more suitable for some types of emitters.
The wires inside the LED itself seem to appear on those “clear” lenses in the S2+.
The same exact thing happened when I was testing the TIR lenses in the Amutorch: the reflection produced by the clear front ones tended to let the wires be seen on the beam.
Also, I noticed that these lenses, if they have the minimum scratch in the interior hole (for the LED), or if the LED has dust or any anomaly, it will appear for sure with these lenses. Specially if they are “wide” (60º and more). Narrow beams tend to hide those things.
About the plastic holders, what I felt was that they help to “hide” the lenses imperfections (scratches) outside the middle space (for the LED). I guess the reflection of light may suffer any “cleansing” with the holders.
I cropped some of mine holders too help to fix the lenses and to give a back support, to clean the beam.
Yeh, same like SMO vs MOP reflectors. They hide a multitude of sins.
Hmm, good idea to check that. I noticed some dark spots in 4 corners, not sure if that’s from the corners of the chip or the flats. Maybe a flip-chip (G3, etc.) wouldn’t have that.
Yep, that’s why I tried cleaning the crap out of it. Might’ve missed some, or, thinking of it now, maybe it’s small chips or cracks from pushing the lens out from the shoe (from the LED side).
I haven’t really noticed much difference in white vs black holders. Not that I was looking for any, but never really struck me as too much if any difference. As long as they don’t contact the surface of the lens (curved part) to interfere with the internal-reflection, it shouldn’t matter. It’s above the critical angle.
Will look to see the position of the chip and any wires. Maybe those are the culprits…
Oh yeah. On the 5°, the edges of the “hole” are razor-sharp.
I push the wires out towards the outer edges before popping in the pill.
It’s lens first, flat side-down, let it rest against the inside of the “bezel” (none really on the S2+, but…). Then, start screwing in the pill after pushing the wires as out-of-the-way as possible. Then get it really close, make sure the LED’s down goes into the hole of the TIR while slooooowly snugging it up as much as possible. Then, clamp it down with the ring-pullers.
Of course, there’s no O-ring between TIR and “bezel”, so it ain’t gonna be watertight. Then again, didn’t notice any between front glass and bezel when running the reflector, either. Hmm…
Nb: Contact is iffy at best with flat-tops. The TIR without the shoe is a few mm shorter now, and I can’t count on the springs making solid contact anymore with the cell, not if a flat-top. When it flickers and goes mental when rapping it with my palm, you can tell it’s “scratchy”.
Yeah, i have the same problems with wide angle TIRs.
Some are good, many make a bit of a mess of it.
Sanding a matte finish on the front surely helps.
I have some more wider angled TIRs on the way, hope they’re okay.
All of these have been generic uxcell TIRs from Amazon. The narrower angles, I never had any problems whatsoever. 90s and 120s, hmm, seem to be ringy. The 60 I have in my Boruit and other S2+ are absolutely beautiful, as smooth as an aspheric.
I gotta say, even with the rings and other nasties, the wide-angle in the S2+ is quite nice as a flooder. I can picture using this in winter on icy paths/sidewalks, gawking at what’s inside a cabinet, etc. If scuffing it up helps, that’d be quite nice!
Yup, check the wires of maybe the corners. I took a picture of the Amutorch with one of these wide angle lens, and the artifacts where there, those from the lenses, the led, dust…
I just use a black holder in a modded light with pebbled lens, but I guess it doesn’t interfere that much too. However, maybe some artifacts become less visible using those holders in wide angle lens. IDK, maybe the reflection hides them!
Never tried to compare, though :person_facepalming:
Take a look at the wires and the centering, it may be that issue. One thing I noticed is that these lenses get scratched really easy. Frosted or pebbled are better in that way
My problem was that after screwing in the pill, I really “screwed”, because the wires were hot (high mode, with a Sony VTC6!!!) pressed against the plate and in contact with plastic. It started to melt and to make a short! I wasn’t able to center it correctly, so screwing in was even worst. The driver spring shrunk, just so you know
Next time I’ll be careful! I guess
Yeah, without the holders, most of the lenses leave a gap in the top, that can be compensated with the glass lens, although it doesn’t make sense! The best way to go is to get a lens with holder appropriate to the type o LED we have, and with the right diameter dimmensions.
With the pebbled lens and the holder I was able to use a o-ring to seal (maybe not perfectly, though) the head! With the flat lenses it is not so easy…
I got the same kind of shoe as you show above: white, with the square XM-sized hole. That press-fits down the S2+ tube to the very front, but you also have more of a gap between that and the bezel. The nekkid lens sits flush.
The issue is that without the holder there is the gap. I had to cut the holder (in the side gaps), to make it fit in the “bezel” and to accomodate to the lens. That way it fits, fills the gap and helps centering. But it was that that made me cut the wires, because it is difficult to align it…
Ahah, did you find it? Or did you have to use another flashlight to seek it?
Hope you can solve the “artifacts” on the reflection :+1:
Mostly dealing with triple builds I have found that fit of the TIR makes a big difference. Not sure what you were getting from Amazon but most TIR are sold for those 1W, 3W LED Bead type emitters. Where the hole is too big for the Cree as we know it.
Think I put a link in MascaratumB Amutorch thread for some TIRs that fit Cree XM and XP on AliExp.
Scuffing the lens I use 400 grit Used piece of wet sand paper. Cross hatch like a tic tac toe board.
Most of the Uglies I have encountered were the XP-G3 but that was more Colors around the spot or tint shift I think its called.
Only thing I can think of is the 4 sides of the emitter base making some weird 3, 6, 9, 12 o’clock artifacts.
Rings may be from the step in the top of the TIR if you are putting glass over it. For that I would not use glass over and have the step seated into the bezel.
Are you using a reflector spacer? Just a thought if the TIR don’t quite fit, may help.
I have actually found my TIRs to really not be too picky at all with emitter placement as long as all of the light makes it into the lens. Within 6 inches where the die shape is projected the misalignment is noticed, but beyond that it doesn’t seem to matter a whole lot.
Just picked up the whole range from 5 to 120 on eBay, waiting for them to come in.
I also picked up a couple interesting elliptical TIRs to try out in a headlamp, I feel like the extra width horizontally while keeping the beam fairly tight vertically will be nice for that application.
Generic uxcell! TIRs. No idea from where they’re sourced.
Narrow-angle ones don’t care what you feed ’em, as I’ve had ’em in front of XM-Ls, XP-Gs, “bead” type emitters, you name it.
Yeah, most of the come-with holders are for the beads, but even nekkid, they work fine for XM-Ls. Even on my RJ02, sandwiched right up onto the LED, it gives a nice wide smooth beam (60°).
I was thinking of just “swirling” it to get a nice even “frosted” front.
Nope, no glass. Wanted to try it to see if it’d provide extra space to let the springs make better contact against the cell, as the flat-top seems to be way too short w/o the reflector eating some room.
