Possible host for Flood + Throw? (MF03 style)

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beam0
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Possible host for Flood + Throw? (MF03 style)

Came across this dive light today and it reminded me of the concept of the upcoming Astrolux MF03

So I had the thought, could it be modded to work that way? (for flood + throw) by installing a dedomed / HI emitter in the center reflector,
and maybe XP-L’s or XM-L2’s around it (looks like lettuce bright LED’s currently) I’m curious how the LED’s are mounted in this.

It has a magnetic selector ring switch with: OFF-LOW-HIGH-STROBE ….so maybe it could be rewired for OFF-FLOOD-THROW-BOTH ?

It has 6× 18650 configuration…
I’m not sure but it appears each pair is in series, then the 3 pairs are paralleled with each other, for 8.4v total?
So I suppose it’s running some sort of buck driver.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Tactical-Waterproof-Diving-10000lm-9x-CR...
.

…………………………..Diving Flashlight 9000Lm…………………………………………………………Astrolux MF03…………………………………
.

.

.

  • Aluminum smooth reflector
  • Size:73mm(D) x 207mm(L) x 52mm

Maybe it won’t have Ur-anus-fire branding on it! Silly

It’s also listed under SkyRay and VastFire branding:

SkyRay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SKYRAY-18000Lm-9x-CREE-XM-L2-LED-Underwater-100...
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/18000-Lumens-9-L2-LED-Diving-flashlight-...

VastFire:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/25000Lm-9x-XM-L2-LED-Underwater-200m-Scuba-Divi...
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/18000Lm-9X-XM-L2-LED-Underwater-100m-Scu...

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Edited by: beam0 on 04/14/2018 - 21:04
SKV89
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Wow this does look very good. But with only 6 batteries, output will be limited, if you would be swapping in xhp70.2 emitters if that would even fit.

Werent MF03 was supposed to be using 70.2 emitters.

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SKV89 wrote:
Wow this does look very good.
Yes with the larger center reflector it seemed to be set apart from the usual multi-emitter budget lights, and more like the MF03 concept.
But I’m sure it would be quite an extensive (but fun) mod to pull it off.

.

SKV89 wrote:
Werent MF03 was supposed to be using 70.2 emitters.
Yes:

MF03 LED configuration:

7 pcs Cree xhp70.2

and

one Cree xhp35 hi

.

SKV89 wrote:
with only 6 batteries, output will be limited, if you would be swapping in xhp70.2 emitters if that would even fit.
Not sure how many cells the MF03 was suppose to be running?

Maybe XHP50.2’s would fit best, since the die size is the same as XM-L’s that’s already in this.

Then maybe an XHP35 HI for the center spot, but more complications for running a 12v and 6v emitters in the same light, although XHP50.2 are also available in 12v I believe. Or maybe a sliced SST40 for the spot, if 3v/6v would be more doable.

.
One thing that might be an issue is if the reflector in this thing is plastic.

EDIT: (It’s aluminum!)
Reflector: Aluminum smooth reflector
Aluminum alloy mirror surface reflective cup (better heating diffusion, better endurance)

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I’m thinking the MF03 has a much larger head.

This dive light’s head is 73mm…
I did a quick percentage calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector using the photo, and I’m coming up with 25.5mm

Not much throw to be expected from a 25.5mm reflector.

~ ~ ~ ~

In the MF03 thread someone estimated the head at 120~130mm

So my calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector in the MF03 is about 45mm.

And it’s probably deeper too, so we can expect some throw from 45mm, but 25.5mm not much.

~ ~ ~ ~

But it was okay to dream for a bit right? Smile

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beam0 wrote:
I’m thinking the MF03 has a much larger head.

This dive light’s head is 73mm…
I did a quick percentage calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector using the photo, and I’m coming up with 25.5mm

Not much throw to be expected from a 25.5mm reflector.

~ ~ ~ ~

In the MF03 thread someone estimated the head at 120~130mm

So my calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector in the MF03 is about 45mm.

And it’s probably deeper too, so we can expect some throw from 45mm, but 25.5mm not much.

~ ~ ~ ~

But it was okay to dream for a bit right? Smile


Yeah…
I’d like to add that I really hate the amount of dead space on the MF03 head. By dead I mean “not reflecting light forward”.
This light shows how this should be done.
But maybe it would be more expensive at larger size.
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Agro wrote:
beam0 wrote:
I’m thinking the MF03 has a much larger head.

This dive light’s head is 73mm…
I did a quick percentage calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector using the photo, and I’m coming up with 25.5mm

Not much throw to be expected from a 25.5mm reflector.

~ ~ ~ ~

In the MF03 thread someone estimated the head at 120~130mm

So my calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector in the MF03 is about 45mm.

And it’s probably deeper too, so we can expect some throw from 45mm, but 25.5mm not much.

~ ~ ~ ~

But it was okay to dream for a bit right? Smile


Yeah…
I’d like to add that I really hate the amount of dead space on the MF03 head. By dead I mean “not reflecting light forward”.
This light shows how this should be done.
But maybe it would be more expensive at larger size.
I agree, a lot of wasted real estate on that MF03, they could make larger reflectors in there.

.
On the extreme end of that thought, I just found this one today!… Smile


But the head is still only 70mm.

https://www.dhgate.com/store/product/super-bright-sky-ray-king-25000-lum...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SKY-RAY-KING-14xT6-14xCree-XM-L-T6-25000...

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Agro
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beam0 wrote:
Agro wrote:
beam0 wrote:
I’m thinking the MF03 has a much larger head.

This dive light’s head is 73mm…
I did a quick percentage calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector using the photo, and I’m coming up with 25.5mm

Not much throw to be expected from a 25.5mm reflector.

~ ~ ~ ~

In the MF03 thread someone estimated the head at 120~130mm

So my calculation of the approximate size of the center reflector in the MF03 is about 45mm.

And it’s probably deeper too, so we can expect some throw from 45mm, but 25.5mm not much.

~ ~ ~ ~

But it was okay to dream for a bit right? Smile


Yeah…
I’d like to add that I really hate the amount of dead space on the MF03 head. By dead I mean “not reflecting light forward”.
This light shows how this should be done.
But maybe it would be more expensive at larger size.
I agree, a lot of wasted real estate on that MF03, they could make larger reflectors in there.

.
On the extreme end of that thought, I just found this one today!… Smile


Note that you actually lose a lot of reflector area for LED openings.
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.
Just noticed a 12-LED “SRK style” version / 4*18650

.

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@beam0, you just gave me an idea for the 1st light.

Thank you. Do you think there would be a way to gut the switch and put the e-switch there?

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Sofirn also have a cheap 14 emitter version of the Skyray King known as SF34 and the gold color looks nice. However, TA said, “that host has a hollow pill and non-DTP mcpcb, it will cook the emitters if you try to bump up the power

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BlueSwordM wrote:
@beam0, you just gave me an idea for the 1st light.

Thank you. Do you think there would be a way to gut the switch and put the e-switch there?

I do like the array of the 1st light best because it would have larger reflectors that the others.

I really can’t advise on gutting the switch because I don’t actually have this light yet. But I suppose anything is possible, If the ring can be easily removed then just find a location to drill a hole for the switch.

Personally I thought the magnetic ring switch was a great feature and since it’s 4-position I was thinking it could be rewired for OFF-FLOOD-THROW-BOTH

I’m curious what your ideas are for it though.

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SKV89 wrote:
Sofirn also have a cheap 14 emitter version of the Skyray King known as SF34 and the gold color looks nice. However, TA said, “that host has a hollow pill and non-DTP mcpcb, it will cook the emitters if you try to bump up the power

.
The 12* DAOZHIMEI King has a larger head (65mm) vs 59mm for the Sofirn SF34, and the center reflector is much larger than the Sofirn, The DAOZHIMEI King’s center reflector looks comparable to the Sky-Ray 14* (70mm head) So I’m thinking that center led in the Sofirn won’t be much difference in beam than its outside leds.

.

……………..DAOZHIMEI King 12 * 65mm……………………….Sofirn SF34 14 * 59mm………………………………..Sky-Ray 14 * 70mm………………..

. .

.
Ultimately I think the layout of the1st light has the best potential for a budget MF03, but I do like the compact size of the kings, out of those two I like the DAOZHIMEI I just posted, it has the largest head and (I think) center reflector. But it’s a crapshoot on the pill until someone gets one.

.

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68 mm 8+1 reflector for under $2:
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NPIC-68-High-quality-Led-Reflec...

They do multi-cup reflectors to over 100 mm without prices skyrocketing.
I suppose the reason might be that they wanted to have the centre reflector deeper than the others…..

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Agro wrote:
68 mm 8+1 reflector for under $2:
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NPIC-68-High-quality-Led-Reflec...

They do multi-cup reflectors to over 100 mm without prices skyrocketing.
I suppose the reason might be that they wanted to have the centre reflector deeper than the others…..

The center cup seems like it could be larger than the OP light (73mm head), but….

Material: Plastic (this from the generic description also says Aspheric)

But this is from the main description:

Materials: PC
Is “PC” Plastic?? (Polycarbonate, I believe)

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For the 1st light I’m wondering how we could power the 8 outer leds separate from the center, and also run all together, would that require 2 drivers? And 2 switches? I couldn’t find any info on a dual output driver.

Also I’d like to know how those magnetic ring switches are usually wired, I suppose it’s like an e-switch? Maybe requires a special driver.

Also can anyone speculate the voltage from the 6* cells? I suppose each set of 2S are paralleled to each other, then 8.2V to the driver?

.
@ BlueSwordM, I’m thinking now too we’d need either gut the ring switch and add 2 e-switches, or leave the ring and add one e-switch.

I hope someone orders this and reports on the pill construction. I’ll eventually get it myself when I get some extra cash.

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beam0 wrote:
Agro wrote:
68 mm 8+1 reflector for under $2:
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NPIC-68-High-quality-Led-Reflec...

They do multi-cup reflectors to over 100 mm without prices skyrocketing.
I suppose the reason might be that they wanted to have the centre reflector deeper than the others…..

The center cup seems like it could be larger than the OP light (73mm head), but….

Material: Plastic (this from the generic description also says Aspheric)

But this is from the main description:

Materials: PC
Is “PC” Plastic?? (Polycarbonate, I believe)


Right. That was too good to be true. :/
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Lexel has said he could build a dual driver for the Astrolux MF03 which uses 2 buttons.

I don’t know how the magnetic ring switches work either. My guess is they would be using an MCU with a lot of input pins so that each switch position has its own input on the MCU.

It looks like it’s 2S3P for 6v.

It is extremely difficult to add an e-switch to a light that doesn’t have one. To do it the right way would require machining and tapping threads etc which is beyond the skills of the average person. I would deem it unsuitable as a host.

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware, lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos including GT 

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Agro wrote:
beam0 wrote:
Agro wrote:
68 mm 8+1 reflector for under $2:
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NPIC-68-High-quality-Led-Reflec...

They do multi-cup reflectors to over 100 mm without prices skyrocketing.
I suppose the reason might be that they wanted to have the centre reflector deeper than the others…..

The center cup seems like it could be larger than the OP light (73mm head), but….

Material: Plastic (this from the generic description also says Aspheric)

But this is from the main description:

Materials: PC
Is “PC” Plastic?? (Polycarbonate, I believe)


Right. That was too good to be true. :/

That’s definitely plastic. There’s no way you can machine that from billet aluminum.
What’s wrong with a plastic reflector? I thought they were the best.

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware, lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos including GT 

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

 

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Thanks for the info on Lexel and the dual driver for MF03! That’s awesome. I also have a feeling those ring switches are wired to multiple pins.

.
Some e-switches are just press fit, so no threads, just pressed into a hole. But personally no problem if threads need tapped, I have many metric taps and dies. Why would it require machining? It’s just a round hole, can be done with a drill bit.

.
The reflector in the 1st light in the OP is aluminum.

I know they are machined for single led lights, but I assumed the aluminum ones in multi-emitter budget lights were die-cast then metal film coated on the reflective surface the same as machined ones are. But I don’t personally have any of those so I’m just guessing.

I’ve been advised that plastic reflectors can melt from the heat of a well driven emitter. Guess it depends on the plastic they use.

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There shouldn’t be much heat on the reflector itself since it’s sitting on a plastic insulator.

The only e-switches I’ve seen are designed to be soldered to a pcb. I’ve never seen a press fit switch small enough for flashlight use. Do you have a link to the ones you are thinking of?

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware, lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos including GT 

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

 

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JasonWW wrote:
There shouldn’t be much heat on the reflector itself since it’s sitting on a plastic insulator.

The only e-switches I’ve seen are designed to be soldered to a pcb. I’ve never seen a press fit switch small enough for flashlight use. Do you have a link to the ones you are thinking of?

I was referring to the switch bezel and rubber boot, isn’t that what you meant by requiring threads? (maybe you meant threads behind for a retaining ring for the switch pcb)

Yes the switches are on a pcb, but of course can be separate and wired the driver board, so once you have the switch bezel and boot installed just need to devise a method of mounting/securing the switch board behind the hole, I’ve read where that’s been done with hot glue, you’d have to get creative! Don’t know where you’d buy a switch bezel and boot though.

You did write “To do it the right way” but that may not apply to this Smile

Bottom line is if there’s a will there’s a way, gotta think out of the box, my idea of building this wasn’t necessarily to make something that’s refined, sleek or that doesn’t look modified or home built, it could have toggle switches mounted on it for all I care.

If two separate drivers could fit it maybe use two regular clicky/pushbutton switches and clicky drivers.

Yes this could be complicated, maybe impossible, but I usually have the mindset that anything’s possible if you’re determined enough.

(JK about the toggle switches Silly )

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I have yet to see anybody do a really nice job adding an e-switch to a light. They typically are not pretty and/or not waterproof. I think my standards are a bit high. I like nice integration and feel plus backlighting.

Thsee are the two best examples I found (I researched this in the past).

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware, lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos including GT 

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

 

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Thanks for those e-switch posts those are interesting! And ya they look pretty rough!

When I was thinking about retaining / re-purposing the ring control I didn’t think about mode changes, but maybe the flood array could run off the first ON position, then twisting back and forth from off could change modes for that array. The center led (throw) could be always 100%. at the second ON position, and both together at the third ON position. But I’m sure that would take some doing!

Sometimes I’m a bit of a dreamer on things but it keeps my mind working Smile
I’m curious what BlueSwordM had in mind for this, (post #9) but I think this answered a lot for his question.

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Keep in mind that the software gurus here on blf pretty much stick to the attiny style mcu’s which have 8 legs. Those won’t work for a ring style switch. For that you might need a different style mcu that has 12 or 16 legs. Nobody here makes software for those mcu’s.

Ideally I’d like to find someone who is familiar with how the ring switches work. I have only heard they are a major pain to mod if at all. I can’t find any info on them.

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware, lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos including GT 

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

 

BlueSwordM
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Yeah. 16 pin QFNs, comparer to 8 pin QFNs are much harder to program and solder to.