H>M>L vs L>M>H

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slmjim
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H>M>L vs L>M>H

The review of the Thorfire TG06S by cellguy got me thinking about this.

I have one, and didn't think I'd like the H>M>L sequence at first, but it's really grown on me.

I don't use 14500's in any of my 1/AA lights, only Ni-Mh. 14500's in 1/AA lights are overkill to me, and if I need more brilliance I really need a different lighting tool, like a C8F or S2.

The TG06S is my EDC day pocket light.  WhenI need it, it doesn't matter that it starts on H, because that's what I likely need anyway. It's a utility light that makes enough light right now. If I need a little more runtime I just step it down, no biggie.

If I'm out for the evening, I'll carry my 1/AA Acebaem M10. Always starts on moonlight, perfect for reading a menu in a darkened restaurant, or otherwise used in an environment where starting on L or moonlight is appropriate, just out of courtesy or comfort. In that use, I'll call the M10 a Gentleman's Pocket Light.

Different lights, different tools for different uses.

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BlueSwordM
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Low, medium, high user interfaces are not negotiable.

Starting on high is just blinding during the night.

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I prefer L => => => H no matter how many levels there are. But, if there are more than 3 levels, I hope for quick access to BOTH the lowest level AND the highest level from off. The Ramping UI used in many of our latest BLF firmwares, with press-and-hold from Off to Moonlight and/or double-click from Off to Turbo is about perfect.

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spaceminions
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I always want to be able to start from the lowest value; it takes a long time to unblind yourself.

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jch10400
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Depends on where I’m going. If it’s a night out to dinner, movies, other situations where I may use the light inside I carry an Olight S15R and use moonlight or low a lot so that’s where I leave the memory set. However, my current EDC is a TG06S with 14500 because I want high first time every time. I live in a rural area and when I come home at night there is a possibility of skunks or coyotes being around so I want plenty of light if I see movement while walking to the front door.

Pete7874
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Just buy a light that has mode memory, then then it doesn’t matter too much if it’s H>M>L or L>M>H.

Lightbringer
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For me, H→L is a dealbreaker.

Once you’re blinded by H, stepping down doesn’t help much when you’re just seeing big green blobs in front of you.

At least going L→H, you progressively go higher if you need it.

Having a shortcut to lowest and/or highest is a bonus, but at this point where a lot of things just bug me, H→L completely queers the deal.

And besides, H→L reminds me of cheap lights with not even LB emitters, but clones of LB emitters.

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power911
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what happened to the interface where it starts M→L→H

I always loved that especially for inspection purposes.
But like some say, memory would be much ideal if it is an AA light.

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adnj
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Nighttime use, camping: low to high.

Inspection, law enforcement: high to low.

I prefer the interfaces that let you get to either quickly with just a few one-handed button presses. HDS and Surefire really nailed that over 20 years ago.

I really do not like memory because I may be using the light intermittently and I never know what it may be starting on.

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L>M>H for my bedside lights. H>M>L for my perimeter security lights.

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power911 wrote:
what happened to the interface where it starts M→L→H

I always loved that especially for inspection purposes.
But like some say, memory would be much ideal if it is an AA light.


IMHO: Worst. Interface. Ever! Angry

But, ya know. You can like it if you want to! Innocent

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Agro
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Pete7874 wrote:
Just buy a light that has mode memory, then then it doesn’t matter too much if it’s H>M>L or L>M>H.

Definitely no!
Mode memory means that every time I turn off the light I have to go through the sequence of modes all the way to where I want it (which is, in general, L).
I frequently fail to do the sequence and end up blasting myself with H (which is what I actually use the most).

My only use for mode memory is when I put the light in my pocket for a while and resume later. In all other cases it’s just a problem.
I strongly prefer lights w/out mode memory at all, though I guess a time-limited memory would serve me best.

As to direction….I agree with what has been said already, having a shortcuts to moonlight and turbo is great for me.

DavidEF wrote:
power911 wrote:
what happened to the interface where it starts M→L→H

I always loved that especially for inspection purposes.
But like some say, memory would be much ideal if it is an AA light.


IMHO: Worst. Interface. Ever! Angry

But, ya know. You can like it if you want to! Innocent


Actually Emisar UI also starts M (unless memory messes it up). And I like it a lot.
pennzy
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I like both , depending on the situation . Where I get in trouble , is having many different UIs , some not so intuitive . The Q8 with the ramping is easy to figure out . Double , triple , short , long , gets to be a pain sometimes. Life is hard enough without my light giving me stress .

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Agro wrote:
Pete7874 wrote:
Just buy a light that has mode memory, then then it doesn’t matter too much if it’s H>M>L or L>M>H.

Definitely no!
Mode memory means that every time I turn off the light I have to go through the sequence of modes all the way to where I want it (which is, in general, L).
What? Mode memory means that if you last had it on L and turned it off, the next time you turn it on it will be on L again. You don’t have to go through any sequence.
Agro
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Pete7874 wrote:
Agro wrote:
Pete7874 wrote:
Just buy a light that has mode memory, then then it doesn’t matter too much if it’s H>M>L or L>M>H.

Definitely no!
Mode memory means that every time I turn off the light I have to go through the sequence of modes all the way to where I want it (which is, in general, L).
What? Mode memory means that if you last had it on L and turned it off, the next time you turn it on it will be on L again. You don’t have to go through any sequence.

I nearly always want to start L. Or ML, when L is very low.
But in actual use I tend to go to H most of the time. Or MH when H is very high.
So yes, I do need to perform elaborate shutdown sequences on all my lights with memory.
And also elaborate startup sequences on all lights that don’t have good shortcuts.
spaceminions
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With ramping lights, you can ramp up from off to whatever level you want without blinding yourself, or resume at the last used value. Turbo is a doubleclick. Makes it easy to get to lowest and highest.

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DavidEF
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Agro wrote:
Pete7874 wrote:
Just buy a light that has mode memory, then then it doesn’t matter too much if it’s H>M>L or L>M>H.

Definitely no!
Mode memory means that every time I turn off the light I have to go through the sequence of modes all the way to where I want it (which is, in general, L).
I frequently fail to do the sequence and end up blasting myself with H (which is what I actually use the most).

My only use for mode memory is when I put the light in my pocket for a while and resume later. In all other cases it’s just a problem.
I strongly prefer lights w/out mode memory at all, though I guess a time-limited memory would serve me best.

As to direction….I agree with what has been said already, having a shortcuts to moonlight and turbo is great for me.

DavidEF wrote:
power911 wrote:
what happened to the interface where it starts M→L→H

I always loved that especially for inspection purposes.
But like some say, memory would be much ideal if it is an AA light.


IMHO: Worst. Interface. Ever! Angry

But, ya know. You can like it if you want to! Innocent


Actually Emisar UI also starts M (unless memory messes it up). And I like it a lot.

What? I never knew that! Shocked

I always use the shortcuts to get to either Moonlight or Turbo. If I need a low amount of light, I use the shortcut to Moonlight, then ramp up from there to my desired output. In this case, Mode Memory wouldn’t be useful to me at all.

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Agro
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If you physically lock Emisar out, it starts on LM. 350 mA. Which is a great default for me.

Tom Tom
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I prefer High, Low, ultra-low, no memory.

I always know what the torch is going to do, and starting on High is my preference. That’s what it is for (a bright torch).

If wanting to be subtle, I hold my hand in front, click it down to the desired lower level, then expose.

Ramping UIs are all very well, and I like the Q8 because I can set ultra-low, preset level, or turbo, with a few different clicks of the button, but I couldn’t hand it to an uneducated user and expect them to get it.

Sometimes less is more. And torches should be simple and intuitive, except for techies.

Flashy modes, by all means, but keep them hidden behind a double or triple fast click.

Likewise “Turbo”, a rather useless mode except for short-lived headline figures.

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Tom Tom wrote:
Likewise “Turbo”, a rather useless mode except for short-lived headline figures.
This has been discussed time and time again. But, for some people, Turbo is anything but useless. Just because you don’t use it does not mean it’s useless.

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spaceminions
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Tom Tom wrote:
I prefer High, Low, ultra-low, no memory.

I always know what the torch is going to do, and starting on High is my preference. That’s what it is for (a bright torch).


Most people don’t have more trouble remembering LMH vs HML; and most people can use a bright light without needing to start off in the brightest mode every single time. They like to avoid needing to :
Tom Tom wrote:

If wanting to be subtle, I hold my hand in front, click it down to the desired lower level, then expose.
which sometimes doesn’t work, because the highest mode after going through your hand can be much brighter than a proper ultra low mode.

Tom Tom wrote:

Ramping UIs are all very well, and I like the Q8 because I can set ultra-low, preset level, or turbo, with a few different clicks of the button, but I couldn’t hand it to an uneducated user and expect them to get it.
Not all of them, but some ramping lights and any ramping lights with newer firmware will often come with a simplified UI mode (“muggle mode”) which lobotomizes the light so that people feel better about it. The emisar firmware seems simple enough already; a non-techie just has to know that you hold to change brightness and click to turn on and off.

Tom Tom wrote:

Likewise “Turbo”, a rather useless mode except for short-lived headline figures.
Useless? I don’t know if you realize this, but there’s plenty of lights that used to and are unable to run at full brightness indefinitely, but they never called that turbo. Without thermal protection, you couldn’t use them for long without checking how hot they were manually and maybe stepping the brightness down if it was too hot. The modern lights with a turbo mode can actually manage that all on their own, and in the q8 for instance, if you put an up to date version of anduril on, you can even put it in turbo mode and have it regulate itself to put out the max brightness that it can without overheating, rather than just stepping down and never stepping back up. And it’ll run for a fair while on turbo with the mass that it’s got. The d4 is a well known example of a light that can go way beyond what’s sustainable, but you might not realize that even ~700 lumens might be too much to sustain, depending. And the fw3a might only make it to 3-400 lumens if you have to have it be able to run like that indefinitely. Personally though, I don’t think many of us only buy lights that are not able to go to a higher brightness than their steady state thermal limit. Almost all lights can get pretty toasty if you let them.

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chadvone
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Hmm, both depending on the light.

I am also really surprised that some people are still blinding themselves. I learned not to after a few years.

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The correct answer is L, M, H.

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chadvone wrote:
Hmm, both depending on the light.

Indeed. If I just want ultra-low to find my way to the bathroom without waking my partner, I have a torch that starts there, and runs off one AA.

Edit: Olight S15

Or if there is a bump in the night, or I am tracking something I may have not shot perfectly (not happened yet, but they can run even with no heart left), at last light, then my 5K or 10K lumen torches serve their purpose, and I like them to turn on full-blast.

Edit: Q8 and MF01 are good for this, once you know the button presses.

There is no one-size-fits all. Horses for courses.

I think memory of previous settings is an over-regarded feature. Not against it, as long as it can be disabled.

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I still blind myself when the UI isn’t l-m-h

Its probably why I want l-m-h

If there was a short memory mode I wouldn’t mind either, but there usually isn’t. Sad

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I’m a L,M,H kind of guy. I like everything to start in low, I’m still trying to get use to some of these UI’s that need a long press for off. Not a good thing when you slip into bed on moonlight and your wife is a sleep and you do a short press. LOL Facepalm

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Although I usually just adapt to the UI, one that starts low is probably my favorite…. besides ramping.

‘To me’ moonlight is useless 99.99% of the time & should be hidden, if even included in a larger light. It is OK in a smaller light as long as it is hidden.

But again, these are just my thoughts. I am adaptable if I really like the light… Wink

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Boaz
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I’m not a fan of double click for turbo . I’m not an idiot but find myself too many times being blasted with light I never wanted . Lots and lots of features are cool, I like options ..I just think this one isn’t clearly thought out .

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Anyone with Moonlight-Strobe-High preferences?
I had this kind of weird light few years ago. Looks like it’s actually a defective H-Strobe. It was small plastic aspheric with tacticool style. Bought for about $2 in a bazaar.

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I think most people who don’t object to firmware with a complex UI for some other reason don’t have trouble with double click for turbo. Your light’s button might be awkward or bouncing or something; the last time I heard about accidental double clicking it was my grandmother’s worn out old computer mouse.

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Just get a Zebralight SC5C, you can program the user interface to anything you like, and have three different programs stored. I love it. quick click for sublumen, long click for medium, which works for outside on a walk, or double click for high. All three are accessible from off. Or change the way you access them to whatever you want. Just wish the light had a better clip (reversable)

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