[♛ FreemeGB] Fireflies PL47 Gen II 4*XP-L/ Nichia/ SST20 Hi CRI 21700 Right Angle Flashlight - ALIVE

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HONDARIDER
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Got my xpl-hi pl47 last week but my sst-20 unit has not arrived. Ordered them about 2 hours apart. Hope it comes in this week.

CPL S
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TexasToasted wrote:
Max output is 1800 lumens at start and it drops rapidly.

May I ask which model you received?

TexasToasted
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Champagne yellow Nichia 219B-V1 R9080
That was using the Samsung cells I mentioned above. Those cells give me around 2500 lumens in my Sofirn C8F.

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TexasToasted wrote:
Champagne yellow Nichia 219B-V1 R9080 That was using the Samsung cells I mentioned above. Those cells give me around 2500 lumens in my Sofirn C8F.

Which samsung cells did you use, specifically?

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CPL S
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700 lumens less than max of 2500 with a 30T? Sheesh!

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TexasToasted wrote:
See post 1383 above. Samsung INR21700-50E Samsung IMR21700-30T

Well thats not awesome. Thats whoo. But not full-on awesome.

1800 turbo? Guess i thought there’d be a little more there. Wonder how the other emitters are fleshing out.

BurningPlayd0h
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CPL S wrote:
700 lumens less than max of 2500 with a 30T? Sheesh!

Im thinking they flashed a firmware that limits output for the 219Bs (thats what he has right?). Good choice to protect longevity of them IMO.

Didnt the 219B S41 get somewhere around 1400?

vik267777
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Got my shipping notice today for SST20

Tom Tom
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BurningPlayd0h wrote:
CPL S wrote:
700 lumens less than max of 2500 with a 30T? Sheesh!

Im thinking they flashed a firmware that limits output for the 219Bs (thats what he has right?). Good choice to protect longevity of them IMO.

Didnt the 219B S41 get somewhere around 1400?

No, nowhere near. I probably had the very first S41 (still have it), and it was never that bright.

Puzzled where FF are getting these antique LEDs from, maybe they found an old reel in an abandoned warehouse somewhere.

The old FET+1 driver didn’t hold back either, even when constructed with the shoddiest components by Banggood/Manker. I really doubt that the modern FF one is actually any better, in the limit.

Maukka’s old numbers are here: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/47123

I’d like to say that the tint is wondrous, like a fine glass of vintage wine, and that mine torch (S41, not this one) is a rare unrepeatable classic. But it is not. (Actually it is, you can’t buy the 219B version any more). Just ordinary. And you will be lucky to get even 1000 lumens out of four of these antique LEDs, for a few seconds, with a top cell. Then they will cook off. At least the S41 has a big chunk of copper to soak things up for a couple of minutes, and a crude, but worthy driver with no thermal management worth mentioning. This one does not. Quite predictable. So many better things already possible.

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Well we have now had enough…

Myself and partner and a friend is RETURNING these back to firefly
2xCREE XPL HI V3 CW 6500K Max 5000lumens
1xCREE XPL HI V3 NW 5000K Max 5000lumens

My CW will not even get close to the 5000lm!! The following Headlamps out shine it Fenix Hl55, Nitecore HC 65 and HC30 Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good. Our friends doesn’t even work properly. She stick a battery in and once she turns it on she is stuck in what it comes on as button doesn’t even work.. Only way to turn it off is to remove battery.

Now lets add further to he TERRIBLE issues with the headband and now the battery tubes being different diameters(NW version has the chamapage tube as can confirm same issue). Sent two head bands and charged us for them, sent them with magnets in the tail caps even though they confirmed they would be removed, Then the battery issue (crushing my button tops) It has made me loose ABSOLUTE FAITH in them as anything more than a paperweight and as a brand they will be avoided.

Sorry folks but as a brand I have nothing but distrust and a sore taste in my mouth.

Caving, Climbing, Mountaineering, Kayaking, Diving etc any time anywhere!!! If you in the UK let me know and lets Play!
Current lighting
Olight X7R,M2R,S1 Baton,S10R Baton 3m,S2R 2, I1R EOS,SofirnC8T,Lenser P7'2,Lenser P14,BLF A6,Fenix HL50,HM50R,HL55,CL05,HL05,CL09,CL25,Nitecore HC30,HC65,NU12,NU32,Astolux K1,Petzl E-light,Tikka Xp3,XP3LED,DUO,Atomlight,Xtar Warboys H3,PL47 Manker E03H and many Chinese ones

rvr
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So far i am very happy with mine Thumbs Up

JordanZHP
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My PL47 XPL HI 5000k running a 40T has similar lumen output to my D4S XPL HI 5000k. The D4S does throw a bit further but it’s not substantial. Besides the included head strap not being adjustable to aim the light up and down, I have been very pleased with the light.

Touchofred
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TexasToasted wrote:
Mine finally arrived. Tube is 21.4 mm, so only my Samsung cells fit. Max output is 1800 lumens at start and it drops rapidly. Push button requires a lot of force to operate and doesn’t always respond- I feel the click, but nothing happens. Maybe that’s good for those who want to carry this in their pocket; there’s no way this light could turn on accidentally. I’m glad I didn’t jump on the E07 bandwagon. Fireflies is nowhere near as good as Emisar.

I’ll have to agree on that unfortunately. I was about to order the E07, but I didn’t. I bought the D4S instead. I think I made the right call doing that.

I had my PL47 with me to work today. Had it in my workpants and did some work, I looked at it after I quit for the day, and it had scuffed the anodizing lol. So the light scuffed the anodizing through a thick layer of fabric.
The anodizing is like paint. Very soft it seems. At least on mine..

BurningPlayd0h
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Touchofred wrote:
TexasToasted wrote:
Mine finally arrived. Tube is 21.4 mm, so only my Samsung cells fit. Max output is 1800 lumens at start and it drops rapidly. Push button requires a lot of force to operate and doesn’t always respond- I feel the click, but nothing happens. Maybe that’s good for those who want to carry this in their pocket; there’s no way this light could turn on accidentally. I’m glad I didn’t jump on the E07 bandwagon. Fireflies is nowhere near as good as Emisar.

I’ll have to agree on that unfortunately. I was about to order the E07, but I didn’t. I bought the D4S instead. I think I made the right call doing that.

I had my PL47 with me to work today. Had it in my workpants and did some work, I looked at it after I quit for the day, and it had scuffed the anodizing lol. So the light scuffed the anodizing through a thick layer of fabric.
The anodizing is like paint. Very soft it seems. At least on mine..

Emisar annodizing on their first couple lights (IDK about the D4S, it seems to have a different texture) definitely wasn’t hardcoat either though, just cosmetic.

rvr
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lohtse wrote:
Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good.

You didn’t accidently switch off the aux leds? PL47 has a few different aux led modes with 7 short clicks

Regards!

lohtse
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rvr wrote:
lohtse wrote:
Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good.

You didn’t accidently switch off the aux leds? PL47 has a few different aux led modes with 7 short clicks

Regards!


nope that are set to on…yet nolonger work… when the pl47 arrived the aux leds had been about 25% of the brightness of my partners pl47s aux led. FF has failed to even respond to direct emails regarding issue…

Caving, Climbing, Mountaineering, Kayaking, Diving etc any time anywhere!!! If you in the UK let me know and lets Play!
Current lighting
Olight X7R,M2R,S1 Baton,S10R Baton 3m,S2R 2, I1R EOS,SofirnC8T,Lenser P7'2,Lenser P14,BLF A6,Fenix HL50,HM50R,HL55,CL05,HL05,CL09,CL25,Nitecore HC30,HC65,NU12,NU32,Astolux K1,Petzl E-light,Tikka Xp3,XP3LED,DUO,Atomlight,Xtar Warboys H3,PL47 Manker E03H and many Chinese ones

SKV89
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lohtse wrote:
rvr wrote:
lohtse wrote:
Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good.

You didn’t accidently switch off the aux leds? PL47 has a few different aux led modes with 7 short clicks

Regards!


nope that are set to on…yet nolonger work… when the pl47 arrived the aux leds had been about 25% of the brightness of my partners pl47s aux led. FF has failed to even respond to direct emails regarding issue…

Jack take a long time if ever to respond to emails. He responds to PMs faster. Usually very responsive with PMs but sometimes take a long while too. Maybe vacation or business trip?

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lohtse wrote:
rvr wrote:
lohtse wrote:
Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good.

You didn’t accidently switch off the aux leds? PL47 has a few different aux led modes with 7 short clicks

Regards!


nope that are set to on…yet nolonger work… when the pl47 arrived the aux leds had been about 25% of the brightness of my partners pl47s aux led. FF has failed to even respond to direct emails regarding issue…

You could try to contact Lexel, since I think he is responsible for the driver, and aux led board design, and see if he knows what might have failed. Actually he’s responsible for the entire electronic design of all of these FF models AFAIK, and, I presume, also the tailoring of TK’s open-source firmware, because I suspect that if she had any involvement here, never-mind even token gesture funding, she would have let it be known.

If I have got Lexel, or TK’s involvement wrong, please could they let me know the true situation and I will edit, retract etc. any misinformation.

Fireflies sketch out then subcontract the metalwork, assemble (or get someone else to) the parts, use FreemeGB to promote the interest here before the product actually exists (with his cut), then distribute (late), as far as I know.

Sending out prototypes for review and evaluation, and feedback, by respected independents, in advance seems not to be their way, and the pre-order window is too short for any independent reporting back. Too much in a hurry to get orders in, and demanding/expecting a leap of faith by their first customers, based on over-promising.

It’s a borderline business model, even if you can keep all the plates spinning in the air, and the product is worthy. It’s only their second go at this, the ROT66 seems to be liked by some, though the ones who paid full price but got the first ones without the Aux LED board, and no retrofit kit in prospect, might be understandably annoyed.

Still, you all will have 3 years warranty, once they arrive. As long as you didn’t specify “no glue”. Good luck with that, and paying to send them back to China at your own cost if the warranty is required.

Also bear in mind that some people who have received (or even not received) shoddy products don’t like to talk about it publicly, perhaps feeling a little foolish, but just put it down to experience, write off the money, and learn not to be quite so trusting again.

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I dont know what youre all so upset about, because i still cant find the headphone jack, and there is absolutely nothing in the manual about the gps.

My perspective, its a pretty nice light for 50$. I was probably within the 1st 20 people to own one, (err, which is to say 3).

I think that is pretty nifty. Even if i cant find that damn jack.

I dont know that it will replace my zebra for work, but that is a subjective issue not the fault of the light. I think i am just used to the mule type flood—gonna continue to play with them, though. I added 2 layers of dc fix —still feels a little bright in the middle, but i am pretty happy with my purchase, will find a use for them—neat little lights, weight difference is a wee bit heavier but a negligible difference. Headband is ill chosen. Clip seems small. Ui is Alot of fun.

[Edit: i normally wear a zebra headband w/o top strap. The pl47 feels quite comfortable with a zebra headband W/ top strap. Will have to re-examine wearabilty-thru-a-work day, seems much better with the top strap. So i will have to re-examine the practical bits: light dispersal/color. Weight. Runtime at useful levels. In a work environment. But i feel alot more optimstic after adding the top strap]

Perhaps, i have better expectation management, i suppose? 50 bucks to be first off the line of a completely unproven-possibly extraordinary mom and pop shop? Felt like a low risk high reward scenario. The very fact that something showed up in the mail that i could shovel some batteries into makes me happy. The fact that pink light comes out the end of it is gravy.

My 2 cents: if one wishes to have all of the benefits of a tried, tested and proven appliance. Buy that then.

No headphone jack. Seriously?

JordanZHP
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Tom Tom wrote:
lohtse wrote:
rvr wrote:
lohtse wrote:
Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good.

You didn’t accidently switch off the aux leds? PL47 has a few different aux led modes with 7 short clicks

Regards!


nope that are set to on…yet nolonger work… when the pl47 arrived the aux leds had been about 25% of the brightness of my partners pl47s aux led. FF has failed to even respond to direct emails regarding issue…

You could try to contact Lexel, since I think he is responsible for the driver, and aux led board design, and see if he knows what might have failed. Actually he’s responsible for the entire electronic design of all of these FF models AFAIK, and, I presume, also the tailoring of TK’s open-source firmware, because I suspect that if she had any involvement here, never-mind even token gesture funding, she would have let it be known.

If I have got Lexel, or TK’s involvement wrong, please could they let me know the true situation and I will edit, retract etc. any misinformation.

Fireflies sketch out then subcontract the metalwork, assemble (or get someone else to) the parts, use FreemeGB to promote the interest here before the product actually exists (with his cut), then distribute (late), as far as I know.

Sending out prototypes for review and evaluation, and feedback, by respected independents, in advance seems not to be their way, and the pre-order window is too short for any independent reporting back. Too much in a hurry to get orders in, and demanding/expecting a leap of faith by their first customers, based on over-promising.

It’s a borderline business model, even if you can keep all the plates spinning in the air, and the product is worthy. It’s only their second go at this, the ROT66 seems to be liked by some, though the ones who paid full price but got the first ones without the Aux LED board, and no retrofit kit in prospect, might be understandably annoyed.

Still, you all will have 3 years warranty, once they arrive. As long as you didn’t specify “no glue”. Good luck with that, and paying to send them back to China at your own cost if the warranty is required.

Also bear in mind that some people who have received (or even not received) shoddy products don’t like to talk about it publicly, perhaps feeling a little foolish, but just put it down to experience, write off the money, and learn not to be quite so trusting again.

Personally I welcome a new company like Fireflies. They are releasing a new style of lights using the 21700 cell format while offering many different LED choices. Based on the PL47, which I purchased, they are listening to the community. Yes they could be a little more communicative and the tracking for my PL47 was lacking, but they say patience is a virtue.

I don’t feel like they demanded or required a leap of faith from me. I decided to take advantage of a 10% discount knowing full well this light has not yet been reviewed. Besides a better head strap and maybe a button with more feedback (love the D4S button), I think the PL47 is a great light at a fair price.

Mildlyangryjohnny
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leaftye wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
I dont know what youre all so upset about, because i still cant find the headphone jack, and there is absolutely nothing in the manual about the gps.

What are you talking about?

I was being a bit silly to draw attention away from the dissapponted folks. Or maybe to draw attention towards them. I am not sure, but i know i was being silly.

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Yup, its a great light. Except for the crummy button, the weak output, and the fact that very few 21700 batteries can fit.
A great light indeed.

SKV89
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TexasToasted wrote:
Yup, its a great light. Except for the crummy button, the weak output, and the fact that very few 21700 batteries can fit. A great light indeed.

Not sure why you think it is weak output. If the 1,800 lumens measurement someone posted for the 219B 9080 is true, that is actually very impressive. Considering the S41 quad 219B (9000 or 9050?) only makes 1,400 lumens true output, I’m surprised the 9080 emitters can do so much more. Maybe FF got lucky and found a really high flux bin (anyone know is it a D240 or above?).

Also, if the 1,800 lumens measurement is based off the Maukka/ANSI standard, it will present lower numbers than the typical lumen standard used by flashlight manufacturers. Even TA’s original lumen measurement standard read 28% higher than Maukka/ANSI.

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TexasToasted wrote:
Yup, its a great light. Except for the crummy button, the weak output, and the fact that very few 21700 batteries can fit. A great light indeed.

Our requirements are probably different and i am missing context but i think youre being a bit overly critical—so apologies because my opinion is to follow. I really want to give this light a fair shake but all this negative energy is getting in the way of my objective analysis. Which is to say will it light things up in front of my face as brightly as i want it for as long as i want it to. Havent gotten that far yet.

Fwiw i own maybe 40 to 50 headlamps, that i have gathered thru the years. So i guess you could say i have seen them evolve thru the years—all so very slowly. Which is to suggest that my expectation level is pretty reasonable. 80 lumens used to be jaw dropping lumens.

According to your own specs —1800 fast /jaw/ dropping lumens. (I added jaw), Is still higher than zebralights top current L-shaped model or maybe matching, dont actually know but bought one 2-3 months ago and it was either 1600 or 1800 lumen.

And you know what? The Pl47 nichia is 50$ cheaper. With universally accepted better tint. The sst20 4000k is probably several hundred lumens brighter and is 50$ cheaper than the zl i bought 2-3 months ago. The xpl nw is $50 cheaper than the zl and probably rivals the acebeam h30 and is $70 cheaper. Cost benefit analysis ff does seem to hold an edge.

Almost went with the acebeam h30. 120$ stock, but didnt like the goofy aux lites. Then was gonna get skylumen-mods to get the aux lites in samsung high cri. $160. Instead i lucked upon fireflies. I got 3 pl47’s for the price of one modded h30. And to cover several different scenarios.

My buttons seem fine, btw.

Maukkas review of the rot66 demonstrated a bit of oveeestimation of the nichias by ff. 5000 vs his 4250/38×× something, i forget. And his graphs showed it peaked for like a second then dropped to 700 lumens and held for 4 hours. Ff seems to have taken the best turn on peak level and called that the lumen level. They all do it, why hold them to a higher standard? What was your serious expectation here? Isnt that the nature of the entire industry, excepting like what—surefire? Beyond that the output is a result of the emitter choice, isnt it? Arent the nichia 219b like ancient old school leds? That people adore because they make things look pink? Not bright. Isnt it true that all high cri leds are piss poor performers in the output category? If output was your goal you probably should have opted for xpl.

The pl47 has an lg battery on sales page, but does not explicitly say it will fit, i assume it will. Zebralight does this with their pogo pin lites while stating only sanyo ncr18650ga is guaranteed to fit, with a box to check if you want one. Mtn electronics does this, stating only xxxx battery is guaranteed to fit. Which is better imho of a proprietary pack nonsense like olight or nitecore. Ff obvious error but not a novel one, should have said only lg fits. Check.

I got samsung 50e’s and they fit fine.

I dont know if it is a great light—yet, but it outputs in pink what my latest zebra does for 50$ less. The only real question i have is whether i will have to change out batteries every 2 hours.** and i dont know that yet. My only hope was to pull about 6-700 high cri lumens for 4+ hours, before battery changes. And wont really know that till i have cycled my batteries a few times anyway.

I wont know if the pl47 is a piece of crap for at least a few weeks.

So far i like it, er them.

Sorry yours didnt work out.

Edit: dude and how cool is the ui. Seriously.

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Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:

[Edit: i normally wear a zebra headband w/o top strap. The pl47 feels quite comfortable with a zebra headband

So the Zebralight headbands will fit around the tube of the PL47? I have several old ones and was wondering if they would fit. Do you have to stretch the retention rings quite a bit to make it fit?

Mildlyangryjohnny
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Coyotehawk wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:

[Edit: i normally wear a zebra headband w/o top strap. The pl47 feels quite comfortable with a zebra headband

So the Zebralight headbands will fit around the tube of the PL47? I have several old ones and was wondering if they would fit. Do you have to stretch the retention rings quite a bit to make it fit?

18650 version i would say yes—will fit, absolutely.

Well the rings are silicone so stretch isnt really a problem. With a zl light i would have to replace a headband every couple of ~6months because it would get all stretched out—but that is the fabric part. And That was the only time the light came out of the silicone holder. So, i was never in the habit of inserting and removing the light on a daily basis. The same will be true with a pl47. Takes a little doing to get it in so you probably will want to leave it there. But it doesnt seem over matched or exceeding capacity. It looks like 3/16-1/4” difference in diameter—> zl 603? ~ pl47.

What i did notice right away was—i wear the zl without the top strap. Just headband part & lite. The pl47 without the top strap bounced around alot going up and down stairs. So i tried it with top strap and feels pretty secure. And comfy. Been wearing it for a few hours and pretty much forget it is there (pl47). That said, i have been wearing a headlamp for 10+hours a day for 15-20 years, so your experience may vary.

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Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
50 bucks to be first off the line of a completely unproven-possibly extraordinary mom and pop shop? Felt like a low risk high reward scenario.

You really do live in a different world. $50 is a LOT of money to splash out on, frankly, just an amusement, frivolity, that may end up un-used on a shelf with 100 or more other such things. (Even if it works to your satisfaction).

This was never going to be a dependable “working” torch, that was clear to me from the start.

As Christmas approaches my spare money instead goes to Trussell Trust foodbanks (I live in Mugsborough on Sea, look up the Ragged-Trousered Philanthropist) , and the Salvation Army.

Poverty and exploitation still exists in the fifth largest economy of the world, and conspicuous consumption, just because you can, is still regarded as distasteful here, by most. Not that you would know it, given the in-your-face conspicuous consumption still prevalent.

And there is so much worse going on. But certain political establishments and news channels are still in thrall to their lords and masters., and so, history repeats.

Sometimes a torch is just a torch, and a cigar is just a cigar, and better just to let things go, walk away, say nothing more, and cease the fanboy cheerleading, unless the supplier really deserves it and has something unique, perfected, and above all special, to offer, with service and backup to match. Or is trying really hard and wanting to do better.

I can’t blame FF for trying, and perhaps they have a vision, if so, share the roadmap please, and try to do better.

Actions usually speak louder than words. That said, everyone deserves a second chance. Expecting a third chance is pushing it.

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lohtse wrote:
Well we have now had enough…

Myself and partner and a friend is RETURNING these back to firefly
2xCREE XPL HI V3 CW 6500K Max 5000lumens
1xCREE XPL HI V3 NW 5000K Max 5000lumens

My CW will not even get close to the 5000lm!! The following Headlamps out shine it Fenix Hl55, Nitecore HC 65 and HC30 Add to that the Aux leds have STOPPED even working. this is not good. Our friends doesn’t even work properly. She stick a battery in and once she turns it on she is stuck in what it comes on as button doesn’t even work.. Only way to turn it off is to remove battery.

Now lets add further to he TERRIBLE issues with the headband and now the battery tubes being different diameters(NW version has the chamapage tube as can confirm same issue). Sent two head bands and charged us for them, sent them with magnets in the tail caps even though they confirmed they would be removed, Then the battery issue (crushing my button tops) It has made me loose ABSOLUTE FAITH in them as anything more than a paperweight and as a brand they will be avoided.

Sorry folks but as a brand I have nothing but distrust and a sore taste in my mouth.

I gotta say, hmmmmm. I have been reading your comments as theyve progressed in this thread, even tried to assist and It occurs to me that your requirements outpaced a relatively green light/ company. Which is to say if you are using headlamps to crawl and climb thru caves you really have no place purchasing unproven equipment. Get an indestructable petzl or some such designed, and tested in the field by and for cavers and have at it.

You should not be using an untested light, period. An enthusiasts novelty light for that matter. Your life may depend on such a light. Seems silly that you were surprised by the trouble, that you have had. I would think any light that you buy should say bomb proof, because anything that goes wrong with it could be life or death.

BurningPlayd0h
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Tom Tom wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
50 bucks to be first off the line of a completely unproven-possibly extraordinary mom and pop shop? Felt like a low risk high reward scenario.

You really do live in a different world. $50 is a LOT of money to splash out on, frankly, just an amusement, frivolity, that may end up un-used on a shelf with 100 or more other such things. (Even if it works to your satisfaction).

This was never going to be a dependable “working” torch, that was clear to me from the start.

As Christmas approaches my spare money instead goes to Trussell Trust foodbanks (I live in Mugsborough on Sea, look up the Ragged-Trousered Philanthropist) , and the Salvation Army.

Poverty and exploitation still exists in the fifth largest economy of the world, and conspicuous consumption, just because you can, is still regarded as distasteful here, by most. Not that you would know it, given the in-your-face conspicuous consumption still prevalent.

And there is so much worse going on. But certain political establishments and news channels are still in thrall to their lords and masters., and so, history repeats.

Sometimes a torch is just a torch, and a cigar is just a cigar, and better just to let things go, walk away, say nothing more, and cease the fanboy cheerleading, unless the supplier really deserves it and has something unique, perfected, and above all special, to offer, with service and backup to match. Or is trying really hard and wanting to do better.

I can’t blame FF for trying, and perhaps they have a vision, if so, share the roadmap please, and try to do better.

Actions usually speak louder than words. That said, everyone deserves a second chance. Expecting a third chance is pushing it.

It’s easy to spend $30+ per person on a night at the movie, and sometimes the movie sucks.

You certainly have a mind for writing in the superlative in regards to flashlights though, could I suggest a voice recorder?

P.S. Freud was nuts

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