[♛ FreemeGB] Fireflies PL47 Gen II 4*XP-L/ Nichia/ SST20 Hi CRI 21700 Right Angle Flashlight - ALIVE

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DB Custom
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The Aux lights have low high and locator settings, if I remember correctly from just a little while ago. It’s boxed back up…

Edit: Sorry, the Aux has low, locator, and off. In low the switch LED’s are all lit, in locator only two are constant and the other two flash with the main board LED’s. When the Aux lights on the main board are turned off, only two of the switch LED’s are lit.

I had hoped to get the mixed board LED’s like TK did, purple and blue would have been cool, but mine are all blue.

Running it on an iJoy 21700.

JordanZHP
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cclight wrote:
The 30T will be brighter but I think the 40T is a better option. The flashlight will get very hot very quickly already with the 40T, so I think the 30T is not worth the shorter runtime and shorter high/turbo. Note that the 40T already has higher current than the 18650’s and 26650’s.

I’d use the 30T with the E07, that has 7 emitters.

Good idea! However, would 7 emitters and 30T possibly damage XPL HI (my preferred LED) with too much heat?

kanton
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I am sorry if I missed it, but was anyone able to reproduce the 5000 lumens claimed by Fireflies for the XPL-Hi versions? The maximum output measured in this thread was 4405 with lower readings for other 21700 batteries.

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JordanZHP wrote:
My aux leds are also similar to the D4S on low, the PL47 aux might be slightly brighter. I don’t think they are adjustable like the D4S right?

Also can anyone confirm if a Samsung 30T is ok to use with XPL HI? Ever since fireflies issued the warning I haven’t tested the 30T on turbo. I’m running a 40T but I think the 30T might be brighter? Cool

Aux leds are not adjustable – on off -or blink only

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cclight wrote:
The 30T will be brighter but I think the 40T is a better option. The flashlight will get very hot very quickly already with the 40T, so I think the 30T is not worth the shorter runtime and shorter high/turbo. Note that the 40T already has higher current than the 18650’s and 26650’s.

I’d use the 30T with the E07, that has 7 emitters.


This I can vouch for in reference to the 40t’s. I recieved my two XPL HI’s today along with my charger to charge the 40t’s. They charged quick enough that I was able to take them out for some play time tonight and cclight is correct in saying these babies get extremely hot already. To the point that I was having to hold on to the tailcap. On the flip side of that coin, it only gets that hot when running on turbo or at the top of the ramp. I ramped about half way up and the light never did really get hot yet still provided plenty of useable light. I’ve been a zebralight fan boy for years but if this light continues to grow on me, it’ll be my new go to headlamp. In fact, thinking about maybe getting an SST version as well.

I will add that the magnets were glued in even though I requested them not to be, and I should have recieved four headbands but only recieved three. I ordered one for each since I was uncertain if I was gonna recieve the free ones.

cclight
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JordanZHP wrote:
Good idea! However, would 7 emitters and 30T possibly damage XPL HI (my preferred LED) with too much heat?

No. The firmware has thermal protection and will reduce output when the temperature raises too much. Also, the E07 has almost twice the number of emitters, and the 30T doesn’t give this much more current than other batteries. Given that other quad flashlights work fine (with other batteries), we can be sure that the leds will have no problem in the E07 with the 30T.

DB Custom
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Not sure what planet you tested your 30T’s on cclight, but mine give far more current in most lights than any other cell I’ve tested against them, and I’ve tested a lot. If there is a potential for a high draw, the 30T far and away excels.

Edit: Ok, so I did a little test… I used the 458 Ham’r with it’s 17 emitters and 5 MOSFET’s to just find out what cell gives what… Big Smile For this test I used a single cell powering the Ham’r, 10 top cells in 4 sizes, couple of surprises… for the record, in the 21700 class the nearest competitor is ranked 8th, with 20700’s in the 6th and 7th spots. Enjoy!

1. Samsung 21700 30T ————- 30.3A
2. Samsung 18650 25S ————- 28.0A
3. Golisi 26650 Gold ————— 27.0A
4. Sony 18650 C5A ——————- 26.2A
5. Samsung 18650 30Q ————- 24.9A
6. Sanyo 20700A Red —————- 24.5A
7. Efest 20700 3000mAh ———- 23.4A
8. iJoy 21700 3750mAh ———— 20.4A
9. LiitoKala 5000mAh (Black) – 19.5A
10. LG 18650 HG2 ——————— 16.7A

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DB Custom wrote:
I had hoped to get the mixed board LED’s like TK did, purple and blue would have been cool, but mine are all blue.

That was the E07, not the PL47. PL47 is blue for high voltage or red for low voltage.

There are three sets of extra LEDs:

  • Two always-on LEDs under the button.
  • Two controllable LEDs under the button.
  • Aux LED board under the optic.

The controllable button LEDs and aux LEDs can be on, off, or blinking… and they do this in sync with each other. And they turn off when the main LEDs are on. It’s not like the Q8 where the button LED mirrors the main LED brightness, and it’s not like the D4S where the aux LEDs have two brightness levels.

DB Custom
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Ahhh, I see… waiting on the machine clear finish to be available on the E07, sometime after Christmas.

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I am too lazy to charge my 21700…

4140 lumen.. xpl hi 5000k. Battery is around 4.0 v.

I will do another test again this week.

Mildlyangryjohnny
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I made a PL47 anduril ramp configuration estimated [stepped] lumen table so i could see theoretical lumen values of ramp ceiling minus n. So eventually 2 clicks will be my normal operating level once i determine highest level it maintains, and the table will give me a basis for estimating what lumen level i am running at. assuming my table is even slightly working

I assumed i start at 150 and i did it in increments of 10. The nichia with a blf user estimated max level of ~1800lm (texastoast/skv89). The xpl 5000k blf est max level ~>4000lm +/- 250 (newlumen/skv89) and the sst 4000k est blf max ~2500lm (komeko)

Obviously, reports are still coming in for lumen estimates so that piece is REALLY ROUGH and turbo seems to be a function of which cell, and only at turn-on, etc. But does my scribble table work? Or is there some wierd curve or slope thing that would render my table completely off, in other words does regulation and magical electronicky stuff inside the light, make a table like this kind of favoring like say a bell curve or something. I think what i show is a linear breakdown of ramp ceiling (or floor if you go the other way). But i dont know the hardcore aspects of how it really works, so i dont know if it holds up. But i wanted to have some foggy sense of what my ceiling lumen level would be once i discover what level seems to hold without dimming. I understand there are many variables like lite temperature, battery level, room temperature and these sorts of things that are not accounted for in this table—but as a rough estimator could this sort of work?

[Edit: i guess my working assumption is that the ramp function is a consistent linear progression like the slope of a pyramid, each step spaced equally from one to the next. As opposed to say the slope of an inground pool, where it (output)is weighted differently at different points on the slope….i guess, and this is way above my paygrade so i cant quite articulate it but i can visualize it, in mathspeak logorithmic/ exponential/ or linearithmic slopes, or some kind of curvey hilly thing vs a straight incliney thing].

So.: to explain the table, for instance, take nichia @~1800 max lumen. 1800=150 on ramp config. Minus 10 presses (140) gives me a theoretical lumen value of 1680. And so on and so forth. Math is 140×1800÷150=1680…130×1800÷150=1560. [Linear] vs 140×1800÷150=1680…(130+/-n)×1800÷150=x. Or ((130×1800)+/-n)÷150=x[curvey]. or something like that, to indicate that each step is not equally spaced from adjacent steps.

[Edit2: and frankly it feels like there are 2 independent pieces to this equation. Spacing as in distance in the ramp one step to the next and secondly, output as a distinct variable independent to the spacing because of driver and such. It would be nice if my simple formula works but it feels more complicated than that.]

I should have paid more attention in math class.

Does this even come close to holding up or am i completely off?

And i guess the follow up if it seems sound could i use the same simple math to figure out levels within a stepped configuration. So floor equals 10 ceiling equals 100 with 3 steps. So for the nichia i arrive at step1 ~120lumen s2 ~660lm s3 ~1200lm.

Any thoughts appreciated.

Tete
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Received my black neutral XP-L Hi today and after all the negativies I’ve read all over here are my first impressions:

-anodising is flawless (time will tell for how long)
-yes, the supplied headband is crap, but all my other headlamp’s bands seems to work just fine, so no worries
-it feels a bit headheavy, but I guess that’s acceptable too, since it wasn’t intended as a headlamp
-UI seems good and since it’s programmable, it should satisfy most
-the 18650-adapter seems to do its job nicely, since I’m still waiting for my 40T’s to arrive and my only 21700 (Wuben), is about 1 cm too long
-tail magnet is so weak, it won’t hold the lamp anywhere

I’m yet to test it outside, but so far it looks nice. Especially considering the price…
I guess I now can order another FireFlies, I’m just trying to decide will it be another PL47 or the E07…

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Tete wrote:
Received my black neutral XP-L Hi today and after all the negativies I’ve read all over here are my first impressions:

-anodising is flawless (time will tell for how long)
-yes, the supplied headband is crap, but all my other headlamp’s bands seems to work just fine, so no worries
-it feels a bit headheavy, but I guess that’s acceptable too, since it wasn’t intended as a headlamp
-UI seems good and since it’s programmable, it should satisfy most
-the 18650-adapter seems to do its job nicely, since I’m still waiting for my 40T’s to arrive and my only 21700 (Wuben), is about 1 cm too long
-tail magnet is so weak, it won’t hold the lamp anywhere

I’m yet to test it outside, but so far it looks nice. Especially considering the price…
I guess I now can order another FireFlies, I’m just trying to decide will it be another PL47 or the E07…

yes I am happy with mine as well. It has given me the confidence to go ahead and order another fireflies flashlight. Probably the E07

Thier ain’t no bones in a hot dog. F. York

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17track still has nothing.

Quote:
Unknown This number can’t be found at this moment. It’s not available in the carrier’s system yet. Please check back later.

< sigh >

Ordered late October. Jack Zhang confirmed the order 30 October. Shipped 26 November.

A tiny bit frustrating when other people have their lights already.

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DB Custom wrote:
the SST-20 95 CRI emitters are a pleasing tint, as it so happens it is very close to what I get from the mixed tints of 17 emitters in my 458 Ham’r, so it’s a big win! Big Smile

If a CW fan likes this 4000k, it must be really good. Wink

Did you take any lumen measurements?

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Not a CW fan, I like white, as in completely neutral with no tint in either direction.

The angle head doesn’t fit in the 4 1/4” opening of my light box so the readings from it seem skewed, very low. I tried it on the iJoy 21700, numbers are too low for me to believe so I didn’t even write it down. Seems like it was in the upper 1300’s. And yes, I know to double click for Turbo in Anduril…

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Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
I made a PL47 anduril ramp configuration estimated [stepped] lumen table

does my scribble table work? Or is there some wierd curve or slope thing …

Edit: …

Edit2: …

Any thoughts appreciated.

I think you need this. And maybe this.

Measure a few known points on the ramp, then mess with the calculator parameters until the curve fits your measurements. Reference values are in Anduril’s cfg-*.h files to get you started.

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Does the PL47 Anduril still have 255 steps? I though I read that was default for the UI.

I can say with ramp floor set to lvl 10 on my 219B is NOWHERE near 120 lumens. Probably closer to 2 or 3 at most.

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DB Custom wrote:
Not sure what planet you tested your 30T’s on cclight, but mine give far more current in most lights than any other cell I’ve tested against them, and I’ve tested a lot.

?? I don’t understand what you’re disagreeing with, that is what I expected. I remember posting in one of these threads just after you, saying which batteries give more current, according to HKJ, and it agreed with your observations.

DB Custom wrote:
I used the 458 Ham’r with it’s 17 emitters and 5 MOSFET’s to just find out what cell gives what… Big Smile For this test I used a single cell powering the Ham’r, 10 top cells in 4 sizes, couple of surprises… for the record, in the 21700 class the nearest competitor is ranked 8th, with 20700’s in the 6th and 7th spots. Enjoy!

1. Samsung 21700 30T ————- 30.3A
2. Samsung 18650 25S ————- 28.0A
3. Golisi 26650 Gold ————— 27.0A
4. Sony 18650 C5A ——————- 26.2A
5. Samsung 18650 30Q ————- 24.9A

These all agree with what HKJ says, except for the second one, which he didn’t test. Interesting to see it’s really good. I expected the Vapcell 2500 to be a rewrap of the Samsung 25S but HKJ shows it gives significantly less current than the VTC5A, so probably the Vapcell isn’t a rewrap of the 25S.

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Andrew_Debbie wrote:
17track still has nothing.
Quote:
Unknown This number can’t be found at this moment. It’s not available in the carrier’s system yet. Please check back later.

< sigh >

Ordered late October. Jack Zhang confirmed the order 30 October. Shipped 26 November.

A tiny bit frustrating when other people have their lights already.

In the same boat as you. I would say more than a tiny bit frustrating…

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ToyKeeper wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:

Any thoughts appreciated.

I think you need this. And maybe this.

Measure a few known points on the ramp, then mess with the calculator parameters until the curve fits your measurements. Reference values are in Anduril’s cfg-*.h files to get you started.

Ugh. I cant really make sense of the links. Code is outside my frame of reference. And i do not have a way to measure lumens, hence blf user estimated lumens (peak).

But it sounds like what you are suggesting is there is a weird curvey thing at work. In the code stuff i did see “visually linear”. And arent lumens funny that way, such that twice as bright actually is 4x’s technically bright? Which would suggest an exponential curvey thingy, right?.

So what you seem to be saying is my table doesnt work—which i suspected.

I am not really-math-capable, that formula truthfully exceeds my ability level to begin with. That said, it does seem like if the curve parameters are understood, the peak is given and the number of steps are given one should be able to define those steps with math, right?

Is there anyone out there who can do this?

BlueSwordM
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It’s quite easy. It’s a logarithmic curve following our eyes’ perception of brightness.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

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BurningPlayd0h wrote:
Does the PL47 Anduril still have 255 steps? I though I read that was default for the UI.

I can say with ramp floor set to lvl 10 on my 219B is NOWHERE near 120 lumens. Probably closer to 2 or 3 at most.

I got 150 from the rot66 thread, i think. Post 636 and another one— I have 2 screenshots of guys explaining how to configure ramp. But it is unclear to me the exact source. Both suggested 150 steps, but it is now unclear to me if that is complete steps or regulated steps.

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BlueSwordM wrote:
It’s quite easy. It’s a logarithmic curve following our eyes’ perception of brightness.

That was what i suspected, but seeing it is the easy part. I think the math part is slightly more complicated, no?

At least more complicated than my tables formula.

[Edit: Ha! easy is relative.]

DB Custom
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cclight, you said that the 30T doesn’t give that much more current than other cells, when in fact it yields some 50% more than other 21700’s… at least the one’s I have.

Maybe I misunderstood the context or something. . .

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BurningPlayd0h wrote:
Does the PL47 Anduril still have 255 steps? I though I read that was default for the UI.

I can say with ramp floor set to lvl 10 on my 219B is NOWHERE near 120 lumens. Probably closer to 2 or 3 at most.

It has 150 ramp steps from moon (level 1) to turbo (level 150).

Internally, this is implemented by using PWM with duty cycles of 0 to 255 on multiple power channels. But as far as the user needs to know, it’s 150 ramp steps following something close to a perceptually-linear curve.

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Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
Ugh. I cant really make sense of the links. Code is outside my frame of reference.

It’s not necessary to understand the code… but if you run it, it can calculate the estimated lumen output for you. It generates tables like yours, and lets the user choose which type of curve shape they want and how bright some of the points along the way should be.

It’s a python script, so it’d need a python interpreter installed. Depending on the OS, this can be a little inconvenient or it could already be installed by default.

Anyway, the links are the script used to calculate the ramp, the parameters sent to the script, and another thing to help determine exactly which of the 150 ramp levels it’ll use in stepped mode. The ramp shape it used wasn’t a logarithmic curve in this case; it used a ninth root instead.

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ToyKeeper wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
Ugh. I cant really make sense of the links. Code is outside my frame of reference.

It’s not necessary to understand the code… but if you run it, it can calculate the estimated lumen output for you. It generates tables like yours, and lets the user choose which type of curve shape they want and how bright some of the points along the way should be.

It’s a python script, so it’d need a python interpreter installed. Depending on the OS, this can be a little inconvenient or it could already be installed by default.

Anyway, the links are the script used to calculate the ramp, the parameters sent to the script, and another thing to help determine exactly which of the 150 ramp levels it’ll use in stepped mode. The ramp shape it used wasn’t a logarithmic curve in this case; it used a ninth root instead.

Ha. Thank you. But, maybe someone else with like minded enthusiasm will be able to do that, because i just hugged my knees, started crying and i am now rocking back and forth. I hope to be done crying by friday but we’ll see how it turns out.

Seriously though, that seems about a phd away from my level of typey thing aptitude.

cclight
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DB Custom wrote:
cclight, you said that the 30T doesn’t give that much more current than other cells, when in fact it yields some 50% more than other 21700’s… at least the one’s I have.

Maybe I misunderstood the context or something. . .

I said it doesn’t give twice the current of other high current cells. This is what your data show. It was in response to someone who asked if it’d be safe to use the 30T in the E07. I said it would be. In the same post I said I’d use the 40T in the PL47, due to heat issues, and the 30T in the E07.

Seems we’re in agreement.

Mildlyangryjohnny
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ToyKeeper wrote:
The ramp shape it used wasn’t a logarithmic curve in this case; it used a ninth root instead.

So i just tried to acquaint myself with the concept of ninth root as it is entirely foreign to me and i found stuff like this:

“…Any non-zero number, considered as complex number, has n different “complex roots of degree n” (nth roots), including those with zero imaginary part, i.e. any real roots. The root of 0 is zero for all degrees n, since 0n = 0. In particular, if n is even and x is a positive real number, one of its nth roots is positive, one is negative, and the rest (when n > 2) are complex but not real; if n is even and x is a negative real, none of the nth roots is real. If n is odd and x is real, one nth root is real and has the same sign as x, while the other (n − 1) roots are not real. Finally, if x is not real, then none of its nth roots is real…[wikipedia]”

The rest of the internet made about as much sense to me, didnt even seem like a comprehensible language for me, like i recognized the letters and some of the words but in combination, in context it just sounds like, “barblesnarfing harnkle pop doozelwenkel root plurfle zonkin buffle. Horple n > 2, yintoffen roffer (n – 1) noktory jimpley pinduffel…”

So unless someone else is willing to take up the cause i suspect this query is outside the scope of my abilities.

That said…i will consider the table i generated as a guideline with caveats. The provision being that it is wrong-ish, but ballparkyish right. In other words, good enough—for me—well not really, but no choice.

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