Which colour of LED bulbs is preferred?

52 posts / 0 new
Last post
TomNMich
Offline
Last seen: 8 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 11/01/2012 - 11:51
Posts: 69
Location: Michigan,USA

I’ve been using Feit 90CRI 3000K SKU number 1200267 lights from Costco. Rated 1600 lumens. Tested side by side with tungsten bulbs. Look very close to me. Not too warm.

Robin Dobbie
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 04/30/2019 - 12:49
Posts: 48
Location: Texas

So why is cool white prevalent on cheaper flashlights? Nobody wants it.

Obviously it makes sense that something nobody wants ends up on penny flashlights. But why cool white even exists is my real question.

Flying Luminosity
Flying Luminosity's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 months 18 hours ago
Joined: 09/12/2017 - 13:33
Posts: 628
Location: UK

Robin Dobbie wrote:
So why is cool white prevalent on cheaper flashlights? Nobody wants it.

Obviously it makes sense that something nobody wants ends up on penny flashlights. But why cool white even exists is my real question.

Less phosphor coating = cheaper price

Robin Dobbie
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 04/30/2019 - 12:49
Posts: 48
Location: Texas

Makes sense. It’s just that *often when there’s an option, there’s no price difference. Also there seems to be a lot of options for warm white or cool white, just like this poll initially was. Is it just really hard to nail neutral white?

Geuzzz
Geuzzz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 hours 49 min ago
Joined: 10/25/2015 - 10:27
Posts: 1188
Location: Netherlands

Flying Luminosity wrote:
Robin Dobbie wrote:
So why is cool white prevalent on cheaper flashlights? Nobody wants it.

Obviously it makes sense that something nobody wants ends up on penny flashlights. But why cool white even exists is my real question.

Less phosphor coating = cheaper price

+ Less phosphor coating = more lumens = better selling muggle specs

Jack Kellar
Jack Kellar's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 03/09/2014 - 14:21
Posts: 1911
Location: Throwing bolts at anomalies

Geuzzz wrote:
Flying Luminosity wrote:
Robin Dobbie wrote:
So why is cool white prevalent on cheaper flashlights? Nobody wants it.

Obviously it makes sense that something nobody wants ends up on penny flashlights. But why cool white even exists is my real question.

Less phosphor coating = cheaper price

+ Less phosphor coating = more lumens = better selling muggle specs


This. The seduction of high numbers that don’t effectively matter is strong among the ignorant ones.

Barkuti
Barkuti's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 7 min ago
Joined: 02/19/2014 - 14:46
Posts: 4970
Location: Alhama de Murcia, Spain

I completely agree. I've said this before somewhere else, but the way the lumen is defined I can tolerate, yet I do not concur. Let me quote where it says “the human eye's sensitivity to various wavelengths”, which is funny and ignorant because the eye is an organ of perception, the relative sensitivy to different frequencies is dictated by some program(s) in the mind. And the mind is not the brain… Innocent

 

The Light Innocent I am

Deleting a post and redoing it causes the forum thread answer notifications to become invalid. Thus, if you need to change your just published post, edit it. Thanks.

Please avoid quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim the quote down to the essential. Helps with forum neatness and legibility. Thanks.

Tally-ho
Tally-ho's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/23/2011 - 04:15
Posts: 1312
Location: France

zak.wilson wrote:
I find this odd since CW tends to produce much more visible backscatter, obscuring the view of whatever is being illuminated. I actually like my throwers warmer than my general-use lights. I suppose CW is better for playing lightsaber in the fog.

It’s not rare that I set my Viltrox panel is cool as it goes, but it’s 95 CRI and very close to the blackbody line. I’m less picky about color temperature when the other characteristics of the light are nice.


We are on the same boat.
For home, I can’t stand anything lower than CRI 95-CRI98 so i’m still using halogen bulbs.
For outdoor activities, the higher CRI the better even with a slight positive Duv. My throwers are 3000K-4000K. For close to medium range lightning : 3000K to 5000K.
For professional uses, the higher CRI the better even with a slight positive Duv. 4500K to 6500K, essentially Nichia 219B, E21A and optisolis, Luminus SST-20 (4000K).

I’m a long time adopter of high CRI LEDs and always hated CW but the optisolis 6500K was a game changer for me. Now I’m fine with cool white but only with a CRI above 95.

I’m really looking forward to Seoul Sunlike LED for household lights or something equivalent without a blue spike for NW and CW high CRI.


Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Online
Last seen: 55 sec ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 11104
Location: nyc

Robin Dobbie wrote:
So why is cool white prevalent on cheaper flashlights? Nobody wants it.

Obviously it makes sense that something nobody wants ends up on penny flashlights. But why cool white even exists is my real question.

Quantity over quality. An insignificant increase in brightness (spex!) sells more vs better viewing.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 days 6 hours ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 5528
Location: Canada

Yep.

For home, I’m planning to get some 4000k 95+ CRI LED strips around my homework+PC+work bench.

I don’t like the fact that incandescent lights consume a ton of power, make my work place even hotter, and don’t have as good dynamic range as high CRI LEDs.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

xevious
xevious's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 36 min ago
Joined: 02/27/2013 - 21:55
Posts: 1488
Location: Hoboken, NJ USA

Depends upon the application. In some cases, warm white works best while in others a neutral white is preferable. While I enjoy warm white, too warm and dark orange-like is too much. My preference is a lower temp neutral white, like about 3500~4000k.

I have to wonder if the only reason why cool white still exists is because of legacy (early on, cool white ruled), cost of manufacture, conditioned preference, or belief that the slight bit of higher brightness makes a worthwhile difference.

Based on all we see on the marketing end, since most lower end commercial LED flashlights are targeted to an ignorant audience, perhaps a muggle looking at 2 lights see one claim 2,000 lumens while the other 2,500 lumens, and the higher lumens is actually a little cheaper, well then that must be the better value! Not…

I find color temps above 5000k to become unrealistic and color altering, plus a more penetrating glare. It pains me when a company like JetBeam makes a great light and the only choice of emitter is cool white. Maybe that’s why there’s such a surplus of lights they released over 5 years ago.

Robin Dobbie
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 04/30/2019 - 12:49
Posts: 48
Location: Texas

I don’t know if I can buy the “less phosphor coating for insignificantly higher lumen rating for better specs” reason, because aren’t they all making up bogus numbers anyway? Unless I see numbers from a trusted reviewer, some random flashlight ad claiming umpteen lumens isn’t going to make me want to buy it on lumen claims alone. We’ve all seen flashlights which claim 200, 2000, 5000 lumens where the reality is it might hit 75 with a nice battery.

Barkuti
Barkuti's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 7 min ago
Joined: 02/19/2014 - 14:46
Posts: 4970
Location: Alhama de Murcia, Spain

Tally-ho wrote:

I'm really looking forward to Seoul Sunlike LED for household lights or something equivalent without a blue spike for NW and CW high CRI.


Interesting, but the current product range is too limited: four “only 3000K” COBs and two small 3030 mid power emitters at 0.2 and 1W rating.

 

The Light Innocent I am

Deleting a post and redoing it causes the forum thread answer notifications to become invalid. Thus, if you need to change your just published post, edit it. Thanks.

Please avoid quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim the quote down to the essential. Helps with forum neatness and legibility. Thanks.

Jack Kellar
Jack Kellar's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 39 min ago
Joined: 03/09/2014 - 14:21
Posts: 1911
Location: Throwing bolts at anomalies

xevious wrote:
Depends upon the application. In some cases, warm white works best while in others a neutral white is preferable. While I enjoy warm white, too warm and dark orange-like is too much. My preference is a lower temp neutral white, like about 3500~4000k.

Haven’t tried anything below 3000K, so I wouldn’t know exactly, but yeah, I’m not a fan of the tint of candlelight. “Incandescent bulb” (coincidentally 3000K-ish) is as warm as I can appreciate.

xevious wrote:
It pains me when a company like JetBeam makes a great light and the only choice of emitter is cool white. Maybe that’s why there’s such a surplus of lights they released over 5 years ago.

Not just that, their cool white LEDs have a painful purple shift. I had a BA20 a few years back and the tint sucked.

WalkIntoTheLight
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: 12/05/2015 - 10:26
Posts: 2153
Location: Canada

Geuzzz wrote:

+ Less phosphor coating = more lumens = better selling muggle specs

That’s the most popular answer, though I’m not sure I buy that. Manufacturers, especially of cheap lights, lie about their specs all the time. So, they don’t really need to use cool white to claim high lumens.

Maybe cool white emitters are just cheaper to buy in mass.

Tally-ho
Tally-ho's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/23/2011 - 04:15
Posts: 1312
Location: France

Barkuti wrote:
Interesting, but the current product range is too limited: four “only 3000K” COBs and two small 3030 mid power emitters at 0.2 and 1W rating.

Yes mid power emitters but the seoul 3030 sunlike seems to have the same footprint as the nichia 3030 optisolis and Clemence has this MCPCBs


1 – VR21P4 (flashlight)
2 – VS35SP36 (household light)

Robin Dobbie
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 04/30/2019 - 12:49
Posts: 48
Location: Texas
WalkIntoTheLight][quote=Geuzzz wrote:
Manufacturers, especially of cheap lights, lie about their specs all the time.

How often is it the manufacturer and not just the seller?

Here’s an SK68 clone claiming 50,000 lumens!

Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Online
Last seen: 55 sec ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 11104
Location: nyc
Robin Dobbie wrote:
I don’t know if I can buy the “less phosphor coating for insignificantly higher lumen rating for better specs” reason, because aren’t they all making up bogus numbers anyway? Unless I see numbers from a trusted reviewer, some random flashlight ad claiming umpteen lumens isn’t going to make me want to buy it on lumen claims alone. We’ve all seen flashlights which claim 200, 2000, 5000 lumens where the reality is it might hit 75 with a nice battery.

I’m talking real numbers, not made-up claims.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

Tally-ho
Tally-ho's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/23/2011 - 04:15
Posts: 1312
Location: France

xevious wrote:
I find color temps above 5000k to become unrealistic and color altering, plus a more penetrating glare.

At work, for close range i’m using two Jetbeam Jet-u modded by clemence with an optisolis 5000K and 6500K. It took me some time to get used to the CW, the NW is more pleasing to the eye but most of the time the CW gives me the impression to show “truer” colors (less “yellowish-ed”) with better contrast/separation. Red colors are a bit richer with the 5000K but there are tons of red shades in the 6500K optisolis compared to a CW CRI70, and the green and blue colors shades are excellent.
You should try to mod a flashlight with a 6500K E21A or optisolis to see how it looks like, we all get used to bad CRI CW, which makes the colors rendition of the high CRI CW hard to believe at first.

For my outdoors activity, I need to read IGN maps that are easier to read with the 6500K than with the 5000K particularly when brown/orange caracters are printed over green.

rngwn
rngwn's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 52 min ago
Joined: 05/17/2018 - 03:44
Posts: 367
Location: 暖武里,泰国

I find 4000k being a little “too warm” during the day and it kinda make the printout off-colored.

6500k also feels boring (bonus point when these are usually paired with low CRI). Everyone and their mother are using it where I live.

I find 5000-5500k suits me the best in most of the use cases.

 

Searching for High CRI leds since 2010...

 

Has finally gotten to the bottom after 10 years of delving deep into that rabbit hole of them high CRI lights...

 

High CRI, high quality lights doesn't need to be expensive, or is it?

 

Barkuti
Barkuti's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 7 min ago
Joined: 02/19/2014 - 14:46
Posts: 4970
Location: Alhama de Murcia, Spain

It's a matter of perception, rngwn. Temperature can also affect mood, and overall light intensity matters. To me 4000K is fine, and for the bedroom I prefer ≈3000K. Coolest temperature I am using is in the kitchen, with measured ≈4800K out of a mixture of 5700K and 4000K emitters.

 

The Light Innocent I am

Deleting a post and redoing it causes the forum thread answer notifications to become invalid. Thus, if you need to change your just published post, edit it. Thanks.

Please avoid quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim the quote down to the essential. Helps with forum neatness and legibility. Thanks.

Pages