Fireflies E07 preview

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Firelight2
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DB Custom wrote:
I’ve pushed 70.2’s, burned up 70.2’s, not all that keen on trying to kill em 7 at a time. Now, 7 XHP-35……. Wink
there you go Dale! Your new project!!! Convert an E07 to run with 7x XHP35!!!
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Well, I kinda do have something in mind that may allow the E07 to break 14,000, but we’ll see…

contactcr
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Take the lens and optic off, 10K, done Big Smile

Mildlyangryjohnny
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PBWilson wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
PBWilson wrote:
I’d like to thank those that shared the info about their lights.

I’ve been contemplating an E07 of my own, but I’m afraid I’d have to wait until they get the kinks out (battery tube length, proper screw placement and unmolested optic) before I’ll consider it again.

I know that these first runs can be a little risky, but dang, some of this seems very sloppy.

I feel it is important to point out people who like their lights tend not to complain about them. You are mostly hearing about the trouble, folks with trouble, are having, because they are the ones talking most.

Do what you want with that information.

the e07 is easily the best edc i have ever owned. And i have owned- many-and regularly used many, for a very, very long time.

Just putting that on the table is all.

I appreciate that and understand your point completely.

Still, it’s hard to ignore that Fireflies has had some challenges with each of their last three releases. Not just one or two reports, but there have been more reports of complaints that make me think I see a trend.

I’ve said before (maybe in this thread) that this light could be a game changer with the output, size, UI and even the awesome looks. I would love to buy one, but the repeated reports of very similar issues makes me pause at this time. I’m not asking for perfection, just tightening up on the details, which I’d bet could be solved down the line with a little care and attention.

I’m not trying to dump on Fireflies. They are putting out lights that appeal to many of us here. They’re doing their homework in the areas of size, features, UI and power. Now if they could work out the kinks. they’d be quite the company.

No real argument with anything youve said here. Except maybe the “trend” part—consider this.

1)- this is a hard crowd to please. Very detail focused. So things that would pass in conventional, commercial releases are a little more under the microscope here. A good example is the screw placement and broken optic leg. To notice this nearly invisible flaw, one has to disassemble the light. That is under the hood. In most applications this is where one sees how the sausage is made. That is a fussy detail. This is a fussy population. It does not from what i have read affect the function of the light. BUT, it is a fussy detail some people have taken exception with.

2)- some of the complaints i have seen are very subjective. Meaning they will not apply to everyone. Battery fitment as an example. Ff made a dimunitive light and it takes batteries on the smaller end of 21700 variability scale. This is frankly, in my opinion an age old Li-ion issue. All of my 18650 lites and batteries do not always fit nicely. I consider this subjective. Not necessarily a fault. The recommended solution is to buy batteries that fit based on advise in the thread. The problem is most folks are trying to make batteries fit that dont. This seems silly to me. And a “user operating error” category of problem.

3)- i just ordered a 2nd e07. My order number was 87x. Which suggests nearly 900 orders placed. Lets say there are 50 folks who have had complaints that should be rectified thru warranty. The subjective issues i dismiss. 50 is a high number based on the thread. But lets use 50 (as a totally arbitrary number) of problems that need to be fixed. From ~900 orders. Thats still a ~95% success rate.

What i have personally noticed in this thread a bit less than in the pl47 thread is there are some folks with very high expectations for a 55$ flashlight. There are some folks that really zoom in at impractical levels of perception and pick out stuff that almost seems irrelevant and at times rediculous. This results in an examination mainly by the 50 unhappy folks, and consequently very little is heard from the [presumably] ~850* happy customers. *(850 customers. Some likely purchased multiple lites per order, as i did.)

I do not consider it logical to consider the 50 negative experiences as a trend, if there are in the neighnorhood of 850 people with positive experiences. Perhaps, we differ on the meaning of trend. I dunno.

I buy alot of tools. I think long and hard about duty cycle when purchasing tools. If it is a one off gig, i may purchase at harbor freight or similar import cheap type outfit. With the expectation it is about 50/50 the tool will fail or will have a less than optimal duty cycle. If i need the tool to be used 8 hours a day for a year i will opt for a more reputable brand. Even the reputable brand will have failures. And need fixing ay some point but the understanding is that there is a higher quality control and better components.

In this analogy harbor freight is within 50-70% success rate. A milwaukee (similar) tool is in the 90-95% success rate.

I would argue that ff is in the 95% success rate category. But charging harbor freight prices.

That said, its your money, and your decision. I felt i had to provide some perspective because this place is a microscope that isnt always rational.

Again, just putting that on the table.

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Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
The recommended solution is to buy batteries that fit based on advise in the thread. The problem is most folks are trying to make batteries fit that dont. This seems silly to me. And a “user operating error” category of problem.
To call piss-poor fitment, for a battery listed on the fireflies store site, sold as an option with the light, a “user operating error” is ludicrous.
The light is a manufacturing mess, even with its price taken into consideration. That it performs well in my case is of little compensation, given the glaring faults.
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Adhara wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
The recommended solution is to buy batteries that fit based on advise in the thread. The problem is most folks are trying to make batteries fit that dont. This seems silly to me. And a “user operating error” category of problem.
To call piss-poor fitment, for a battery listed on the fireflies store site, sold as an option with the light, a “user operating error” is ludicrous.
The light is a manufacturing mess, even with its price taken into consideration. That it performs well in my case is of little compensation, given the glaring faults.
A too short battery compartment isn’t a “manufacturing error”. It’s a design error. Basically, Fireflies should have just designed the light a couple mm longer so there would be more space for the battery.

I certainly don’t think of my E07 as a “manufacturing mess”.

  • Mine appears well built and looks great especially with the purple LEDs.
  • The UI is awesome
  • The beam pattern and tint look great
  • The lumen output is astounding.
  • The price is right

Sure you could spend $300 and get a few more lumens and better build quality from a Nitecore TM10K, but for the price the E07 is a superb light. And I quite like my ROT66 too.

M4D M4X
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Firelight2 wrote:
Adhara wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
The recommended solution is to buy batteries that fit based on advise in the thread. The problem is most folks are trying to make batteries fit that dont. This seems silly to me. And a "user operating error" category of problem.
To call piss-poor fitment, _for a battery listed on the fireflies store site, sold as an option with the light_, a "user operating error" is ludicrous. The light is a manufacturing mess, even with its price taken into consideration. That it performs well in my case is of little compensation, given the glaring faults.
A too short battery compartment isn't a "manufacturing error". It's a design error. Basically, Fireflies should have just designed the light a couple mm longer so there would be more space for the battery. I certainly don't think of my E07 as a "manufacturing mess". * Mine appears well built and looks great especially with the purple LEDs. * The UI is awesome * The beam pattern and tint look great * The lumen output is astounding. * The price is right Sure you could spend $300 and get a few more lumens and better build quality from a Nitecore TM10K, but for the price the E07 is a superb light. And I quite like my ROT66 too.

 

well said!

i still like my E07 

but FireFlies should use our findings and opinions for a V2...

 

already member of M4DM4X.com ?

the best deals are waiting for YOU!

 

before you buy elsewhere mail me: MARTIN@M4DM4X.COM - i will try to save you money!

mihlit
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Yes, I think there is a space for official or silent revision with longer tube. I plan to buy another E07 (and maybe more than one), but I will wait for longer tube. I’m quite happy with the form factor, UI and lumen output, so I hope they will fix the issues.

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The Emisar lights are designed with specific batteries in mind. Most flashlights with a battery carrier or multiple cells have specific battery requirements. This is just how it works with certain lights. They want to make a compact/high powered light and this is how it’s done.

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Received mine today from Neals Gadgets. I can see a philips head screw under one of the lens legs, so I have the screw issue. This doesn’t bother me too much.
I ordered a Samsung 40T along, it came undented since both threads were not fully tighened. But I was stupid enough to dent the top while tightening the tailcap, even though it didn’t feel like I was pushing it too hard. It’s a really tight fit. Later on I noticed that the solder blob on the head spring was pretty tall, so I reflowed it to gain additional space.
Also I feel like the switch could be more clicky.

But even with those issues I love this light. Those blue aux LEDs are gorgeous! The output is plain stunning (I’ve got the 6500k XPL HIs)!

I measured the standby drain with aux LEDs on on mine: it’s 0.56mA. Not sure how accurate that is, but this should give it about 9 months of standby time.

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kanton wrote:
So.. there were complaints about short/narrow battery tubes and the wrong assembly resulting in them damaging the optics to somehow make it still work, damaging screws and other parts too. In the thread the manufacturer himself started. And the manufacturer keeps quiet the whole time? Not even a “we will look into that” or any explanation? Meh.

Yes, it says a lot about Fireflies as a company.
I’ll reveal you a secret – they don’t even reply to emails.
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Adhara, you ARE aware that Fireflies is a new company with a grand total of 3 lights in production, right? 3 lights. Yours is the 3rd. Have you yourself ALWAYS been 100% perfect on your 3rd attempt, at ANYTHING? If the answer to that is yes, let me introduce you to Tom Tom…

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DB Custom wrote:
Adhara, you ARE aware that Fireflies is a new company with a grand total of 3 lights in production, right? 3 lights. Yours is the 3rd. Have you yourself ALWAYS been 100% perfect on your 3rd attempt, at ANYTHING? If the answer to that is yes, let me introduce you to Tom Tom…

On top of this even good companies have issues. First, troubleshoot it properly with FireFlies, not the court of public opinion. If they do not come to a satisfactory resolution, continue your bitching.

I have a Spyderco knife that I just got like 3 months ago that rattles, it’s one of their newest knives and they have a good track record. I’m going to let them warranty it. If they don’t resolve it you better believe I wont be buying another, but i’m pretty confident they will make it right so I will withhold judgment until then.

Adhara
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P33 wrote:
kanton wrote:
So.. there were complaints about short/narrow battery tubes and the wrong assembly resulting in them damaging the optics to somehow make it still work, damaging screws and other parts too. In the thread the manufacturer himself started. And the manufacturer keeps quiet the whole time? Not even a “we will look into that” or any explanation? Meh.

Yes, it says a lot about Fireflies as a company.
I’ll reveal you a secret – they don’t even reply to emails.

Yeah, when I unboxed the gf was watching, curious. When the light came out, she asked “Is this used?” (crappy finish), then when the battery was checked she noticed the crushed top before me, and asked “Are you sure this is new?”…

Well, I reached out to Jacky giving them the opportunity to resolve this. We’ll see what happens, but bless PayPal, the dispute process makes things easy if it’s not resolved.

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Hey Hobo, did Neals send you tracking once shipped and how long did it take them to ship?

Hobo
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Firemedic wrote:
Hey Hobo, did Neals send you tracking once shipped and how long did it take them to ship?

Yes they did. Ordered on December 27th, got shipping notification with tracking info on January 7th and it arrived today. So shipping to Germany was actually really fast.

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Deputy Dog
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Flashaholics wrote:
Nitecore managed 10,000 with a 21700

That’s quite a feat, but… I don’t think I’d want to carry that thing.

Mildlyangryjohnny
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Adhara wrote:
Mildlyangryjohnny wrote:
The recommended solution is to buy batteries that fit based on advise in the thread. The problem is most folks are trying to make batteries fit that dont. This seems silly to me. And a “user operating error” category of problem.
To call piss-poor fitment, for a battery listed on the fireflies store site, sold as an option with the light, a “user operating error” is ludicrous. The light is a manufacturing mess, even with its price taken into consideration. That it performs well in my case is of little compensation, given the glaring faults.

Whoa there fella. You certainly are a bit excitable. I think you just voiced all your issues in public. Perhaps, you do this with whom you purchased the light from, firstly. Secondly, it is possible you got a bad light (or) a bad battery. I dont know that i had singled you out. I have been following these fireflies threads for a few months now. It has been my observation that it is often “user operating error.” Because wrong batteries were purchased or whatever. This is not black and white one or the other scenario, there very well could be milling errors and assembly problems. But i tend to think everyone wants it the way they want it and that doesnt always mesh well with reality. Someone earlier wanted to fit a rofis protected cell in the light, for example. This is a battery thats about 7 inches long.

Beyond that, things do happen. It is possible that the light you received is garbage and such. Maybe you got the bottom of the bin. Maybe it was a shift change on the milling machine. Who knows.

It is, however, equally possible that the battery is not a representative sample for whatever reason—and you got unlucky. Talk to the person you purchased from. See if they will make it right.

If you purchase something in a store and its not right you bring it back and get another one or your money back. You dont call up your local news station and scream at the top of your lungs, “i just bought a bluray player and it didnt work. The cord didnt fit right, the screen was fuzzy…etc. etc…grrr…grrrr…”

No. You just go back to where you bought it and swap it or get $ back. Not this whole dramatic woe is me tirade. You just get another one.

This sort of behvior seems rampant here. And maybe its tolerated for a reason. But i dont know what that reason is. I am kind of new to blf. So i have yet to grow accustom to this infantile and obnoxious behavior. Kind of like the behavior of little children. When i was speaking to the fella above i was warning against trusting in folks that are, shall we say, excitable. Because we only hear from them. They are upset and angry and frustrated and feel cheated and dissappointed etc. These sorts of emotions tend to bring out the loudest and most intense, and frankly uncivil behavior in folks.

I was simply trying to provide a different perspective—something other than the few who are angry talking most and loudest—skews the sample a bit. i am sorry if i ruffled up your undershorts. I think you said your light performed well. Which suggests that your problems are also subjective. And you are now in the camp of folks speaking loudest and angriest. But i think your group is small.

I could be wrong about everything, but not usually.

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About people’s UI questions, the manual might answer a few things. It’s written for Anduril in general though, not for any specific model of light. So some details will probably differ on a per-model basis.

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I’m on Johnny’s team… agree with going the simpler route first, allowing the mfr to correct the possible issue.

I also have so many lights, so much experience with so many more, I don’t typically expect much one way or another at entry level prices… especially not from a new company. These days a meal for two can easily exceed the price of these lights. That said, $50 or so is virtually expendable. If you don’t think so, perhaps you shouldn’t be purchasing lights from China in the budget arena. Really that simple. Reasonable expectations, and a calm attitude prevails.

I have found that I don’t usually like the high priced top name brand lights as they come out of the box, not any more than any budget light, so if I’m going to have to mod them to make them perform to my liking why spend so much? Not to say I haven’t modified expensive lights, I have, but over the past several years I have not once filed a claim or returned a light. Not once. And I’ve had well over 300 lights of my own. I simply fix it and move on if there’s a problem. Pretty much expect there to be something to fix, almost disappointed if there isn’t…

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Got my e07 in today and the light was smaller than expected even after seeing all the pictures. And was impressed with the light even after hearing all the positive reviews. This is my top and favorite smaller size light out of my fairly large collection. The only con I have is the heat sinks are kinda rough…almost a bit sharp even.
So I looked over my instruction and even the pdf manual but I can’t seem to figure out how to change my UI to the smooth ramp.
It’s set to the step ramp currently. I would like to make it to have the lowest floor possible and have the highest ramp the same as turbo.
Can somebody help me please.

Adhara
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blueb8llz wrote:
Got my e07 in today and the light was smaller than expected even after seeing all the pictures. And was impressed with the light even after hearing all the positive reviews. This is my top and favorite smaller size light out of my fairly large collection. The only con I have is the heat sinks are kinda rough…almost a bit sharp even. So I looked over my instruction and even the pdf manual but I can’t seem to figure out how to change my UI to the smooth ramp. It’s set to the step ramp currently. I would like to make it to have the lowest floor possible and have the highest ramp the same as turbo. Can somebody help me please.

Turn the light on. 3 flast clicks switches between stepped/smooth cyclically.

When on and smooth selected, 4 fast clicks. Light will blink once, then flicker. Click once and wait.
Light will blink twice, then flicker. Click once and wait. Light will be set to lowest low for floor and highest high for ceiling.
(It’s supposed to be that by default, mine was not).

mihlit
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I don’t think that example is valid. If you buy a blueray player and it does not work, you know something happened and solve it through the warranty. If you find out that a car has bad passanger safety and even in a slow speed accident, it will crush your legs, you take it to the news station to warn people. One emitter does not work is a situation for warranty. Mnf. probably does not know about it. Big portion of flashlights have worn out screws and misplaced one resulting in the leg broken of, speaks about mnf process quality issues. Everyone in every review speaks about host quality, too sharp fins, not matching anodizing or strait bad finish. Why it won’t be allowed here? And for the battery fitting, that’s even more important and I don’t think that mnf does not know about these issues now.

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Got it working. Thanks Adhura! I like the light even more now. Fireflies is doing big things. Love all three of their lights. So darn bright.

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blueb8llz wrote:
Got my e07 in today and the light was smaller than expected even after seeing all the pictures. And was impressed with the light even after hearing all the positive reviews. This is my top and favorite smaller size light out of my fairly large collection. The only con I have is the heat sinks are kinda rough…almost a bit sharp even. So I looked over my instruction and even the pdf manual but I can’t seem to figure out how to change my UI to the smooth ramp. It’s set to the step ramp currently. I would like to make it to have the lowest floor possible and have the highest ramp the same as turbo. Can somebody help me please.

See post 746

Thier ain’t no bones in a hot dog. F. York

PBWilson
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This thread and the last couple pages have given me some good stuff to mull over. I am seeing some perspectives and others I’m not.

$50 isn’t cheap. For a top-performing light, maybe so, but I don’t throw around that kind of money without thinking for a moment. That’s me. Having a similar performing light available in the same ballpark, price-wise, it makes my decision clearer. I would guess that Fireflies might want to take the feedback and make some changes to make their light come out on top.

When I used the word “trend” I wasn’t just referring to this light. Fireflies had some (probably more) issues with their other two lights and even if the lights that are getting complaints aren’t statistically large, it’s still pretty clear to me that with a little extra care, testing and communication within their company, they could improve. This light came out pretty darn quickly compared to others in the past couple years. Maybe a little extra time would have avoided some of the things that bug folks on this forum.

For me, I guess that I’m willing to wait for some real-world experiences with the lights I’m interested in. I’ve been burned on a group buy before and I have benefited by waiting until a new run has corrected some early bugs. I’m just willing to wait on this one. I’d bet that most would agree that this light could be a monster of power and value. Addressing the things that have come up in these threads would benefit Fireflies for sure. For now I’m content to wait.

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PBWilson wrote:
…, it’s still pretty clear to me that with a little extra care, testing and communication within their company, they could improve. This light came out pretty darn quickly compared to others in the past couple years. Maybe a little extra time would have avoided some of the things that bug folks on this forum.

For me, I guess that I’m willing to wait for some real-world experiences with the lights I’m interested in. I’ve been burned on a group buy before and I have benefited by waiting until a new run has corrected some early bugs. I’m just willing to wait on this one. I’d bet that most would agree that this light could be a monster of power and value. Addressing the things that have come up in these threads would benefit Fireflies for sure. For now I’m content to wait.

Fair enough. But if i were fireflies, once i got my production issues worked out, and did more elaborate and thoughtful design process with testing and r&d, and added employees to manage customer service, etc. Etc. i would double my prices—because if the production issues are worked out they’d be producing a top shelf product—in a different league altogether—function/output-wise. I think people are missing the value, here. And they are being tested and critiqued in the crucible that is blf. Seems gutsy, to me.

Not only are folks missing the value here but are not really aware of what is involved with being a small shop and managing all the pieces by a single individual or just a few employees.
All things considered, 2 short years ago i bought a thrunite tn36ut cw, for about 236.00$. It outputs ~6-7000lumen. And is a huge 4 cell light. I can reach similar output for 80$, in a single cell pocketable light, in the e07.

There is no reason to think that once they get production, material sourcing and labor dialed in that the prices wont go up. It is how things work.

[Edit]: A comparable light in the zebralight 21700, w/ 70.2emitter ~3000lumen. $120 plus shipping. Zebralight has not been immune to customer complaints. I remember when i got my sc600fd IIIplus, there was a huge number of people returning the light because of various issues. Havent followed the zl700, so cant speak to that.

There’s a saying, “cheap, fast, good. You can pick 2. Cheap+fast not gonna be good. Good+fast not gonna be cheap. Cheap+good not gonna be fast.”

learningtofly
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PBWilson wrote:
For now I’m content to wait.

Me to, whats a couple months? Not much.

noboneshotdog
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I’m not sure if FF quality control is that defendable for the price. I like their lights and all, but sincerely believe their QC could be upped a few notches. Just seems a bit sloppily built. Attention to detail should be more of a workmanship pride consideration than a pricing consideration.

What I’m saying is they are all being built piece by piece. The pieces just need to be put together with a little more pride and care.

For example, two people are working at the FF shop and one is putting some pride and attention to detail in the way he assembled the product and works just as efficiently as the one who isn’t. Is there going to be a price increase because one is taking pride in his work while the other who is working beside him isn’t?

The person who isn’t is becoming an expense and a liability. FF is sending out extraordinary amounts of replacement lights and numerous hours of time expended on dealing with problems.

All this wasted profit and energy, all due to somebody’s lack of putting some pride in thier work. I feel very badly for FF as this lacking must be killing thier profitability.

Ultimately thier lack of QC is making thier company suffer.

FF is putting out a superior product. They just need to have these products assembled in a more superior way.

Thier ain’t no bones in a hot dog. F. York

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Location: US

Johnny makes a lot of good points. Guys please don’t use Paypal until you have really exhausted all options. We are very fortunate to have someone make lights that fulfill the wishes of our small BLF niche. These feature combinations incorporated into a flashlight prior to Fireflies were a BLF dream and Fireflies helped us turn our dream into reality. These features include the much coveted Lexel designed driver, BLF designed NarsilM/Anduril firmware, abundant LED options including the discontinued legendary 219B sw45k 9080, good option of beautiful aux LEDs, AR coated lens, awesome heat dissipating design on E07, clear anodized option, multi-emitters in compact form factor, and some of the brightest production flashlights for their size category. The E07 is measured to be twice as bright as the previous brightest single cell flashlight, D4S, which to me is quite an astounding feat. I don’t consider the TM10K because the lumens were not verified by calibrated equipment, much larger form factor, and turbo only last 7s.

Sure that the build quality is not as good as the Emisar/Noctigon lights and there definitely are bugs and imperfections, but what do you expect from a brand new small (1-man?) shop making lights for a very small enthusiast niche? Even large billion dollar companies like Microsoft and Apple with tens of thousands of engineers have countless bugs with every new version and updates as can be seen all over the news and forums. FF only sold a few hundred of each light at a very bargain price so there’s not a whole lot of money to be made especially if you include the R&D/production cost. Let’s try not to bash them and utilize Paypal to get a free light as that will only discourage them and BLF will lose a valued flashlight maker. I do say it is bargain price because if you go on CPF you will see lights selling for 5x to 10x the price cannot match FF features.

Btw, I have 2 PL47 and 5 E07 and tested it with so many different 21700 cells with zero problems. Only the Acebeam protected 21700 doesn’t fit but no other 21700 lights can accommodate that cell besides Acebeam lights. I am also extremely happy with these lights for the price despite there are room for further improvement.

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