Convoy S2+ Luminus SST20 vs Nichia 219c beam profile question

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eggmang
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Convoy S2+ Luminus SST20 vs Nichia 219c beam profile question

Recently the Convoy S2+ is now being sold by Convoy with either the Luminus SST20 or Nichia 219c LED. Both default configurations offer the SMO reflector.

Out of interest I purchased the SST20 version and was surprised that the ‘hotspot’ is small (ie more of a thrower), much like an XPL-HI with SMO reflector.

I guess I incorrectly assumed that because the SST20 has a dome shaped LED it would be more like an XML2 and offer lots of ‘flood’.

I understand that the reflector contributes to the tightness of the hotspot (OP vs SMO) but the LED itself must also have an impact on the throw as an XPL-HI will still offer more throw than an XML2 even when running the same reflector.

Question: Does the 219c offer the same sort of tight, thrower like hotspot as the SST20 does?

Thanks all

eggmang
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Hey guys, Any opinion on this one?

Without being academic and getting too detailed, I’m just curious if the 219c is going to offer a similar hotspot to the SST20?

BlueSwordM
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The Nichia 210C is floodier than the SST-20.

I would still recommend getting the SST-20 version. The tint and color rendition is even better than the 219C.

However, you can ask Simon to put in an OP reflector rather than an SMO reflector for more flood.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
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eggmang
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Thanks for the reply Big Smile

I already own the S2+ with SST20 4000K and find the hotspot too tight. I was preferring more flood. Fitting an OP reflector helped a little, but it was still tight. I found the OP reflector just smoothed out the edges of the hotspot and not really improved the flood. In any case it’s still a great light so I’ll happily keep it.

Yes I agree the SST20 does provide a very nice colour and tint, but I find this is only after putting 1.5A – 2.8A through it. On lower current/mode it looks a little green. I assume this is normal?

BlueSwordM
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Below 1A, it is normal to see a bit of green. A lot of emitters tend to do that.

If you want maximum flood, I would recommend getting this 60 degree lens instead:
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/LED-lens-for-CREE-XML-XML2-LED-60degree/330416_1577614278.html

You will be getting maximum flood then. Heck, you could even try every lens, and pick which one you prefer.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

eggmang
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Thanks BlueSwordM,

Those lens’ look very interesting.

I assume that these drop straight into the S2+ and replaces the existing aluminium reflector and glass lens? Or is a little cutting/hacking required?

BlueSwordM
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No, straight drop in.

Of course, it’s: TIR—- Glass lens.

Remove the glass, remove the reflector, put in the lens, put in the lens, and you’ve got a “new” light.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
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Johm
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eggmang wrote:

because the SST20 has a dome shaped LED it would be more like an XML2 and offer lots of ‘flood’

-The size of the led die is very important in determining flood/throw.
The SST20 is tiny compared to the XML2 that is why it produces more throw in the same reflector.

-A de-domed led increases the light angle, so more of the emitted light will hit the reflector and become throw.

eggmang
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BlueSwordM, Thanks for this information Big Smile

Johm, I do understand what you mean now. I incorrectly assumed that the shape of the dome contributed to the flood but yes the SST20 die is tiny. Thanks for pointing this out!

On another note, I see in Convoy’s store Simon now sells a C8+ but with SST40. When I look at the SST40 from google images, it appears this die looks large like XML2 (not small like XPL-Hi or SST20)

Can we hope for a tight and far throw with C8+ SMO and SST40? I have C8 with XML2 and the throw was not so great, but my C8 with XPL-HI produces great throw.

Johm
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eggmang wrote:
Can we hope for a tight and far throw with C8+ SMO and SST40? I have C8 with XML2 and the throw was not so great, but my C8 with XPL-HI produces great throw.

The beam will be tighter with the XPL-HI.

However the SST-40 produces twice as many lumens so the throw should be similar but bigger hotspot.

Mocarny
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Hi, do you have comparison between SST20 and Nichia 219C? Photos, or which one is more neutral white.

Yokiamy
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That all depends of the tint and bin of the led.
What are you looking for?

Personally, i prefer the 5000K 219C over the SST20

Edited by: sb56637

Mocarny
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SST20 and Nichia 4000K
Hmm I was looking at this 5000K too, but found it too blue, from the photos. Is it really noticable blue?

BlueSwordM
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No, but I prefer the SST-20 4000k anyway since it throws quite a bit farther than the 219C, and has better red color rendition.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
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Mocarny
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And that’s the point, I am looking for indoor use light, more flood, in camping, 10m max distance, in tent, reading and so on.
I have one XML2 and it looks little rosy, 3D in ANSI. Would rather have 3C, don’t like this red colour. But I guess Nichia 4000K nad SST20 looks little rosy, right?

lightwonder
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Both the Nichia 219c 4000k i have are more warmish yellow in tint

BlueSwordM
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@Mocarny, for floody use, get a 60 degree lens.

You’ll see the difference in flood. Smile

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

Mocarny
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Right, I will get this lens for sure Smile

But I am looking for the purest of the pure white, the one and only. It can be 80+ CRI, no need to have 90+ CRI

Ryzbor
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Mocarny wrote:
Right, I will get this lens for sure Smile

But I am looking for the purest of the pure white, the one and only. It can be 80+ CRI, no need to have 90+ CRI

Try the Olight H2R or H1, these are ridiculously neutral.

Otherwise a quad 4500K+5000K E21A mix should be very neutral I suspect.

good tint: Nichia E21A 2000K-7500K except d240 bin, Nichia 219B sw40/sw45, 219C sw303, Cree XPL-HI A/D bins, XHP70.2 5A, Samsung shaved LH351D's, SST-20 FD2, FA3, HA3, .

Mocarny
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Hmm I can’t get quad, planning to put this LED in S2+ to have small, low power camping light. I am so close to get this Nichia 219C 5000K, but I’m afraid it is little bluish. Maybe I should buy both 4000K and 5000K and find this out myself. And SST20 Smile

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Quad E21A has rougly the size of a “normal” led so it fit’s in the S2+ with a 45 o 60dg TIR.
5000K 219C is imo terrible for woodland, it’s coldish and does a bad job at rendering greens and browns, 4000K or even less does this better.

good tint: Nichia E21A 2000K-7500K except d240 bin, Nichia 219B sw40/sw45, 219C sw303, Cree XPL-HI A/D bins, XHP70.2 5A, Samsung shaved LH351D's, SST-20 FD2, FA3, HA3, .

nobody
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I have the 4000k 219c and the 4000k SST20. The 219c has a bigger and more yellow hotspot. The SST20 is tighter, throws farther and is a little greenish at lower levels. I put DC-Fix on the 219 and it is great now. Great for outdoors, a little more floody and a little less yellow in the center. Decent for short to medium long distance around a campsite and trail.

I plan on getting a filter for the sst20 to lessen the green at the lower levels. I know it will affect the throw some but I think it will be worth it. I hardly noticed the green when I first got it. But when I compared it to some of my other lights, it stood out to me. It’s fixable though. I basically use my lights at 300 lumens or less. Generally around a 100. 

I like your last suggestion on getting several different ones and compare. Find what’s right for you. You can keep the others or sell or give away. It won’t break the bank and you will know what you like. 

Mocarny
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nobody wrote:
The SST20 is tighter, throws farther and is a little greenish at lower levels. I put DC-Fix on the 219 and it is great now.

Is the 219C greenish at the low levels? And…what is DC-Fix? Silly

nobody
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No green on mine. Dc-Fix is a window film you can get at many hardware stores to diffuse light. You can get a big roll for not much money or you can get a smaller sheet from a member here for less money. There are many styles. I have it on a few lights to tweak them to my liking. Google it to get a lot more information. 

Mocarny
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Wow, this DC-Fix looks great!

Anyone knows the CRI R9 value of the 219C 4000K?