Noctigon K1 info / review

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mmander
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DB Custom wrote:
If we as flashaholics keep shining super throwers into buildings our lights are going to become outlawed. Just saying.

Yes the shots are pretty, but no they should not be taken like that where inhabited buildings are concerned. Discretion is key…

I’m actually glad you made this comment since I fully agree with you. I was almost going to add a few more notes to my beamshots, but thought “Nah… nobody here will care.” but I was wrong. I am very mindful of shining bright lights into buildings and felt a little guilty. I almost never use my lights in the city. Pretty much all the other beamshots I have ever done have been out in nature where there were no people around and even there, I was actually worried about disturbing animals!

With the building in the first beamshot photo that had Science World (the globe building) below it, as well as the closer one (400 meters), I only took two shots of each and the light was only switched on for about 1.5 seconds each time, just a little longer than the 1 second exposure. On the other vertical shot, with that one I left the light on for some time and took a bunch of photos since I was hand-holding at 1/4 second and wanted to make sure I got at least one sharp one. That building is new, construction is not yet finished and it is not occupied as far as I know.

Flashlights & light-painting on my blog: www.mikemander.com >flashlights

mmander
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ToyKeeper wrote:
mmander wrote:
This one is from False Creek, hitting the 160 meter high top of the weird new twisted apartment building. This is 950 meters away according to Google Earth and the exposure is different than the previous ones: handheld (not propped) at ISO 3200, f/3.6 and 1/4 second…

(photo)

If there was a prize for best K1 beam shot, I think you just won it. I haven’t seen any other photos which so clearly demonstrate what this light does… and it’s also generally just a great picture.

Thanks. Looking at the whole photo again this morning, one could think that maybe the beam isn’t hitting the building and that one is merely seeing the blue backscatter from the beam, so I decided to make a simple zoomed in animated GIF with no fancy text. Since I had been handholding the shots, the control shot is not lined up perfectly, even after nudging the layer in Photoshop. However one still gets the idea… and yep, zoomed in it is clear that the beam is hitting the top of that building.

Flashlights & light-painting on my blog: www.mikemander.com >flashlights

justanotherguy
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Can’t wait. I want some vinh numbers first though

anyone in NE ILLinois into get togethers?

mmander
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komeko wrote:
… Color … Hmm, turbo is blue, 8835K. You can see that the LED is heavily distorted. Just slide down a bit with power and we have a nice pure white 6489K. …

Interesting. I wonder what other people will find on their W2 versions? With my W1, I would say that visually there is only the slightest bit of difference in colour temperature between turbo and much lower power settings. As a guesstimate, 6500K on lower power levels and maybe 7000K on turbo, if that. However that is not measured, just a guess… and oh, that is with my cell at 4.0 volts. I will look at it again when it is fully charged and report back if I feel it is any different…

Flashlights & light-painting on my blog: www.mikemander.com >flashlights

BOMBAY
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I wonder why there is no sst40 version, it is an interesting and good LED with high brightness at 2000LM which at the moment none of the K1 versions

SKV89
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mmander wrote:
komeko wrote:
… Color … Hmm, turbo is blue, 8835K. You can see that the LED is heavily distorted. Just slide down a bit with power and we have a nice pure white 6489K. …

Interesting. I wonder what other people will find on their W2 versions? With my W1, I would say that visually there is only the slightest bit of difference in colour temperature between turbo and much lower power settings. As a guesstimate, 6500K on lower power levels and maybe 7000K on turbo, if that. However that is not measured, just a guess… and oh, that is with my cell at 4.0 volts. I will look at it again when it is fully charged and report back if I feel it is any different…

I measured the CCT and tint on the W2.

komeko
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Today, I charged the akku again, cleaned all contacts and smoothed the edge of the pipe. My final measurements:
Lumens 1359
Lux 456K
Range 1351m
CCT 8835K
3.53 degrees angle

The beam is very similar to TN42, which gave me such results:
Lumens 2164
Lux 658K
Range 1623m
CCT 5612K
3.7 degree angle.

As can be seen from the measurements and visually, the beams are very similar only in TN42 a little more power.
I like K1 because it is so inconspicuous.

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ChibiM
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Agro wrote:
At low currents it's somewhat inefficient, at high it's very efficient. Please let me explain... All LEDs are more efficient at low currents than they are at high. As you driver them higher, output increases. Similarly and more importantly for comparisons - surface luminosity increases. To reach high luminosity you need to sacrifice high efficiency. Now...some emitters lose efficiency faster than others. White Flat starts not very efficient, but its efficiency drops relatively slowly. The peak output is achieved at about 50 lm/W. In general - horribly inefficient. But then - no other LED gets the same luminosity with higher efficiency, so is it bad? "Here":http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1339991#comment-1339991 you can find surface luminosity vs. efficiency chart. White Flat is not there but there are the previous generation emitters. White Flat is more efficient across the range, the curve shape is similarly flat. So...it's modestly efficient at low surface luminosities, but compared to other emitters - somewhat inefficient. At higher luminosities it's very inefficient but compared to other emitters - very efficient.

 

I meant lm/w efficiency. 

Yes, looking at cd/w it looks much better Wink

SKV89
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Thumbs Up Never under estimate the importance of cleaning the contacts. I’ve had brand new lights that doubled in lumen output after cleaning contacts. Used lights need to be cleaned every once in a while too because thread grease or finger grease can get on battery terminals and contacts.

komeko wrote:
Today, I charged the akku again, cleaned all contacts and smoothed the edge of the pipe. My final measurements:
Lumens 1359
Lux 456K
Range 1351m
CCT 8835K
3.53 degrees angle

The beam is very similar to TN42, which gave me such results:
Lumens 2164
Lux 658K
Range 1623m
CCT 5612K
3.7 degree angle.

As can be seen from the measurements and visually, the beams are very similar only in TN42 a little more power.
I like K1 because it is so inconspicuous.

Agro
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ChibiM wrote:

Agro wrote:
At low currents it’s somewhat inefficient, at high it’s very efficient. Please let me explain… All LEDs are more efficient at low currents than they are at high. As you driver them higher, output increases. Similarly and more importantly for comparisons – surface luminosity increases. To reach high luminosity you need to sacrifice high efficiency. Now…some emitters lose efficiency faster than others. White Flat starts not very efficient, but its efficiency drops relatively slowly. The peak output is achieved at about 50 lm/W. In general – horribly inefficient. But then – no other LED gets the same luminosity with higher efficiency, so is it bad? Here you can find surface luminosity vs. efficiency chart. White Flat is not there but there are the previous generation emitters. White Flat is more efficient across the range, the curve shape is similarly flat. So…it’s modestly efficient at low surface luminosities, but compared to other emitters – somewhat inefficient. At higher luminosities it’s very inefficient but compared to other emitters – very efficient.

 


I meant lm/w efficiency. 


Yes, looking at cd/w it looks much better Wink


But cd/mm² and lm/W are closely related. Outside of pure floodes it doesn’t make much sense to look at one and ignore the other. And at the level of cd/mm² that this emitter achieves – it is efficient.
Harborseal
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junkyardbiker wrote:
Okay so I am at a loss for what to do about my K1. December 16th was the last tracking update from DHL Ecommerce saying transiting the postal network from JFK. Since then my tracking number is no longer in their system, And USPS never received the package from them. No one is helping me. Cant file lost package with USPS because they never received it, DHL “cant” do anything for me, but says it updated as leaving Jamaica on the 20th of december?

@Junkyardbiker

Have you tried the http://en.4px.com/ site? I got daily or up to 4 times per day updates except for the 5(!) days the light was in customs in Chicago. The 4 days 4px told me DHL had it (and where it was) DHL denied they had it. USPS said they were waiting for hand off from day 2 in DHL’s custody until the day after 4px said USPS had it. 4px was right every day and updated me any time anything happened.

Last year China tracking was worthless. Now they’re the best.

Harborseal
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I just got mine today. The night was full of mist. By 50 meters all you could see is the beam. At 30 meters it lit up the trees very strongly. Guess I’ll have to wait for a clearer night.

ChibiM
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Agro wrote:
ChibiM wrote:

Agro wrote:
.

 

I meant lm/w efficiency. 

Yes, looking at cd/w it looks much better Wink

But cd/mm² and lm/W are closely related. Outside of pure floodes it doesn't make much sense to look at one and ignore the other. And at the level of cd/mm² that this emitter achieves - it is efficient.

 

You are probably correct, but I was just looking at 4.62 Amps for 780 Lumens. And felt a little underwhelmed. but that is just the nature of the beast I guess. I should also look at throw.

DB Custom
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I set up a measured 30M lux test this evening and compared the GT to the new K1 and my recent upgrade to my 7th scratch build. The K1 did 693Kcd for 1664.93M throw. This equates to 1.04 miles. Very impressive!

justanotherguy
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Is the K1 stock Dale?

anyone in NE ILLinois into get togethers?

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Yup, one of few such in my possession…

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DB Custom wrote:
I set up a measured 30M lux test this evening and compared the GT to the new K1 and my recent upgrade to my 7th scratch build. The K1 did 693Kcd for 1664.93M throw. This equates to 1.04 miles. Very impressive!

Very nice…

I’m guessing my measurements are low because the sensor wasn’t far enough away for a proper reading. IIRC, I measured it at only 5 meters, which probably isn’t a long enough shot for this type of thrower.

A 30 meter test sounds much more effective.

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I first tested mine at 5M as well, it was in the lower 600’s and impressive enough to make me leave it alone, the longer 30M test is likely more appropriate for a thrower, as you say. I was setting up for the truly big boys and included the K1 on a hunch. Big Smile

(The big boys pretty much annihilated it by the way. The SBT-90.2 is for real! 4860 lumens doing 1.863Mcd)

To it’s credit though, I carried the K1 in the pocket of my sweat pants when going outside for this test. Impressive beyond words when looking at it’s competitors…

justanotherguy
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Honestly I want a K1 more and more, I just want to know if Vinh can up these a decent amount….

anyone in NE ILLinois into get togethers?

DB Custom
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Not much of a way to up the performance in these, they’re running at max levels as they are. Now, significant changes could yield some good results and I’ll probably investigate this further… should have a 90.2 to play with this week. Depends on what your acceptable performance parameters look like, we all have varying expectations…

Bronco
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I’ve been a flashlight enthusiast for over twenty years – all the way from Wayne at Elektrolumens, to Wayne at Skylumens. I remember how psyched we were to hear the first rumors that Luxeon might soon be releasing a new emitter that was going to put out a whopping 70 lumens – almost twice what a 3D Maglite could do. Big Smile

And if I’m being perfectly honest, the older I get, the more I’ve come to despise these uber complex, multi-layered torch UIs. I’ve had my new K1 for all of about 12 hours and probably actually used it for only about 120 seconds. I’ve done nothing more than turn it on, ramp up brightness, ramp down brightness and turn it off. Yet on the 20 minute drive between home and work – in its holster, inside a backpack – the light somehow managed to reprogram itself into a mode where it wouldn’t go above maybe 50% brightness. Two minutes of use and I’ve already got one factory reset under my belt. Thank God this forum exists or I wouldn’t have figured out that much. And I’m by no means singling out this otherwise very impressive light. I’ve got a BLF GT Micro that’s almost completely worthless. It will only turn on in turbo mode and then immediately go into thermal regulation. All attempts at a reset have failed miserably.

If anyone out there is listening, I have to believe there’s still a market for offering a bare bones, no frills UI option with these lights. Turn on, ramp through the full range of brightnesses and turn off. That’s it. No strobes. No beacons. No SOS. No choices between stepped and continuous ramping. No reprogramming thermal step down points. No adjusting button colors. Just light. Call it the “Curmudgeon UI”. I won’t be offended.

Having all these options was fun at one point. But now I’m at a stage where I can appreciate a flashlight that’s less complicated than a space shuttle launch. I had actually bought this light with the intention of gifting it to my cousin who’s far less of a flashlight maven than anyone posting here. I don’t know how I can do that now, given my own two minute track record. Again, I’m not saying to keep these complex UIs from the people who appreciate and get excited for them. By all means, program away. Just please consider offering an opt out package for the ‘less is more’ contingent.

Thank you. Wink

- Semper Fi -
Bill

Agro
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Bronco wrote:
I’ve been a flashlight enthusiast for over twenty years – all the way from Wayne at Elektrolumens, to Wayne at Skylumens. I remember how psyched we were to hear the first rumors that Luxeon might soon be releasing a new emitter that was going to put out a whopping 70 lumens – almost twice what a 3D Maglite could do. Big Smile

And if I’m being perfectly honest, the older I get, the more I’ve come to despise these uber complex, multi-layered torch UIs. I’ve had my new K1 for all of about 12 hours and probably actually used it for only about 120 seconds. I’ve done nothing more than turn it on, ramp up brightness, ramp down brightness and turn it off. Yet on the 20 minute drive between home and work – in its holster, inside a backpack – the light somehow managed to reprogram itself into a mode where it wouldn’t go above maybe 50% brightness. Two minutes of use and I’ve already got one factory reset under my belt. Thank God this forum exists or I wouldn’t have figured out that much. And I’m by no means singling out this otherwise very impressive light. I’ve got a BLF GT Micro that’s almost completely worthless. It will only turn on in turbo mode and then immediately go into thermal regulation. All attempts at a reset have failed miserably.

If anyone out there is listening, I have to believe there’s still a market for offering a bare bones, no frills UI option with these lights. Turn on, ramp through the full range of brightnesses and turn off. That’s it. No strobes. No beacons. No SOS. No choices between stepped and continuous ramping. No reprogramming thermal step down points. No adjusting button colors. Just light. Call it the “Curmudgeon UI”. I won’t be offended.

Having all these options was fun at one point. But now I’m at a stage where I can appreciate a flashlight that’s less complicated than a space shuttle launch. I had actually bought this light with the intention of gifting it to my cousin who’s far less of a flashlight maven than anyone posting here. I don’t know how I can do that now, given my own two minute track record. Again, I’m not saying to keep these complex UIs from the people who appreciate and get excited for them. By all means, program away. Just please consider offering an opt out package for the ‘less is more’ contingent.

Thank you. Wink


TBH I’m between.
I modified Andruil for my own use and the most important change was deletion of all the stuff I don’t use. There was a lot of it.
Sometimes wish there was not just advanced-mode and muggle-mode but also some (default) mode in between. Simple ramping with shortcuts and not much more.
polarweis
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Bronco wrote:
I’ve been a flashlight enthusiast for over twenty years – all the way from Wayne at Elektrolumens, to Wayne at Skylumens. I remember how psyched we were to hear the first rumors that Luxeon might soon be releasing a new emitter that was going to put out a whopping 70 lumens – almost twice what a 3D Maglite could do. Big Smile

And if I’m being perfectly honest, the older I get, the more I’ve come to despise these uber complex, multi-layered torch UIs. I’ve had my new K1 for all of about 12 hours and probably actually used it for only about 120 seconds. I’ve done nothing more than turn it on, ramp up brightness, ramp down brightness and turn it off. Yet on the 20 minute drive between home and work – in its holster, inside a backpack – the light somehow managed to reprogram itself into a mode where it wouldn’t go above maybe 50% brightness. Two minutes of use and I’ve already got one factory reset under my belt. Thank God this forum exists or I wouldn’t have figured out that much. And I’m by no means singling out this otherwise very impressive light. I’ve got a BLF GT Micro that’s almost completely worthless. It will only turn on in turbo mode and then immediately go into thermal regulation. All attempts at a reset have failed miserably.

If anyone out there is listening, I have to believe there’s still a market for offering a bare bones, no frills UI option with these lights. Turn on, ramp through the full range of brightnesses and turn off. That’s it. No strobes. No beacons. No SOS. No choices between stepped and continuous ramping. No reprogramming thermal step down points. No adjusting button colors. Just light. Call it the “Curmudgeon UI”. I won’t be offended.

Having all these options was fun at one point. But now I’m at a stage where I can appreciate a flashlight that’s less complicated than a space shuttle launch. I had actually bought this light with the intention of gifting it to my cousin who’s far less of a flashlight maven than anyone posting here. I don’t know how I can do that now, given my own two minute track record. Again, I’m not saying to keep these complex UIs from the people who appreciate and get excited for them. By all means, program away. Just please consider offering an opt out package for the ‘less is more’ contingent.

Thank you. Wink

I feel the same. Specially when giving the light to somebody who doesnt know it. I got a one mode c8 for that purpose.

"It wouldn’t be so bright if there wasn’t a shadow every once in a while." - Jason Mraz

DB Custom
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Four clicks- lockout…. no accidental button issues.

I do see your point, my memory is horrible and too much by way of options gets lost on me. That said, Anduril is my favorite UI and I use it in every light I possibly can.

Agro
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DB Custom wrote:
Four clicks- lockout…. no accidental button issues.

I reduced that to 3 clicks in mine. Perfectly safe and significantly easier to use.

I added a number of changes related to lockout…

  • 3 clicks unlock turns the light on
  • 3 clicks-hold unlock turns the light on at moonlight and starts ramping up
  • 3 clicks from either off or on locks the light out
  • When power is connected the light starts locked out rather than off
  • the light automatically goes from off to lockout after 10 minutes of inactivity
  • AUX LEDs are bright when off but dim when locked out, so I can immediately tell what mode I’m in

It works WAY better than stock for me.

Kevin Z
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Bronco wrote:
I’ve been a flashlight enthusiast for over twenty years – all the way from Wayne at Elektrolumens, to Wayne at Skylumens. I remember how psyched we were to hear the first rumors that Luxeon might soon be releasing a new emitter that was going to put out a whopping 70 lumens – almost twice what a 3D Maglite could do. Big Smile

And if I’m being perfectly honest, the older I get, the more I’ve come to despise these uber complex, multi-layered torch UIs. I’ve had my new K1 for all of about 12 hours and probably actually used it for only about 120 seconds. I’ve done nothing more than turn it on, ramp up brightness, ramp down brightness and turn it off. Yet on the 20 minute drive between home and work – in its holster, inside a backpack – the light somehow managed to reprogram itself into a mode where it wouldn’t go above maybe 50% brightness. Two minutes of use and I’ve already got one factory reset under my belt. Thank God this forum exists or I wouldn’t have figured out that much. And I’m by no means singling out this otherwise very impressive light. I’ve got a BLF GT Micro that’s almost completely worthless. It will only turn on in turbo mode and then immediately go into thermal regulation. All attempts at a reset have failed miserably.

If anyone out there is listening, I have to believe there’s still a market for offering a bare bones, no frills UI option with these lights. Turn on, ramp through the full range of brightnesses and turn off. That’s it. No strobes. No beacons. No SOS. No choices between stepped and continuous ramping. No reprogramming thermal step down points. No adjusting button colors. Just light. Call it the “Curmudgeon UI”. I won’t be offended.

Having all these options was fun at one point. But now I’m at a stage where I can appreciate a flashlight that’s less complicated than a space shuttle launch. I had actually bought this light with the intention of gifting it to my cousin who’s far less of a flashlight maven than anyone posting here. I don’t know how I can do that now, given my own two minute track record. Again, I’m not saying to keep these complex UIs from the people who appreciate and get excited for them. By all means, program away. Just please consider offering an opt out package for the ‘less is more’ contingent.

Thank you. Wink

Thumbs Up Thumbs Up Thumbs Up
Bronco
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You hit the nail on the head, Dale. It’s not just that these UIs are complex, it’s also that there are now so many of them. I have these five lights that use Andúril. Those four use VNX3. This pile here uses Emisar D4. The ones over there use VNX4. All very capable and well thought out UIs, no doubt. Their creators deserve tremendous praise. But I’ve simply lost the desire to master them because I personally have no compelling use case for 99% of what they have to offer.

If nothing else, perhaps we could at least convince these UI designers to come up with interfaces that make it near impossible to get into any programming mode accidentally. I actually love having the ability to custom set my moonlight mode very low. I think the first light I can remember giving me that capability required that I quickly twist the tail cap on and off something like twelve times to enter programming mode. That I can live with, and/or gift with confidence, because I know there’s no way the light could unintentionally enter such a mode in the field. But having a light that can accidentally reprogram itself just by dropping it in its holster the wrong way is unacceptable.

Anyway, thanks to all who’ve commented for your understanding. I wasn’t quite sure what might await me when I reopened this thread this morning, but I’m very relieved to see that my comments are being received in the spirit I intended them. It’s certainly not my intent to offend any who are responsible for these UIs. You are all far smarter than I am. Smile But perhaps a little constructive criticism could result in future interfaces that have enhanced value to all users, regardless of their use case.

- Semper Fi -
Bill

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Broke down and sprung for one.

anyone in NE ILLinois into get togethers?

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Anyone care to weigh in on going with a W1 or W2?

Planning on getting one eventually, and I’m leaning towards the W2. Given the larger emitter surface, the beam should be a little broader than the W1 at the expense of total throw, correct? I understand it’s 100,000CD less than the W1 and a higher lumen output, I’m primarily interested in a slightly less laser-like beam pattern that the W1 is capable of.

Bronco
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DarkShot wrote:
Anyone care to weigh in on going with a W1 or W2?

Planning on getting one eventually, and I’m leaning towards the W2. Given the larger emitter surface, the beam should be a little broader than the W1 at the expense of total throw, correct? I understand it’s 100,000CD less than the W1 and a higher lumen output, I’m primarily interested in a slightly less laser-like beam pattern that the W1 is capable of.

I’d say your analysis is pretty much spot on.

- Semper Fi -
Bill

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