Emitters... looking for info/ advice.

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Abarth_1200
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Emitters... looking for info/ advice.

So I’ve been away from the hobby for a good few years and getting back into the forums I’m seeing lots of new emitters, with lots of different tints, cri ratings, and emitter brands.

My current array of lights have mostly 4000k Cree or nichia emitters, couldn’t tell you the bin, cri, R value or anything like that so don’t really have a great starting point other than I know what I like and certainly know I don’t like green or blue tints.

I can imagine I like a higher cri than one that doesn’t light up colours accurately, so the higher the cri the better in my eyes (please correct me here)

Tint- I’m open to experiment, I keep seeing warm tints down to 2700K, I would like to try out at least another 3000K (I owned an HDS HI cri 3000K many years ago and I’m wondering why I sold it on now)

So group, learn me on tint preference over cri rating, can a high cri be a bad thing if the tint is not preferable?

Next question while I have your attention, where can I browse/ research emitters, drivers, parts to perform my own custom mods? Hopefully there’s a few online retailers not put off shipping to U.K.or even some members on here stock parts?

Thanks for now, sorry if it’s all been asked before but there really is a lot of information scrolling back through years of posts.

Edited by: Abarth_1200 on 10/11/2020 - 14:36
jon_slider
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Your question is very broad, and there are a lot of factors, including terminology that you will need to learn in order to communicate effectively.

Tint is misused by almost everyone, when the correct term is Color Temperature.

Color temperatures include
Warm White (3000k is an example of Warm White) and
Cool White (6000k is an example of Cool White),
and
Neutral White, (4500k is an example of Neutral White)

Neutral is also used in reference to Tint, but Neutral White, and Neutral Tint are two totally different things.

Tint is an important variable. In the above image, the CW has Green Tint, plus it is Low CRI.

Look at the red coral, which LED makes the red look best to you?

> So group, learn me on tint preference over cri rating, can a high cri be a bad thing if the tint is not preferable?

High CRI is an independent variable, assuming you want it (I do)
you will want to start with a Color Temperature you like, that is available in High CRI
then among the High CRI options in your chosen color temperature, you will want to choose a Tint you like

for example, a 4000k neutral white XP-L is typically Low CRI and has nasty yellowish green tint
4000k is also a popular High CRI color temperature, the Nichia 219b 4000k is a typical example of one that tends to have pink tint

then there is the 4000k SST-20 and LH351d. Both have tint that is more green than a 219b.

> I owned an HDS HI cri 3000K many years ago

ok, lets start there.
3000k is a Color Temperature (tint is something else, generally it involves either green tint, or pink tint.. and for gods sake dont even try to use creamy white as a tint)

the CRI of the XPG HDS used was about 83 CRI Ra (Ra means average), there is also to me, an even more important kind of CRI, called CRI R9 (R9 is the Red output)

some “High CRILEDs have CRI Ra of 90+, and CRI R9 of 50+
your HDS may have had a CRI RaR9 of 8350, where 83 is the typical CRI most often referred to, it is Ra, not R9. The 50 in the 8350 is the R9.

you may need to be repeatedly exposed to these concepts for your brain to start to grasp the distinctions

so, here I show you an XP-G like HDS used, an 8350, (these were nominally actually 3200 Kelvin Color Temperature), next to a N219b 3000k 9080, that you can buy from Andy Zhu in the classifieds

I like the slightly more pink tint of the XPG, but that LED is NLA
the 3000k 219b looks “warmer” (yellower color temperature), but also yellower Tint.

> Next question while I have your attention, where can I browse/ research emitters, drivers, parts to perform my own custom mods?

first pick one specific light you think you want to modify and determine if it is a suitable host. Some lights cannot be opened in a non destructive manner, so modding them may be out of the question. Some lights have an LED board that is not compatible with the new LED you want to use, so you have to also buy a new MCPCB to reflow the LED onto

then determine what Color Temperature you want.

then buy LEDs from Andy Zhu.
My two favorites are the 219b 3000k 9080
and my top pick the 219b 4500k 9080

welcome to the conversation
this board is extremely modding savvy

the questions you need to answer are
what light do you think you want to mod
what LED Color Temperature do you think want to use.
Will you tolerate green tint in order to have higher lumen output?

references
incandescent light bulbs have a color temperature of 2700 to 3000k (Warm White)
sunlight has a color temperature of about 5000k to 5700k (Daylight White)

When your brain has its white balance set to Daylight, it will see Warm White as very yellowish. Otoh, when your brain has its white balance set to Warm White, it will see a Cool White LED as very blueish.

Since you mention you have several lights with 4000k Color Temperature, what LED models are they, and how do you feel about them?

Abarth_1200
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Thank you for all the information, most of it makes sense. So I know now that tint refers to how nice the emitter looks, I was already clued up on Kelvin ratings so that’s fine.

When you say your favourite emitters are 219b 3000K 9080 that’s the Nichia 219B 90 cri R9 of 80? But there’s no mention of tint? How am I meant to know what the tint will look like before I buy the leds? And for that matter so manufactures list emitter tints for example olight may say it’s a neutral white Cree emitter but I haven’t really seen tint codes mentioned anywhere.

I would probably start with a cheap modable host and pick up the parts to suit, just seems a lot missing information regarding actually doing any mods is missing around here almost like it’s an old art that is passed done through generations not a new tech that is talked about openly

Correct me if I’m wrong but I haven’t seen a single post or guide telling us what a boost driver is compared to a fet and what pcb boards fit what leds

rdhood
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“then there is the 4000k SST-20 and LH351d. Both have tint that is more green”

You know, I keep reading this, but I just got in a few flashlights about 6 weeks ago, and the SST 20 and LH351d’s that I have are beautiful with no green tint whatsoever. My SP36 and C01S are both beautiful with Absolutely no off colors anywhere in the beam.

To the OP, good luck. We each have our own preferences. I’ve had really good luck with these two emitters.

BurningPlayd0h
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Abarth_1200 wrote:
Thank you for all the information, most of it makes sense. So I know now that tint refers to how nice the emitter looks, I was already clued up on Kelvin ratings so that’s fine.

When you say your favourite emitters are 219b 3000K 9080 that’s the Nichia 219B 90 cri R9 of 80? But there’s no mention of tint? How am I meant to know what the tint will look like before I buy the leds? And for that matter so manufactures list emitter tints for example olight may say it’s a neutral white Cree emitter but I haven’t really seen tint codes mentioned anywhere.

I would probably start with a cheap modable host and pick up the parts to suit, just seems a lot missing information regarding actually doing any mods is missing around here almost like it’s an old art that is passed done through generations not a new tech that is talked about openly

Correct me if I’m wrong but I haven’t seen a single post or guide telling us what a boost driver is compared to a fet and what pcb boards fit what leds

Tint can vary greatly even within the same order the manufacturer makes unless they are specifically buying ones tested to meet a certain requirement. You probably have seen it listed though… any light correctly listing a “219B sw45k” has the rosy tint listed per the “k” designation.

Info on types of drivers. You can look up the datasheet for a particular LED and see what the pad size is. This generally tells you what MCPCB you need except for oddballs like a few of Nichias emitters like the E17/21A that don’t have a thermal pad and need a specific pad layout on the MCPCB. 3535 (3.5×3.5mm) and 5050 (5×5mm) are very common.

LowLumen
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Yes, you must know the specific “tint bin” in addition to the Kelvin color temp and CRI rating of the LED. Tints can be above the neutral line towards yellow/green or below the line towards magenta. Most manufacturers separate into tint bins, but many flashlight manufacturers won’t specify the tint bin(s) they use. If you don’t know what tint bin you are getting, you may be disappointed.