Imalent MS18 with 100,000Lumen and R90TS with 36,000Lumen

I have zero interest in buying a MS18. It’s too expensive and I have no use for it. I’m just curious about the design of it. It’s like an alien, I want to dissect it and see how it works. :smiley:

That’s probably how aliens feel about us too.

I can just imagine aliens looking at us like lab rats! To them we would have to be considered a very dumb and violent species.

I thought about that and is a potential solution BUT you need to force too much air and consequently a larger diameter to hold on to.

You already have 2” body to accommodate 4 cells, now you need to get to 3” to have an adequate space to carry air. But, that is still not enough to carry hundreds of cfm. Now you need to get into to 4” plus diameter. The only other solution to high cfm is more pressure, not really a solution.

There is another way…and it’s nothing like anything ever made. Start thinking about much more surface area and how to achieve that. Throw away everything you know and just try to see how to get massive amount of surface area. Thus you can maximize the heat transfer from given low pressure cfm.

See, the thing is, Imalent doesn’t seem to put much R&D in their light designs.

I mean, if they really wanted to sustain very high lumen levels in such a large head, rather than making a bit heatsink with a lot of thermal mass, they should make a CPU type heatsink with tons of fins.

The light itself would get above ambient more quickly, but dissapate a large amount of heat, and under active cooling, could probably sustain 32000 lumens continuous output, or even 50000 lumens with a powerful fan.

I doubt that these companies pay as much attention to solving an obvious problem as they do to make it cheaper and sell more….more….more.

Let’s throw out 30,000 lumens for x seconds and ….look at me. 199.95 please.

Would you be surprised that I spent 10% of sales on machinery and RD? Most of the production machinery was in house…or repurposed technology.

90% were duds, 10% made a lot of money. And that is in an industry crippled by Chinese labor.

I mean, I can easily differentiate lights that are very wall made and have quite a bit of R&D behind them.

The BLF Q8 has outstanding heatsinking for its size.

The MT07S has excellent heatsink and a very well made driver. It is super efficient on the 500 lumen mode.

The GT is an absolute beast.

Etc.

The problem is that R&D takes time. A lot of it. Which is why it’s expensive, and why BLF lights take such a long time to make.

Even simple changes are hard to do, especially with Chinese companies not usually willing to take many risks and innovate.

Two examples I’ve encountered:

1. LEDs not easily available to order in China. The LH351Ds are not easily available to order in China. So, lights that use them, and manufacturers try to steer away from them.
So, they have to order them outside of China, where prices are higher, you have to pay customs and taxes, and have no preferential treatment.

2. Springs. With my experience in conductive springs built up, I’ve actually had some companies consult me about ideas for higher conductivity springs****

Well, recently, I’ve had a company ask what they could do to improve their springs for more power. I’ve told them to use:

- Double springs. No problem.

- Gold/silver plated springs. No problem.

  • Phosphor bronze. No problem.

The issue comes when I try to use more advanced materials/techniques.

- Triple layer electroplating. Nickel-copper-silver. Less expensive than gold, but quite a bit higher performance. No dice. Says “takes too much time, complicated and not many companies do this”. But I know 2 that do. Nothing still.

  • BeCu C17530 wire. They ask, why not BeCu C17500? Because it has way worse mechanical properties, and the offset in conductivity can be overcame with triple layer separate plating.
    No dice.

Judging from their past efforts (and VoB’s teardown) I think not at all. They look like they got some CAD whiz making cool looking shapes that many folks will oooh and aaah over. It’s laughable, because the active cooling for a 100W COB is about three times the size of what’s in the Imalent, only the Imalent has a crappier fan. They could have just made the finned heatsink and head one solid casting, then extended all the fins out to the exterior. It still wouldn’t be enough, but it would be a lot better than what they have now.

I hope Imalent listen and design a better active cooling.
And let user charge the battery easily without taking the light apart.

You don’t need hundreds of CFM because the body has surface area too. Manufacturers could easily make an extrusion with internal fins, exponentially increasing surface area. They could also add through holes to allow heat pipes from the head. There’s no rules stating that one must hold a flashlight from its body; a separate, ergonomic handle would be great - you can make it adjustable, and you can hook the handle onto your belt or backpack strap. And with the ginormous head this thing has, an external handle could have a more forward design, which would make the light balance better on the hand, instead of being head-heavy. You can have the handle mount to a t-slot in the extrusion, which would make it adjustable, and able to mount the light to whatever you want. And thus, you don’t have to think of the body as having to be round.

CPU heatsink you say?


.

I built a spotlight not long ago using a Fresnel lens, and an Osram White Flat 2mm^2 LED, mounted to a 90mm dia. x 50mm thick aluminum heatsink, actively cooled with a 12V fan pulling fresh air through the fins, and exhausting out the back. I’ve pumped a max 34W into that LED and you can feel the warm air coming through the exhaust end, even in the cold winter here. I can’t imagine a smaller heatsink and fan dissipating 20-30 times that power - just to squeeze out another 5 seconds of turbo time?

I’ll stick with the GT4 over the Imalent R90ts. With 18 LEDs I don’t see how those tiny reflectors will be deep enough to throw 2000 meters. And with the qc issues Imalent has had, not to mention the grossly exaggerated output numbers, I just don’t feel like I would get what I’m paying for. I don’t care if it’s a million lumens. Doesn’t matter if it doesn’t work.

Did I mention 10% of my company sale went for new machinery and RandD? I could of just pocketed that and let the company rot away. Maybe even a few bank con jobs along the way.

As an engineer, I paid nothing for the actual engineering, but prototypes, trips to see machinery capabilities, making/modifying machinery, sending samples to customers, material testing……it’s expensive and chances are, the market won’t buy it.

It’s not surprising that most of the products out there are copies, or copies with a bit of a change. The vast majority are styling exercises. True usability/efficiency breakthroughs are not as common as they appear considering the size of the market.

Then there are the copy cats, mostly foreign and out ovf the reach of lawyers, that will suck away all the innovators hard work. And the retailers who don’t give a damn if some cut rate foreign company copied your product, as long as it was cheaper to them and more profitable.

Yeah, I have a chip on my shoulder about this…anywho, back to 1 million lumen flashlights.

Do you know that CPUs are in the 150 watt range? Some way higher. Yet they can run continuously with their fans on.

CPU fins and fans are available in surplus stores.

Any discussion on output sustainability and very high power lights has to start with fins and fans.

Ummm….you need the cfm to push the air through the fins. Passive or low air volume is not enough in close spaced fins. That is why CPUs have fans. Noisy fans.

But otherwise, keep going……you’re heading in the right direction. Forget the body, work the head. Lol

i was actually wondering: how mature will these lights be?

I know Acebeam takes many months before a light gets into production, but Imalent

seems to add them almost by the week....

That worries me a bit.

Im more curious all the legal stuff, can they get away with this, imean just looking the numbers if we asume its real, is there no limit for lights and how much lumens they are allowed to have? I also think on highest whatever the lumens it will pull u will probably get blinded on the ground just pointing the light , saw the same thing with acbeams x70 so much light goes into the ground and bounces back into your own eyes…. cant see how the max output will be high just a very brief moment :…

weird it has less intake holes then ms12 if that design will be final, looks weird that head is supposed to handle 1300w of power…

No limit at all, why would there be? Maybe the Swedish government is a bit too “hands on”?

no i mean shipping them worldwide, really no regulations shipping furnace lights at all with serious flaws ?