TLF/BLF/Lumintop FW3A review (18650, 3x XP-L HI cool white)

Remember the times when the Airlines would not deliver Li-ion cells? Because of fires on planes? This was because of the vape folks ordering liquid’s for their vape unit and Li-ion cells together… when packaged poorly the containers of liquid got broken and the wet Li-ion cells combusted… in the cargo hold of the airplane. Wet Li-ion cells are just bad news. period.

Don’t teach people HOW to mangle a potentially lethal cell, teach them NOT to.

Or be sure your bank account is padded so when they screw up and sue you for the damages you can handle it. :wink:

Thanks everybody for the information on how to do it and why it’s best for me, that I shouldn’t do it.

Lawyering might be fun, but difficult to handle being the butt of so many bad jokes.

I used to be a professional nerd, running the Semiconductor Modeling Team and the Engineering Lab for a GaAs/GaN wafer fab and design facility in Dallas. But since 2015 I’m just another retired guy waiting for leisure time to kick in.

I think sleeping on a bed of $100 bills would make the jokes tolerable

Another word of caution about attempting to modify li-ion cells: The power output of these cells is high enough to cause second-degree burns in the split second it takes to jerk one’s hand away.

Unfortunately, I know this from personal experience.

I haven’t had a single button-top cell that was welded, but that might depend on your source I guess.

So the lumen output of the cool white XP-L HI is 2800. Can anyone comment on the likely output of the 7A (3000K) XP-L HI?

Very likely it will be less. How much less, I don’t know.

IIRC, the Convoy C8 was listed as somewhere around 20% less for the 7A vs the 1A. I can’t find the specs on that right now, so I’m going from memory.

I bought the 3A and 7A, and visually there’s not much difference.

I think your right about the source.
I have quite a few from Li Ion Wholesale & all are very securely & nicely spot welded. They do it themselves, ‘in house’; and do it right.

I have several from China vendors & about half of them are spot welded. Most of those spotwelds are pretty crappy to…. especially compared to LiIon Wholesale.

My experience…. yours may vary. :+1:

It will depend on the brightness bin of the leds, their Vf and what battery you use. So very unpredictable. It could be brighter or dimmer.

But Jason, he’s asking specifically about the emitter choice in the FW3A, they say 1A or 7A so those are known choices as far as power binning goes.

HC, 7A is going to be dimmer and easier on the eyes almost regardless of power bin, there are only so many power bins available and to get a 1A that performed low enough to match a top tier 7A it would require a binning level not commonly available. So the 7A will be less, x 3. If the 1A is making 2800 on the triple then each emitter is making ~933 lumens, so if you were to see 20% less per emitter the total may be as low as ~2390 lumens as compared to the 2800 they list for the 1A. Sounds like a lot, still somewhat difficult to see in real world use. Side by side you could tell, but individually it would be difficult.

Nope, those are tint bins.

7A would be 3050K-3250K in tint. The power/flux bins varies from T4 to U4. That’s 6 different power bins.

1A would be 6500K-7000K in tint. The power/flux bins varies from U5 to V2. That’s 3 different power bins.

This would be perfectly relevant if we were using a regulated driver that controlled the amps, but we are not. We are using a FET driver. In this situation the Vf can have a big effect. Sometimes the warmer tints (with lower Vf) can actually pull higher amps and produce brighter output. Texas_Ace saw this with the XHP70.2 in the MT09R that he built up. The warmer tint he used outperformed the cooler tint due to the extra current draw. This is why I say it’s unpredictable. (Maybe this is not true for emitters other than XHP70.2? IDK)

The statistics say the 7A should be less output, but you won’t know until you try.

Already have Jason, dozens and dozens of times. I know, Ok? Within the Cree database listings there are only certain options available at a given time to given manufacturers. Remember how much of the time there have been delays because they couldn’t get the power and tint bins we asked for? Only certain combinations of power and tint are available for purchase, this causes issues a lot of the time. The FW3A has two options, at the moment. Because the other choices could not be bought. Does the FW3A now have XHP-70.2 emitters? Relevance, stick to the relevance.

And TA also claims the warm tint throws further but I have pictures that prove otherwise, in a light rain even. He asked friends their opinions based on a very short range, I took pictures at 1.9 miles. So as with all things, yes there are variables. But I have yet to see a triple XP-L with warm tint outperform a triple XP-L with cool tint. And I’ve built a LOT of em. Why do you think I quit accepting warm tints? Any light that comes to me now with a 4 or larger tint number that emitter is in my trash can within minutes of arrival. Literally without even turning it on. If you could see how many emitters I have on hand, how many I’ve removed and trashed, you’d understand.

I just love how the data-sheet people want to argue with the builders. Read all you want, then build em and learn what the data-sheets Didn’t tell you.

LOL HC, yeah yeah yeah. But like he says, variables can make it difficult to predict. I predict the warm white option FW3A will be at least 300 lumens less bright. :wink:

I was only after a rough indication anyway :slight_smile:

It’d be nice for someone with the 7A and a proper calibrated lumen tube to measure theirs in order to help me calibrate my own shoddy homemade lumen tube, but I fear the 7A will be a less popular choice maybe :slight_smile:

So your not contradicting anything I’ve said, good, I think we are in agreement.

I say the chances of the 7A being brighter are small. You say it is even smaller. Agreement. :smiley:

(Assuming same battery is used) Obviously you can make a 7A brighter than a 1A by using different batteries.

FET driven lights make terrible calibration lights because there are too many variables involved.

Jason, he only asked that someone with a properly calibrated light tube take a reading on the 7A FW3A in comparison to the 1A FW3A so he can make a wise purchase decision. :wink: