Interest collect for a new Sofirn design: tube style18650, magnetic ring control, USB-C charging, 500 lm max (AKA grandma light)

Interested for 2.

Thank you!

I’d be in for one or two.

Interest in one.

Thanks!

Interested in two.

BLF and TLF combined: 344 flashlights sofar.

Maybe drop the “grandma” in the title.
“user friendly” “ergonomic” “easy to operate” sounds more attractive.
(just a thought)

Already considered that but it still is appropriate and a reference to the past discussion of how this light evolved. In the original post the goal of this flashlight is very well explained so people should not get a wrong impression.

AAMOF, my grandma was very attractive in her days :heart_eyes:

My mom is 77 years old.

She's a great-grandma.

And she can handle normal 1x18650 flashlights just fine.

So not all grandmas need a "grandma" flashlight.

In for 1.

I will take one

Great idea, we need more control ring style lights. Not only for ease of use but they are cool too.

Djozz,
Wonderful concept.
Many have contributed very good ideas.
As someone who younger members would place in the grandpa category already. I’m someone who had to deal with parents who passed away at 89 and 102. While they were in a senior care home I met many of their fellows.
I also have many senior clients that I support computer wise. Never underestimate the gray hair network for passing along something that works for them.

Let me put my 2 cents in. Well actually more like $10 worth.
(I ramble– therefore I am)

First who is grandma?
Most who are reaching Gramps age now have been exposed to technology for many years. So dealing with a lightning plug for an iPhone is normal.
But as we age trying to get a Mico-USB plug in a poorly designed jack is not the easiest thing in the world. Still the concept that a device needs to be charged is an everyday thing for many.
A USB-C plug is significantly harder to work than a Lightning plug if the jack and plug are poorly done.

Then there are the current seniors that many here would consider in the Great-Gramps range. Say 75 plus years. Many of these folks have not been part of the Facebook revolution.
A cell phone may, or may not, be part of their daily activity, but other technology may not.

Physical infirmities will play a larger role as we age. I have 65 year old clients using walkers that can’t deal with anything that requires any hand strength.
I also had a client that played tennis every day and his kids/grand kids took him helicopter skiing in the Alps for his 90th birthday (and he could walk my ass into the ground). Texting was second nature. If Windows did anything unexpected, he needed to call me.

A light, for most of the world, is never going to be a a thing of beauty and a joy forever (well until the next one comes out).
There are many non-seniors who have no desire for something that is more complex than an on-off light.

You can often teach an old dog new tricks. But the trick needs repetition to make a memory. Using a smart phone, electric razor, TV remote, or computer - happens every day.
Fussing with the flashlight – what – twice a year – Maybe?
If the operation is not obvious – it’s not going to happen.

The cost needs to be kept low (as djozz intends) as the light is likely to get lost. Toward the end my mom would misplace her teeth. But she could still use an old fashioned slide switch flashlight. The concept that a flashlight needed to be plugged into a cord would have befuddled her.

I aim my opinions toward the elders of the clan who have missed the technological revolution and infirmities are starting to take a tole.
Or toward those who think of a flashlight in the same terms as a pencil. It should work when then need it and just sit there ready to use when it’s not.

The Muggle light
As djozz described. No moonlight mode, simple switch, 500Ln max, easy recharge.
21700 S2+ with a charging port and lighted when on switch?

Now let me ramble about features and possible additions.
Perhaps I’m thinking of 2 different lights. The grandma light that replaces the 2 D cell light with the leaking batteries in the kitchen drawer.
The second is something for the bedside of anyone who might need a light that has features I’ve not seen yet. It will cost more to create such a beast.

As I said there are seniors and there are seniors.
The smell of burnt popcorn in the halls of the senior center is a common occurrence.
Why? Because 30 minutes on high is just a little too long for microwave popcorn.
A dead simple UI in required.

NO BLINKIES! – Not ever never!
Unexpected flashing could easily lead to falls and confusion.

The UI. Dead simple – but …
I wonder if anyone has considered a sleep after no activity and shake to wake option?

As in: I need a light. I pick it up off the charger (with a nightlight built into the charger) and it turns on to low. I put it back on the charger and it dims fairly quickly to night light status.

Not sure about the timeout/shake implementation. It it adds much cost, it’s not worth it.
Maybe this is something that the flashaholic could set up as an option that would be intentionally hard to change.

Stick to your guns on a 10 lumen minimum (or even 50). I guarantee that it will be left on if the brightness is too low to be seen clearly in daylight. Old eyes need more light.
My dad held off cataract surgery for way too long. He needed lots of light to do typical activities. When he finally got the operation he was astounded how bright and colorful the world became.

The max lumens need not be all that much (as you have planned).
But it must be sustainable WITHOUT the head getting hot enough to burn the hand or start a fire if stuffed under clothes or paper.
Old hands may not feel the heat until after damage has been done.
The same goes for switches that need to be found by feel. The posters who suggest leather gloves are not wrong.

For old hands a positive click to off – low-med-high is desirable (even on and off would do). But it must not take a great deal of force.
Variable? The more adept oldsters might make use of it.
For most, it will simply be cranked to high or off.
Most won’t see the need for anything other than full bright.

Beam?
A TIR with a smooth wide-ish hot-spot or the equivalent reflector – thinks I.
A spot beam with a sharp cutoff is going to make seeing things off the hot spot hard to see for old eyes.
Lots of wide bright spill is needed.
Not tripping over a lamp cord at my feet is more important than lighting the back 40.
I think a good warmish high CRI will help identify objects that are normally seen under incandescent room or sunlight.

Anyone spry enough to be out checking the chicken coop for coyotes at 2am will be capable of using something with lots of throw and lumens (and the old 30’30).

There should be some sort of indicator when the light is on that can be seen from the side of the light.
A lighted ring that doubles as a charge indicator/night light would be nicer than a single LED.
This should stay on whenever the light is turned on and visible in daylight. Go off when the light is off. (or switch to night light mode).
But go with what fits the budget.

The bezel should clearly show that the light is on when placed face down on a table. Make it smooth.

Nothing on the light should be sharp enough to cut frail skin.
A brush against a rough textured wall would open my dad up like a can of tomatoes.
Un-rounded edges should not be there.

Cradle charging!
The light is either going to live in a drawer or in the charger it’s entire life.
If you have to use a plug. It’s got to be one that can be inserted without regard to position.
Hell, I have a hard time seeing which polarity micro-USB cables are.

Whoever thought black logos on black plugs was a good idea. Why not make them a distinctive shape in the first place (sorry got off topic there).

Plugs vs Cradle
I have had at least 5 desktop computers in my shop that people have managed to plug in the full sized USB–A connector in upside down. Not seniors – just kids or regular folk not paying attention. If it won’t go – just wiggle and Push! POP magic smoke gets out.

I’ve repaired numerous laptops that regular users have buggered up the charging port by not plugging in the power adapter correctly or jerking it out.

I guarantee if a charging cable is used - the cable is going to get jerked and bent while in the flashlight.

With the light in a magnetic cradle, that’s not going to happen.

Make sure the charging is correctly implemented.
Like I said the light is likely to live there – forever.
Make the cut off 4V (or whatever wiser heads than mine recommend).
Longevity and battery safety is the key here. Squeezing the last ounce of power out of a battery is not.

Make the low voltage cutout very noticeable. Have the light dim to a usable but noticeably lower level.
With some other signal like the red blinking on the switch or power indicator and make it a bright and easily noticeable during the day.
Pick a cutoff voltage that is consistent with long battery life.
It might be years before the light is used till the battery cries uncle.

Make the parasitic drain none or extremely low when not charging. It’s going to live in the drawer for months and months if not in the charger.

For a fancy version -
It makes sense to be that there be a lit LED on the flashlight when in the charging cradle.
And an LED on he cradle itself - that is always on - but not so bright as to be intrusive in a dark room.

(Getting too expensive with all this thinking – thinks I?)

For all that’s good and holy, don’t make the thing black.
A bright yellow/red/silver/?? body with a contrasting mag-ring or switch seems like a no-brainer.
Black light, black switch, dosn’t look like a 60s era light, in a dark drawer, on a dark night?
One that hasn’t been seen or handled since thanksgiving 2017… Yeah, that’s going to happen.

If the charging port is behind a threaded cap it will never be found. Unless the action to open the port is clearly etched into the light.
Even then it might not be recognizable to some who are not expecting a hidden charge port.
If it’s cable charged make the port cover a different color than the light and the switch and mark with with something other than an icon.
The words “Charging Port” come to mind.

As others have said the switch needs to be a different color from the body. The operation of the switch needs to be clearly etched into the switch or body so that old eyes can tell which way to move it to make the thing turn on.

A good anti-roll feature is a requirement. A trip to the floor or under the table is out of the question for some.

Buzzers or beeps as part of the user interface? Hell I can’t hear some of them. Many seniors won’t either.

The link about diameter and ergonomics is all too true.
Make it too short for the hand or too small in diameter, and it’s going to get dropped.
A wrist loop might actually be of use!

I like the idea of a 21700 for the extra capacity and diameter.
If it’s too head heavy I think it’s likely to be dropped when shifted about in the hand.
The body needs some sort of texture. Nothing too abrasive remember frail skin.

Should it appeal to flashaholics?
Depends on the flashaholic. Something dead simple and confusion proof (and safe) as possible is important to me to give to the muggles in my life - who may have no ability, or no desire, to learn anything new.

It also has to look like a vaguely like a flashlight!
Seems condescending, but if mental impairment is part of the game it had better look like a flashlight.

My mom could eat with normal metal utensils in the dining room. When with too many new inputs like plastics utensils and a picnic lunch out doors. It didn’t compute. She couldn’t figure out which end of the knife and fork to hold (literally).
She could still use the 2 D cell flashlight in her room. But couldn’t figure out what a min-Mag was.
In cases like this enloops in adaptors in something familiar is the only hope.

IPX rating?
It needs to be drop proof. Mildly waterproof for seniors. They are indoors mostly.
Better waterproofing for younger muggles who will use it outdoors.

There – I ranted enough and they tell me I need to take a pill or something or the men in the white coats will be coming again.

Keep this going.
All the Best,’
Jeff

I’m in for at least one depending on how the design ends up.

I’m interested in one as well.

I’m really liking the look of this flashlight. However, I would like to input that although I like the mode spacing, though I think that 10/50/250 lumens would be a much better mode spacing. Due to how we perceive light, the differences between 400 lumens and 250 lumens ia negligible while the run time and thermal improvements from dropping high output below 1A would probably work more towards the intended audience. A BUCK driver would also be preferable for improved efficiency and regulation meaning the end user wouldn’t have to worry about charging it as frequently. Either way, put me down for 1 for now.

Speaking tangentially about illuminated canes for walking, well, of course they’re out there. Google finds several.

Here’s a flashlight sized to clip to a cane; removable; made of glow-in-the-dark material too.

And here’s a whole illuminated cane.

Apology for the digression.

Hi Jeff, thanks for your valuable contribution. You have many suggestions that I think are generally useful, some are usefull for seniors but also do not ruin the design for others, and some that I think are useful for the 75+ segment but would make the light less attractive for other people, since this is not strictly a light for seniors. And then there is cradle-charging that apart from making the charging less universal may just be too expensive

What I will ad to the wish-list:

*smooth bezel but with a few small cutouts that let light to the side when bezel-standing.
*a quality USB-C socket that allows some abuse. At least USB-C can not be connected the wrong way around.
*up for discussion but I like the idea: charging up to 4.1V instead of 4.2V to preserve battery life
*although I think black will be most popular, clear ano or other very visible colours should be an option. Already on the wishlist is the control ring in a contrasting colour.
*if it can be done attractively, a contrasting colour if the USB-port gets a cover.

What I doubt will happen, although I understand the reasons for easy handling and runtime: 21700 size. First because the many who are already on the interest list will not expect that change, but also because it will largely kill the possibility to pocket-carry the light, which I expect many will do once it is there (especially if a 18350 tube will happen).

I added you to the list in the hope that the design will end up to your liking :slight_smile:

Although I agree that 250 lumen is plenty for most, and that it will add to heat safety and runtime, I think that less lights will sell to us flashoholics if the max is “just” 250 lumen. The 500 was chosen as a fairly safe maximum output that will still appeal to flashoholics.

@hank, I totally missed the cane illumination subject sofar but please digress :slight_smile:

djozz,
Keep after this. It’s something that needs doing.
It should be available through Amazon.
There are lots of potential users that would skip the light if the only way to get one is PayPal and China direct.
All the Best,
Jeff

Do you really think so? It only adds 5mm in length and 3mm in width and consequently a couple of grams.

I wonder if it makes enough difference for it to be beyond pocket carry-able. Maybe due to the weight increase, though.
But then again, come to think of it, i haven’t got a 21700 light yet… :person_facepalming:
Good excuse to get one ! :slight_smile:

I wonder if it will be as cute in a short version as short headed triple and quad lights.
But there are apparently 20350 batteries out there already (iJoy).

To me it doesn’t matter too much if it’s 18650 or 21700.
But, the difference between 3500 and 5000 mAh is considerable.
5000 is 42% more than 3500.

I’m mainly looking forward to the “volume knob” dimming of this light.
That would be awesome.
It’ll probably be the biggest challenge to get it to work properly, evenly and logarithmically.
With a short movement slider you can suffice with 1 single Hall sensor, but if you want to spread the dimming over a (let’s say, at least) 120° rotation, you’ll probably need 2 or 3 Hall sensors and some clever electronics and / or firmware to translate that to intuitively expected brightness levels, on a logarithmic scale.

In fact, i think it would be wise if someone already started experimenting with this.

>cane illumination

I’m thinking of attention-getting lighting for use in pedestrian crosswalks where I now find strobe most useful.

But that illuminated cane I found uses those pathetic little 12v cells, not a robust rechargeable battery.

Including as an option something like the clips that attach flashlights to bicycle handlebars would be helpful to people using walkers or canes who would otherwise have their hands full carrying anything besides the flashlight.

Here’s a motion sensor light that attaches to a cane or walker:
https://www.amazon.com/Path-Light-Attachment-Automatic-Mobility/dp/B071ZHNH54/ref=sr_1_27?keywords=lighted+walking+stick&qid=1578864833&sr=8-27

Reading the reviews, that has a lot of useful features. Turns on when moved, turns off after brief timeout when not moving, turns the light off when entering an illuminated area like indoors or under streetlights. 3xAAA, the usual blue-white. $20.

Moddable? I think I have to find out.