Flashlight User Interface Cheatsheets

Hi all,

Although I'm a long-time flashaholic (with a special interest in tiny lights, AAA and 10180), I'm new to all these great UI. I've just found out that thanks to a few voluntary developers (thumbs up and thanks to them) and the BLF community, it is possible to find not-so-expensive flashlights whose UI is far more versatile than those of the "high-end" manufacturers.

At the same time I must confess I'm a bit puzzled, although CRX's post is extremely useful. Hence a few questions:

Are these UI compatible with forward clicky switches?

  • Can they be used with two-button flashlights (e.g. tail switch + side switch), and corollary question: are there any double-switch flashlight who carry one of these programmable UI?
  • Once you have bought a flashlight with such an UI, is it possible to upgrade the UI if it is modified in the future? For example, I see that the Anduril UI doesn't allow to activate Strobe when the light is ON, only from OFF. If this became possible some day (which I would appreciate), will I be able to modify my UI so that it has this new possibility?
  • How do these UI relate to the "Biscotti" firmware, which I have seen mentioned several times in flashlight descriptions?

Thanks in advance for your help.

I'll give it a try:

Can they be used with two-button flashlights (e.g. tail switch + side switch)

--> Anduril has pretty nice support for it. Works well with a fwd clicky power switch. Comes ON at the last used level. The fwd clicky acts as a momentary mode - as long as you hold the button in, it's ON, let go and it's OFF. Can be used for signaling, etc.

Are there any double-switch flashlight who carry one of these programmable UI?

--> Not sure. I got a modded Nitenumen TK-35 running Anduril2 with the feature supporting the power switch enabled. I have several other modded lights with the 2 switches but all are running Narsil or Anduril without the support - they work fine. Power switch has to be ON, then use the side switch to turn the LED ON.

Once you have bought a flashlight with such an UI, is it possible to upgrade the UI if it is modified in the future? For example, I see that the Anduril UI doesn't allow to activate Strobe when the light is ON, only from OFF. If this became possible some day (which I would appreciate), will I be able to modify my UI so that it has this new possibility?

--> Yes and No. The UI's that are open source, yes you can download the latest but you have to know what driver and what features you have - basically the right software for the right hardware. Some of the lights now have external contacts on the backside of the driver to allow pogo pin programmers. On other lights, you may have to remove the driver and use a special clip/USB dongle. Sometimes a driver can pop out or be accessible with normal tools, but others you may have to de-solder wires to get the driver out, then re-solder to re-assemble.

How do these UI relate to the "Biscotti" firmware, which I have seen mentioned several times in flashlight descriptions?

--> Biscotti is one of those listed above in the first post. Not sure what you are asking. ToyKeeper wrote most of these, including Biscotti.

Subbed

Thanks Tom E for the explanation.

To be more precise about my search: I'd like to find a flashlight that would be both tactical (using the tail switch) and EDC (using a side switch). I've just bought an Olight M2R which almost fills the bill, but I will return it because:

  1. The tail switch is slightly recessed and somewhat hard to press with the thumb, therefore difficult to keep it halfway between "too hard = Strobe" (which I may want to use but not always), and "not pressed enough" which causes the light to flicker.
  2. The UI doesn't satisfy me: when ON in EDC mode, you can access Turbo and Strobe through the tail switch, but releasing it will cause the light to turn OFF instead of returning to the last EDC mode. Other users have complained about this in various reviews.

So I'm hoping to find a similar flashlight with a more usable tail switch, and a more customizable UI.

Battery should be 18650 (it will be my first light with such a battery), form factor cylindrical (no big head), size about 1" x 5".

Since I understand that there may be very little options with two switches, a one-switch light (preferably forward tail-switch) might do, as long as the UI allows:

  • Instant access to moonlight for night bathroom trips
  • Other EDC modes without memory (I don't like to be blinded by High when I only want Low)
  • Easy access to Turbo and Strobe against an intruder, be the light ON or OFF.

Sorry, I had overlooked this UI in this long post.

Your search will never end. Better to just get multiple lights with each one serving it’s own unique purpose. :wink:

Interesting feature, do you have examples of such flashlights?

Another question: when you buy a light with a certain UI (say Anduril), can you later modify it to another UI or do you have to stay with Anduril (and its future upgrades)?

Many of Hank's lights do have the pogo pin interface and he sells the programming adapter:

D4S2: https://intl-outdoor.com/emisar-d4sv2.html

Reflashing kit: https://intl-outdoor.com/components-6/gears/reflashing-kits.html

I believe a few of the new Astrolux lights have it to, but there's a different pin configuration. Here's a pic I took of the FT03 Mini showing the pins in the upper left:

Again, you have to match the software to hardware, but yes - you can buy a light with Anduril and change it to something else. The good thing is Narsil and Anduril were designed for the ATTiny85 MCU so they are usually compatible. I say "usual" because depends on the hardware. Anduril also supports more MCU's than Narsil does.

More info on programming/reflashing keys/adapters here: https://budgetlightforum.com/t/-/72815

Thanks Tom for the additional info.

For my first 18650 light, I might well choose either the Convoy S2+, or the Astrolux S1 = BLF A6, both highly praised by many BLF members as far as I can read.

But I am puzzled by the many offers available on the Chinese sellers websites, with different LED tints (that's OK, I know I prefer neutral or warm, preferably high CRI), different drivers*, different UIs. Not sure they have the Anduril or Narsil UI, this is not always clear from the descriptions.

*BTW, I understand 7135*n means more or less current (the higher n, the higher the current). But how does this translate into lumens? Also, will the n value affect all modes, i.e. is the moonlight mode twice as dim on a 7135*4 WRT a 7135*8?

Another newbie question, sorry: what is FET and what does it mean in terms of flashlight behavior?

Thanks, but to be honest this is all Greek to me

The different numbers of 7135 chips will affect the brightness in each mode. The S2+ gets very hot within a few minutes on 100% with 7135x8, but will generally just get warm at 35-50. If you want to run the light continuously on 100 maybe go for the 7135*4 version. The lumens per current will depend on the LED you are using (and battery V), as some emitters are more/less efficient than others, though visually you probably won’t notice. The Biscotti UI is easy to use and configure, and more preferable over the older 3/5 mode UI which had annoying mode memory timer. You can’t go wrong with the S2+ as your first 18650 light.

Thanks Stephenk for the clarification about the 7135*n, and your feedback on the S2+.

Re. the UI, after taking a deeper look at the first post of this thread, I realize that the UI which would best answer my requirements, is the Anduril Aux (i.e. latest version?), thanks to the manual memory: a fantastic addition as it allows instant access from OFF to #1 Floor, #2 your favorite brightness of choice, #3 Ceiling and #4 Strobe.

I've read advice on BLF to buy the Convoy S2+ directly from (its creator?) Simon @Aliex, who can customize the lights upon request when ordering. Do you think he could and might agree to change the UI from Biscotti to Anduril Aux?

There is no “Anduril aux” and it will only work with an e-switch light, so not with the S2+.

The caption of the second graph in the first post is: "Anduril UI Aux", so this is what I was referring to.

Thanks for the information.

Do other UIs require an e-switch, i.e. do not work with a mechanical one?

"Anduril UI Aux" probably means Anduril with AUX LED support. AUX LED's are simple surface mount LED's of various colors. Anduril has special support for like 4 different channels of output for AUX LED's, so you can do fancy things with them, using 4 different colors for example, and having then ON or blinking, simple control over 2 output levels, etc.

Flashlight firmware is mostly designed for one or the other: for a power switch or electronic switch (e-switch).

Power switch versions are called "clicky firmware", as noted in the OP.

FET: abbreviation for MOSFET, and in our terms, a FET is generally used for maximum amps/output - no limit, just what the battery(s) can provide and the LED(s) can draw. The 7135 devices limit amps to 0.35 amps each, so 8 x 7135's would produce 2.8 amps at most.

The more sophisticated UI’s like Narsil and Anduril require an e-switch (electronic contact switch). Meaning that the driver always has power and the switch is simply sending a signal to the driver and it can read how long you’re holding the button down.

Mechanical switch lights in the tail actually control battery power. When you activate the switch you are cutting off all power to the driver. Thanks to capacitors, it can tell the difference between a short cut in power and a longer cut in power. This requires a very different designed UI.

The software has to be designed to work with a specific driver. You can’t just mix and match different software to different Hardware.

If you want a compact 18650 light with Anduril then your best best is the Noctigon K4. However a Convoy S2+ is about a quarter of the price if you are happy with the last mode memory of Biscotti.

Thanks, I think I'll choose this one, for want of any guarantee to have the "manual memory" feature if I order a FW3A, and despite the higher price tag and weight.

Hello, do we know when someone make diagram for Anduril 2? I saw for Simple UI but not for advanced.

amazing!

Hello everyone, I need help.

I have a Thorfire Q8 narsil.
I accidentally changed the setting and now the flash is blocked. I’ve been trying for several days (01/01/2021) to program the flashlight but I still haven’t been able to.

I looked at many manuals and diagrams but I can’t understand.

It needs to be step by step like this:

1) with flashlight off
2) 3 clicks to put in battery mode
3) hold button for 8 seconds (until flashing) for configuration mode
4) ???
5) ???

I do not know what else to do….

Help me!

there are 46 days I can’t go beyond that point …

First, let me see if I understand you correctly (by the way, I suggest to create a new message thread for further questions) — by ‘flash is blocked’, my understanding is that it does not do Strobe modes after Turbo mode.

I’m assuming that your BLF Q8 is running NarsilM (v1.0 or v1.2), and not Anduril (because there are some variants of the Thorfire BLF Q8 that do).
To go to Strobe mode: go to Turbo mode first (eg. via double-click), then do another quick double-click. If Strobe does not happen, it means Strobe setting is disabled.

To enable Strobe mode:

  1. From Off, hold the button down for about 8 seconds (in some later NarsilM version, this has increased to 16 seconds). Continue holding down the button, until you see a double-flash, followed by a single blink. You can release the button if you see this happen.

I suggest to observe first:
From OFF: hold button down until main LED does a double-flash, followed by a single-blink, then a short pause.
Then another double-flash, followed by 2 blinks.
then another double-flash, followed by 3 blinks.
then another double-flash, followed by 4 blinks.

Check if the above pattern happens, it should exit (no change in configuration) if no presses were done.

To enable Strobes mode, do the above again:
From Off, hold button down around 8 or 16 seconds until the double-flash + 1 blink. Wait until it does double-flash + 4 blinks, and quickly do a triple-click right after the 4-blinks. This will enable Strobe mode.

Test if it has been enabled: go to Turbo mode, then do a double-click (should become Strobe mode).

The method to go to the next Strobe mode varies slightly depending on the which NarsilM version.
On NarsilM v1.2 and v1.3: while the light is in Strobe mode, hold down the button (I think 1-2 seconds), will cycle to the next Strobe mode.
On NarsilM v1.0: (kindly refer to the manual or Youtube videos, it’s a bit more difficult to cycle Strobe with NarsilM v1.0), which is actually one of the main changes between v1.0 and v1.2
(I believe the change of v1.2 and v1.3 is that v1.3 made configuration mode a bit harder to access accidentally (hold button for 16 seconds instead of 8 seconds)