Just got a 2006 Ford Escape for $200, Trying to make it a daily driver for cheap

Thats a pretty good idea, yeah it could rotate 180 degree I think, Can’t hurt anything that is for sure.

I agree that the MAF fits the symptoms, I even suspected it when I first got the truck, which I have now cleaned it 3 times lol.

It also explains the worse then expected MPG I have been getting and the fact it runs much better in open loop.

Just doesn’t seem like it being off this much would have such massive effects.

The map sensor checks out since it has readings I can compare and they are well within reason.

They accepted my offer for $15, so just got to wait for it to show up to see if that improves things. Scared to put too much more money then this into it unless I know it is the issue.

In the mean time I get to start pulling apart the 4runner to see what all it needs, suspension work is not my favorite, I hate those spring compressors lol.

Brakes sometimes get locked after sitting from moisture in the brake lines. Had a Kawasaki GPZ 550 that sat under cover under a outdoor roof and the both discs were locked. After soaking the bleeders for a couple days was able to release pressure and they became free. Also had a 1969 Ford Torino fastback do the same thing after sitting 7 months.
Hopefully this is all it is for you as well.

Really was hoping you got those gremlins out of the Ford, but she isn’t ready to give up the ghost yet :slight_smile:
You’ll get it, stay after it as there is nothing more satisfying than fixing a vehicle yourself and being able to drive it every month with no freaking car payment and cheap insurance to boot.
Owned 2 new cars, never need to own another one.

Later,

Keith

I had considered something simple like that except that it happened right after my truck decided it could fly. As I was driving home I could feel something was not right but took me driving it a few more times checking everything over and over again to finally notice my brake drum was glowing lol

Guessing the impact is the reason it happened, just not sure why or what is causing it. Best guess right now is the e-brake cable is messed up but have not gotten under there to really figure it out.

Yeah, I really want to get the Ford fixed as well, it still has a lot of life in it, only issue that even bothers me is having to add oil every tank of gas. Works out to like $50 in oil a year but rather that then doing the main seal! lol. Otherwise it has been a really nice car, particularly since I don’t care if something happens to it.

The hood flew up a few months back due to the damaged catch and I forgot to click it down good enough (I have since lined it up better to keep it from happening again). I just beat the dents out with a hammer and closed it back up and don’t care lol. That would of crushed me on any other car.

I have never had a car payment, I saw the stress it put on people and just never understood it. Get a car a few years old and you get a great car for a lot less money. Heck I generally had people wishing they were driving my cars. :wink:

The most I ever paid for one was $10k IIRC, I always got the fixer uppers that I could sell for a profit after I had my fun.

The Ford is the only car I drove home, I had to tow all the others home IIRC. It is also the cheapest car I ever got but not by much.

I got a MINT 300ZX for $300 once, only catch was the engine was BLOWN, I mean like the engine block was split in half blown and utter carnage inside. Had to hop in my 4runner and rent a trailer at a super sketchy gas station just before closing at 10pm and then didn’t get to the car until 1am all to beat the people that lined up to pick it up the next morning lol. Well worth it though, best deal I ever got on a car. One of the only cars I miss.

I got a 280ZX for about that much once!

It was an ’83, the last year before the 300ZX. It was a 2+2, non-turbo, with white paint in good condition and a red velour interior that looked like new. It had one shattered t-top, a bad exhaust leak, and the trans slipped when shifting from first to second. I fixed the exhaust leak and managed to find a pair of replacement t-tops. I even sold the extra one and got mine for free.

One day, I was startled by the ‘talking lady’ telling me, “Left door is open.”

Instead of a simple chime, she tells you if you’ve left the lights on, if a door is open, if the parking brake is on while the car is moving, and if you’re low on fuel. She’s not digital, she’s a miniature record player!

It was a second car, and I only kept it for a summer, but it sure was a neat little car, even with the slipping trans. It’s on the growing list of cars I’d like to have again someday.

nice, yeah mine had the talking lady but it was a bit more advanced by then and played through the speakers. Also had the digital dash (after I replaced the ECU for it) and was one of the most comfortable cars for that era I have ever driven. A real cruiser.

I ended up swapping a xterra engine into it to get the extra displacement and compression along with a really nice clutch rated for 500whp but drove like stock. It was pretty peppy even on the stock turbo and stock boost. Drag times put it around ~250-275rwhp IIRC, guessing an easy 325-375rwhp with the boost turned up a bit.

I turned the boost up once but I already had offers for the car and didn’t want to risk blowing it up.

Total I had around $1500 in it when it was finished. I had considered keeping it and adding meth injection and turning the boost up but ended up selling it for $6k to a guy in Chicago when I found another RX7 I wanted lol.

Ok, just got the MAF sensor in and installed it. It does read better then the old one, around 3.2g/sec vs 5.2 at idle and it seems to help a little it was not the issue. It stil has zero power and refuses to rev above 4k.

A clogged cat is a possible issue I suppose given the issues but the exhaust is all rusted and not sure I can even check it without breaking every bolt and without a welder I have no way to put things back together if that happens.

Guess I will start soaking the bolts in penetrating oil and give it a try at some point as I can’t think of anything else to try beside throwing parts at it and it is not worth that.

Feel like running it reeeeeeeally rich ’til the cat starts glowing cherry-red? :laughing:

I am open to anything at this point, much more and I will be forced to give up on it and put my time and money into getting the 4runner back on the road.

How can you adjust the tune on the ford? If I could do that I should be able to track down the issue via trial and error.

I am spoiled by standalone / piggyback ECU’s where I would simply datalog and adjust the tune to figure out the issue fairly easily.

I was getting a strange issue earlier where when free revving it at around 30% throttle it would hit 3k RPM and then start stumbling and basically refuse to rev past it for 30-90 seconds until it finally got above 3k, then it would do it’s thing up to 4k.

It was repeatable and very odd, if I went WOT it would not do it, only at part throttle.

While stumbling I watched all the sensors I could and could not find anything unexpected, really annoying.

Unno, a lot of it still sounds like an ignition problem, the dreaded “weak spark”. Might idle fine, get to some low-stress rpms, but under any load the mix just “blows out the spark”.

My old Cav had a plugged cat. Loss of power that just got progressively worse ’til it could only go a quarter-mile or so ’til it stalled. Like a banana up the tailpipe. Letting it sit a while, it’d “deflate” and let me go another quarter-mile, maybe more if I was able to just putz along with a barely-cracked throttle. Fun fun fun on the 495…

Still loved that car. Ran lean’n’clean, and for years before that with a hollow cat, and still passed smog ’til NYS literally halved max emissions one year.

But yeah, that cat rang like a bell if you’d hit it. Much much much better when hollow, than when the working replacement got plugged. :confounded:

Yeah, spark issue is still a possibility, I have not had time to go get new plugs but honestly I don’t have a lot of hope in that, the issue just started too suddenly for me to see that being the issue but anything is possible at this point.

I would gladly just gut the cat if I could get in there. On my 4runner I built a box that tricks the ECU into thinking the cat is still in place, it is fairly simple, just a few resistors and a diode to reduce the readings on the 2nd cat and thus make it looks like the cat is working. I would think it would work on the ford as well, just might have to play with the resistance some.

If you just want to coat the inside of the fenders with something that will both add a little strength and make sure nothing gets through any small holes, try using asphalt based evaporative cooler coating. I live in an area where “swamp coolers” although not a common as once was are still used. My local Lowes has it for $6 for a 20 oz can. The base for evaporative coolers is always wet and salty. When coated with this stuff the cooler will last for a couple years longer before the rust eats through. Just brush it on after you clean the area.
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Dial-Asphalt-Base-Coating-Evaporative-Cooler-Cover/3092447?cm_mmc=shp-*~~c~~*~~prd~~*~~plb~~*~~google~~*~~lia~~*~~171~~*~~evapcoolersaccessories~~*~~3092447~~\_–0&store_code=1719&placeholder=null&gclid=Cj0KCQjwzbv7BRDIARIsAM-A6-3UMtSlVDOmNuLBRRnQprXW1VeEujvrHAnrZE3VbhEfa5Ykk0NLgKcaAhkDEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
You can find it at Ace Hardware and Home Depot as well.

Interesting idea, if I end up getting it back on the road I will look into that.

A plugged cat would happen rather slowly, but a blocked muffler, if the baffles break off and block the hole, can happen suddenly, but you’d probably notice a change in the exhaust note.

Insulation in the coil or a coil wire could break/split and let the spark “leak” outside vs at the plug, or a loose connection could increase the resistance and limit the voltage, anything. Would be at something in common to all, vs just one plug or plug-wire.

Nowadays OBD sniffs both before and after the cat, and if the readings track too closely, it throws an error (supposta be a bit of lag, not instantly tracking).

Yeah, that is how my 4runner works as well. I forgot the exact layout of the box I put together but it had some resistors, a diode or 2 and possibly a cap/inductor. I built it over 10 years ago and have not touched it since lol.

It worked though, never threw a code and passes inspection every year.

People gave me a hard time back when I built it as well saying it would not work, 10+ years later it is still working lol.

Watching the O2 signals it delayed the response and reduced the readings slightly.

The real issue on the ford would be the temp sensor would have to be tricked as well or it would not read high enough.

Yeh, before the cat bounces up’n’down fairly quickly as the fuel-trim is adjusted, but after the cat has all kinds of lag which “smooths” the output. RC network would work well. :laughing:

Well that’s a significant difference in readings, but a plugged exhaust that’s getting worse would also reduce your readings. Did you recheck the old MAF readings the same day as the new one?

Two diagnostics is recommend are 1: a vacuum gauge test and 2: watching the run engine in the dark.

The vacuum test should help point out the potential exhaust back pressure issue. If you could rent a back pressure gauge and tap into the o2 sensor that would be ideal…

The reason for viewing the engine in the dark is for watching for ignition system shorts. I’ve caught bad plug wires arcing this way before. Free and easy…

Don’t let this thing best you! Lol

About the engine in the dark, yeah check both when cold and when good and hot.
Had a 1970 Ford panel van with 6cyl. and it got down on power where you had to slam it into 2nd gear (3 on the Tree) to make medium steep grade hills.
Pulled the dog house one night and all the wires were glowing and arcing.
Next day replaced wires and ran like new engine, had to lower idle down even. Taught me to test for that on all cars since. Also have had a bad ignition wire when new, it does happen, so when people say well the wires are new OK but are they performing correctly.

Don’t think that is the problem here as his truck seems to go bad like someone is throwing a switch.
Where I live there are cheap Pull Your Own junkyards and I would be tempted to just go get the main computer if it is cheap enough and see what gives.
Had one take a crap on a Jeep, had lots of random electrical gremlins, replaced it and wala:)

Later

Sadly with a coil on plug setup you would not be able to see any of the high voltage ignition areas so that test would not help much I am afraid.

Indeed, it will run normally sometimes and then run bad again a second later like throwing a switch, which is why I am basically positive it is an electronics issue but nothing shows up on the OBD scanner.

The ECU is something I have considered a few times but the cheapest I have found one is $50+, that is a lot to waste on a longshot like that, particularly on a car only worth maybe $500 in it’s current condition.

Vacuum seems normal according to the OBD, it reads in absolute but gets down around ~3-4psi at idle which sounds about right.

I would recommend checking the vacuum with a manual/analog gauge, as the refresh rate often hides the more subtle behaviors.

I was going to suggest the same thing as Muto with going to a U-Pull-It for some random sensors etc…

Crank and cam pos sensors primarily.

BTW, does your OBD readout have a knock count? This is an issue that should surely trigger a DTC, but I am curious if it somehow its detecting knock and pulling timing/richening A:F

It did have a knock readout of some kind but it never triggered even when I could hear it pinging. I tested the knock sensor when the intake was off and it seems to be good, so this is another reason I suspect something deeper then a basic sensor error. That or the knock detection sucks on these ECU’s.

In my 4runner the knock detection is really good, you can get away with an amazing amount of abuse because of it lol.

I might toss a mechanical vacuum gauge on it and see what it reads, although so far everything has checked out as matching the OBD readout so loosing hope.

Going to try putting in my old spark plugs / coils today (have not been able to bum a ride to the parts store) to see if it shows any improvements, the plugs worked fine when I replaced them.

After this, sadly going to have to put it out to pasture for the time being so I can work on the 4runner, I am out of ideas for the Ford outside of the ECU itself.