[Interest list] High CRI + RED 660nm dual led headlamp D25WR

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Barry0892
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[Interest list] High CRI + RED 660nm dual led headlamp D25WR

[UPDATE] D25S is available to send from warehouse in CA, USA. D25S headlamp ships from USA warehouse

 

Hi guys,

 

Since many fans love D25S headlamp, and ask for SST20DR 660nm RED lights, here we are.

 

I asked the factory to make a prototype of this New D25 headlamp with SST20 White+SST20DR 660nm

 

If you are interested in it, please reply.

 

Simple UI:

While off, click to turn on for White led, press and hold to choose brightness Moonlight-Low-Medium-High. Click to turn off.

While off, press and hold to turn on Red led, press and hold to choose brightness: Moonlight-Low-Medium-High, click to turn off.

 

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Edited by: Barry0892 on 03/26/2021 - 04:28
Mureo
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Interested. Please include neutral or warm high cri main light.

Lux-Perpetua
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Very nice.  Thumbs Up I agree with Mureo that e.g. SST20 4.000K 95CRI would be a good option for the white LED.

Funtastic
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I hope you also changed the driver to allow the SST20DR to run efficiently or it’ll burn through the battery to reduce the voltage.

SST20DR – 2.05v to 2.6v forward voltage
SST20 – 2.5 to 3.1v

I feel the SST20 will be too narrow to be useful as a headlamp. Generally a smooth diffused beam is what’s needed. The SST40 in NW with an OP reflector or a diffuser would be better.

SST20 6500K = max 700 lumens
SST20 4000K = max 500 lumens

How long will turbo last? If turbo drops to half that above output, it won’t be ideal.

Lumens are usually the selling point and it’ll be more attractive for the average consumer to use an SST40.

EDIT:

We need to think about this for a second.

The D25S with two 6500K SST40’s was producing 1100-1200 lumens, that’s approx 550 per led, using an SST20 in that host with the same driver could be half the above output already. Not sure it would be usable. Then again, since the current is only going to one led it could be the full output.

Anyone know the current on Turbo?

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firstcipher
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Interested

SilentObserver
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Interested

Barry0892
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Funtastic wrote:
I hope you also changed the driver to allow the SST20DR to run efficiently or it’ll burn through the battery to reduce the voltage.

SST20DR – 2.05v to 2.6v forward voltage
SST20 – 2.5 to 3.1v

I feel the SST20 will be too narrow to be useful as a headlamp. Generally a smooth diffused beam is what’s needed. The SST40 in NW with an OP reflector or a diffuser would be better.

SST20 6500K = max 700 lumens
SST20 4000K = max 500 lumens

How long will turbo last? If turbo drops to half that above output, it won’t be ideal.

Lumens are usually the selling point and it’ll be more attractive for the average consumer to use an SST40.

EDIT:

We need to think about this for a second.

The D25S with two 6500K SST40’s was producing 1100-1200 lumens, that’s approx 550 per led, using an SST20 in that host with the same driver could be half the above output already. Not sure it would be usable. Then again, since the current is only going to one led it could be the full output.

Anyone know the current on Turbo?

The driver is redeigned which means SST20 white and SST20DR are controlled separately. I blieve the forward voltage is not an issue, but will bring details if I got more information.

The D25S headlamp gives 1.5A to each SST40 led, 3A in total. I am not sure about this prototype for now, will bring more details later.

And it’s not possible to use SST40 White + SST20DR, emitter must be in the same size. That’s what I was told.

You are right on “lumens are the selling point” but it seems white led can not be as bright as 1000 lumens. It will be 300-500 Lumens I guess. The current can not be too high, because the shell, springs can not take it.

That’s why I am not sure if people will be interested in a headlamp with not that bright white led + 660nm red led.

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adam7027
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Funtastic wrote:
Lumens are usually the selling point and it’ll be more attractive for the average consumer to use an SST40.

Most consumers are still in the “dark age” of so called “standard” CRI (65-ish) cool/cold white emitters. They should level up already. It is the light quality, which does matter – especially for headlamp usage. 500lm 95 CRI is far more superior, than 700lm 65 CRI. I do believe, that good marketing should eventually manage to sell high CRI flashlights/headlamps, so they could be eventually become the most desired option.

If so called “standard” CRI would be at minimum 85 and not 65, I wouldn’t have raised my word, but 65 is like smelling the dog poop instead of chocolate.

This is when, manufacturer should give, what the consumer really needs, even if he/she wants some different by judging the product only by output numbers.

By the way, I remember, that BlueSwordM could contact somebody from Luminus, and there were some promises to extend high CRI lineup to SST-40 as well, but unfortunately, that didn’t happen yet.

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90% of the time using a headlamp I'm not needing maximum output so SST20 with all the throw it has  and the ability to have a 4000K high cri makes this set up an attractive offering . I've been a big fan of the D-10 and saw the dual lights in the D25 as kind of silly //Unless you actually do something like this with the second emitter . Sounds like a good idea to me .  I'm in ... Smile

       καὶ τὸ φῶς ἐν τῇ σκοτίᾳ φαίνει καὶ ἡ σκοτία αὐτὸ οὐ κατέλαβεν

                            

       Dc-fix diffuser film  >…  http://budgetlightforum.com/node/42208

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4000K + 660nm please

very nice to see 660nm used

virence.com Nichia E21A sw30+sw40 Wizard Pro ; Skilhunt H03 XP-E2 660nm Photo Red ; Wizard Pro E21A 2000K ; S2+ E21A sw40 d220 (for sale)

 

Funtastic
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Ryzbor wrote:
4000K + 660nm please

Even if that results in 300 lumens?

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with maukka lights

New Zealand store – https://www.piercingthedarkness.co.nz (NZ customers only)

YouTube channel – https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUWi2vYp4CWrRkOJM70t_w/videos (Demos for my customers, and reviews)

Funtastic
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Boaz wrote:

90% of the time using a headlamp I’m not needing maximum output so SST20 with all the throw it has  and the ability to have a 4000K high cri makes this set up an attractive offering . I’ve been a big fan of the D-10 and saw the dual lights in the D25 as kind of silly //Unless you actually do something like this with the second emitter . Sounds like a good idea to me .  I’m in … Smile

The dual SST40’s give a very nice spread though and is what you need in a headlamp. We use a flashlight for distance needs most of the time. I guess this would be why zoomies are favorable like led lenser.

I’m sure there’s people who’ll like it but we need to keep in mind the bigger picture of how much sales they’ll get. Barely anyone will buy it outside of BLF

None of my high CRI models sell, 9/10 they’ll go for the high lumens

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with maukka lights

New Zealand store – https://www.piercingthedarkness.co.nz (NZ customers only)

YouTube channel – https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUWi2vYp4CWrRkOJM70t_w/videos (Demos for my customers, and reviews)

adam7027
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Ryzbor wrote:
4000K + 660nm please

This would be the best option for many outdoor folks I know (including amatheur astronomers).

Anyway, I would consider a headband strap upgrade as well. For a 14500 headlamp, this headband strap would be fine, but for ~130g weight (including battery), adding a top strap would be helpful. (The headband for SP40 is much better)

If these details are all get realized, then I can notice a larger group of Hungarian amatheur astronomers to get this as a proper headlamp for them, if interested. Amatheur astronomers like to use red lights for keeping dark adapted eyes, but for frequent occasional usage, a warmish neutral high CRI white comes useful, for when small parts are slipped into the grass, and they need to find those – and when set up or collect their gears on the field.

Barry0892
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the max current is 2.2A for now, but it can be raised to 3A so the SST20 6500K/4000K can be brighter. The lowest current 10mA, I am not sure if it can be lower. My eyes still hurt when looking directly at the led at Lowest brightess.

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Fescron
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Will it have Type-C ( -> Type C ) charging?

Funtastic
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Fescron wrote:
Will it have Type-C ( -> Type C ) charging?

I doubt it since they’re just using the host which has micro usb. Not really worth it on such a cheap model. Sofirn aren’t the manufacturer for that host.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with maukka lights

New Zealand store – https://www.piercingthedarkness.co.nz (NZ customers only)

YouTube channel – https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUWi2vYp4CWrRkOJM70t_w/videos (Demos for my customers, and reviews)

Fescron
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Funtastic wrote:
Fescron wrote:
Will it have Type-C ( -> Type C ) charging?

I doubt it since they’re just using the host which has micro usb. Not really worth it on such a cheap model.

Yeah I’m thinking the same but one can dream I guess Smile

Ryzbor
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Funtastic wrote:
Ryzbor wrote:
4000K + 660nm please

Even if that results in 300 lumens?

SST20 in 5000K and 6500K look like shit so yes.

virence.com Nichia E21A sw30+sw40 Wizard Pro ; Skilhunt H03 XP-E2 660nm Photo Red ; Wizard Pro E21A 2000K ; S2+ E21A sw40 d220 (for sale)

 

Mureo
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Yes, the previous model put out more light. But the use case for this light is different than the SST-40 model, imo.

I believe all the average consumer needs to know is that this light for close up work. Ie, camping, walking around your house at night, or reading. These are also situations where better CRI can be useful.

The SST-40 model is for applications where you need lots of light with some reach.

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Interested for sure.
I’d vote for 2700K or 3000K sst-20 white led.

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Nooner wrote:
Interested for sure. I’d vote for 2700K or 3000K sst-20 white led.

Me too

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Barry0892 wrote:
[...] It will be 300-500 Lumens I guess. The current can not be too high, because the shell, springs can not take it. That's why I am not sure if people will be interested in a headlamp with not that bright white led + 660nm red led.

Assuming that D25S aims to a target group with emphasis on a "no frills" light for a true budget price, I would definitely say YES.

Funtastic wrote:
Ryzbor wrote:
4000K + 660nm please
Even if that results in 300 lumens?

Yes, I believe that kind of headlamp would sell well. Eventually, it's all about the right target group and the budget this kind of group is willing to spend.

In my humble opinion, D25S does not aim to be a highly sophisticated premium flashlight, not even close. If I am not totally mistaken, the odds are good that Sofirn (and maybe Wurkkos as well) will be developing their own dual emitter headlamp which provides both white and (deep) red light. That flashlight will probably put more emphasis on a more flexible UI, better host design, native USB-C support, better driver components, way more flexibility on minimum LED current, etc..

If I was to give recommendations, I would suggest downsizing a light like Wurkkos HD20 or D25S to AA/14500 format (or at least keep 18650 size), strip everything down to be as lightweighted as possible and use an efficient constant current buck/boost driver (depending on battery chemistry). 300 lumens of white light is a lot for a small headlamp and should normally suffice in most situations for close-range illumination. With deep red in addition you may get up to 30-40lm of pure red light for preserving your night vision in dark caves or too reduce backscatter of light in misty ambient conditions. Thinking about preserving one's night vision, I would suggest to have ultra-low "firefly" mode(s) for using deep red, again something that D25S is not designed to for.

In the end, it's about the right advertising and fulfilling the needs of your target groups.The majority of customers will always follow the way to get most lumens for the best achievable price. I believe in order to catch the spoiled flashoholic's attention it takes to highlight terms like constant brightness, 95CRI color rendition, high efficiency driver, ingenious user interface.

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Can you made like this one but only for 15$ Big Smile

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Quadrupel wrote:
Can you made like this one but only for 15$ Big Smile

RGBW led? I think led is expensive. I don’t think it possible to make it and sell at such a low price.

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Let call it D25WR

with SST20 4000K (or 2700K) + SST20DR 660nm is no problem.

3A current can make it 500LM roughly at High, 5mA-10mA makes it 1LM or dimmer at moonlight.

The minimum quantity is 1000pcs to get it started. That is what stops me from do it right now.

If the price $15.99 for D25WR without battery; $17.99 for D25WR with battery, how do you guys think?

Come on guys, I need some confidence!

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asot
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Highly interested!!!

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I’d certainly get at least one! (certainly if it has Type C, I probably won’t buy any more lights for myself with micro-USB) I got a HD20 and I really like it but as a full-time headlamp it’s rather heavy.

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That sounds interesting to me – an inexpensive light that offers both red and white light! I’m a little torn on whether mode memory is ideal on it, though.
I find that without shortcuts, having a moonlight mode is less useful if you may need to cycle past the highest mode to get to it.

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Barry0892 wrote:
Quadrupel wrote:
Can you made like this one but only for 15$ Big Smile

RGBW led? I think led is expensive. I don’t think it possible to make it and sell at such a low price.


Expensive? You can get it in Alixpress for about 4$
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Barry0892 wrote:
Let call it D25WR with SST20 4000K (or 2700K) + SST20DR 660nm is no problem. 3A current can make it 500LM roughly at High, 5mA-10mA makes it 1LM or dimmer at moonlight. The minimum quantity is 1000pcs to get it started. That is what stops me from do it right now. If the price $15.99 for D25WR without battery; $17.99 for D25WR with battery, how do you guys think? Come on guys, I need some confidence!

Barry, if we're talking about $15.99 (fifteeeeeeen-ninety-nine!)...what are we waiting for? Big Smile

Can you divide the 1,000pcs into small variations of D25WR? Suggestions?

  • 500 pcs SST20 4.000K 95CRI + SST20-DR 660nm
  • 300 pcs SST20 2.700K 95CRI + SST20-DR 660nm
  • 200 pcs LH351D 5.000K 90CRI + SST20-DR 660nm

I would even fancy a mini batch of D25AR using XP-E2 amber ("amber" seems to be a quite orange yellow) and SST20-DR 660nm. Both tints work great in full darkness to reduce overstraining the eyes and to have less backscatter in fog. It would be quite unique too and a risk of loss of sales margin is quite low here. Just my thoughts... Wink

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I’m in?

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