New Cree Leds(XHP70 in HI coming 2022)

63 posts / 0 new
Last post

Pages

welight
welight's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 6 days ago
Joined: 11/23/2013 - 17:42
Posts: 208
Location: Melbourne
New Cree Leds(XHP70 in HI coming 2022)


XP-P
XPG-4 coming soon, better colour over angle than XPG-2
cheers

Cutter Electronics Pty Ltd
Web: https://www.cutter.com.au

Edited by: welight on 10/04/2021 - 15:33
Superstocker
Superstocker's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 34 min ago
Joined: 11/28/2018 - 21:22
Posts: 319
Location: United States, Virginia

Thanks for the heads up. That XP-P looks very interesting.

TMaxxJJ
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 31 min ago
Joined: 02/01/2018 - 03:18
Posts: 431
Location: England

Superstocker wrote:
Thanks for the heads up. That XP-P looks very interesting.

It does indeed!
If the lumens can get close to 1000 and if it comes in anything other than 6500k then even more so!
welight
welight's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 6 days ago
Joined: 11/23/2013 - 17:42
Posts: 208
Location: Melbourne

comes in 7000k,6500k,6000k, 5700k and 5000k

Cutter Electronics Pty Ltd
Web: https://www.cutter.com.au

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Online
Last seen: 7 min 58 sec ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 14911
Location: LI NY

Interesting. XP-P implies an XP mount size and from the pic, looks the phosphor is W1/W2 size, smaller than Boost HX.

Sirstinky
Offline
Last seen: 15 hours 30 min ago
Joined: 11/02/2018 - 17:07
Posts: 1406
Location: Vancouver, WA

Could this possibly de throne the w1 or Boost HL? Hmmm. Wonder what kind if vf it will have. Hopefully the xpg4 will be a viable alternative to the sst20?

Superstocker
Superstocker's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 34 min ago
Joined: 11/28/2018 - 21:22
Posts: 319
Location: United States, Virginia
welight wrote:
comes in 7000k,6500k,6000k, 5700k and 5000k

5K new throw king? Yes please!!! If it’s rated at 700 lumens by Cree I feel there is a good chance it will at least equal the cslnm or culnm in throw.

Th558
Th558's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 57 min ago
Joined: 01/30/2016 - 16:19
Posts: 1229
Location: United Kingdom

XP-P in 5700K with a price lower than the osram W1 would be nice. Imagine these in an MF01S…12000lm 300kcd.

JaredM
JaredM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 41 min ago
Joined: 10/31/2011 - 13:33
Posts: 2355
Location: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania

I’d gladly welcome Cree back into the mix here. I won’t hold my breath for the xpg4, but the xpp has my attention. 3535 white flat equivalent? Yes, please.

Scallywag
Scallywag's picture
Offline
Last seen: 15 hours 8 min ago
Joined: 01/11/2018 - 22:23
Posts: 2197
Location: Ohio, United States

That is exciting. Hope we can drive it past 1000 lumens.

kramer5150
kramer5150's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: 05/19/2010 - 13:43
Posts: 2331
Location: Palo Alto CA

XPP looks interesting. thanks for sharing

raccoon city
raccoon city's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 hours 47 min ago
Joined: 10/06/2010 - 02:35
Posts: 17272
Location: रॅकून सिटी Palm Desert CA USA

You down with XP-P?

Yeah, you know me!

Enderman
Enderman's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 16 hours ago
Joined: 11/03/2016 - 22:42
Posts: 4283
Location: Vancouver, Canada

1mm^2 die area is nice.

XP is 3.45×3.45mm size, which is smaller than the CULNM1 (4040 size) which means worse thermals
The 700lm rating is not that great, and the actual performance will depend on how much it can be overdriven to.
The CULNM1 can be driven to over 1000lm so the XP P will need to do more than 150% output to beat it.

Agro
Agro's picture
Offline
Last seen: 19 hours 27 min ago
Joined: 05/14/2017 - 11:16
Posts: 6860
Location: Ślōnsk

Enderman wrote:
1mm^2 die area is nice.

XP is 3.45×3.45mm size, which is smaller than the CULNM1 (4040 size) which means worse thermals
The 700lm rating is not that great, and the actual performance will depend on how much it can be overdriven to.
The CULNM1 can be driven to over 1000lm so the XP P will need to do more than 150% output to beat it.


4040 CULNM1 is not much better than 3030 CSLNM1 which means that the improvement in thermals ain’t large.
I expect that the difference between 3535 at this die size would be meaningless in practice (though could be measurable on the bench). So it boils down mostly to who can build a better die.
For several years Osram used to be the throw leader so I wouldn’t bet on Cree. But there is some hope and it’s nice to see Cree trying.
Unheard
Unheard's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 12 min ago
Joined: 01/16/2019 - 11:38
Posts: 2275
Location: Germany

Hope it takes some juice to serve as a straight replacement in XP-L Hi lights.

Smile, you cannot kill them all.

Dalamar
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 2 hours ago
Joined: 04/25/2019 - 21:13
Posts: 272

why do i feel like it’s more high cct low cri junk?
why can’t they release good leds for throw?

I only like high CRI. Collection:

Fireflies NOV-MU 21 4500k E21A

Fireflies ROT66 219B SW45 D220

Fireflies E07 Copper 219B SW45k? (odd/higher lumen bin with lower r9 and higher cct?)

Fireflies E07 219B SW45k

Fireflies E07x Pro sst20 FA4 4000k 

 

Varmint removal:

Convoy M21A C8 ver SST20 4000k (5a)

Convoy S2+ SST20 4000k  FB4 (3200ma)

Memes:

BLF GT94

Emisar D18 660nm SST20 

 

 

CRI test dump https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1kcl_uOhgfpR4RSsa8F4b-UUVP9mkL6Cr...

ArtieT59
ArtieT59's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 29 min ago
Joined: 02/25/2020 - 17:55
Posts: 3138
Location: CT, USA

welight wrote:
comes in 7000k,6500k,6000k, 5700k and 5000k

This is is very exciting! Xp-p looks awesome!

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

kramer5150
kramer5150's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: 05/19/2010 - 13:43
Posts: 2331
Location: Palo Alto CA

What do they mean by max lumens >700 ?
Is that just a way for them to conservatively estimate a new untested product?

FWIW I’m hoping for something FET-DD capable, and hopefully brighter than the CSLNM1.TG.

Scallywag
Scallywag's picture
Offline
Last seen: 15 hours 8 min ago
Joined: 01/11/2018 - 22:23
Posts: 2197
Location: Ohio, United States

kramer5150 wrote:
What do they mean by max lumens >700 ?
Is that just a way for them to conservatively estimate a new untested product?

FWIW I’m hoping for something FET-DD capable, and hopefully brighter than the CSLNM1.TG.


Tough to judge that rating. We push 70.2s past 8000…

I’d prefer a low enough Vf that we can use regulated drivers.

Enderman
Enderman's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 16 hours ago
Joined: 11/03/2016 - 22:42
Posts: 4283
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Agro wrote:

4040 CULNM1 is not much better than 3030 CSLNM1 which means that the improvement in thermals ain’t large.
I expect that the difference between 3535 at this die size would be meaningless in practice (though could be measurable on the bench). So it boils down mostly to who can build a better die.
For several years Osram used to be the throw leader so I wouldn’t bet on Cree. But there is some hope and it’s nice to see Cree trying.

It’s like a 10-15% difference, pretty big…
Superstocker
Superstocker's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 34 min ago
Joined: 11/28/2018 - 21:22
Posts: 319
Location: United States, Virginia
Enderman wrote:
Agro wrote:
4040 CULNM1 is not much better than 3030 CSLNM1 which means that the improvement in thermals ain’t large. I expect that the difference between 3535 at this die size would be meaningless in practice (though could be measurable on the bench). So it boils down mostly to who can build a better die. For several years Osram used to be the throw leader so I wouldn’t bet on Cree. But there is some hope and it’s nice to see Cree trying.
It’s like a 10-15% difference, pretty big…

But small enough as to be overcome by binning. It’s hard to say with what we have but the above would perhaps put the XP-P at about a lower bin Culnm1. So I think Agros point about whose die is better is right. It was very hard to find good bins for the Culnm1. So, if good bins of the XP-P come out, it does not seem unreasonable that it could equal or exceed what we can get from osram. Additionally I would happily take a little loss in performance for a warmer cct.

welight
welight's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 6 days ago
Joined: 11/23/2013 - 17:42
Posts: 208
Location: Melbourne

Prelim Datasheet
XP-P Datasheet
Cheers

Cutter Electronics Pty Ltd
Web: https://www.cutter.com.au

chouster
Offline
Last seen: 8 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: 02/20/2014 - 15:05
Posts: 746
Location: germany

Thanks welight

JaredM
JaredM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 41 min ago
Joined: 10/31/2011 - 13:33
Posts: 2355
Location: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
chouster wrote:
Thanks welight
Thumbs Up

+1

led4power
led4power's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 59 min ago
Joined: 12/29/2012 - 09:48
Posts: 1331
Location: Croatia,EU

If datasheet is correct, it can't touch Osram at higher currents, and will not be able to handle overdrive like Osram.

Two graphs show this:

1) Flux vs temp - Cree (left) drops significantly more at higher temps:

2) Flux vs current - Cree(left) needs 3,0Amps to double flux measured at 1Amp,Osram needs only about 2.35Amps for the same 200% increase; at 3Amps Osram is at ~250%.

Cree at 3Amps (and that's with pulse testing at 25C) looks already close to its peak output, under real life testing peak would be probably at ~4Amps with lumen output marginally better compared to 3Amps.

Vf voltage is also significantly higher compared to Osram.

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Online
Last seen: 7 min 58 sec ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 14911
Location: LI NY

Agree - I noticed that flux vs. current chart and thought there's no way you 'd get anything out of 5 amps, maybe a little at 4 amps, if the LED can take 4 amps.

JaredM
JaredM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 41 min ago
Joined: 10/31/2011 - 13:33
Posts: 2355
Location: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania

Well I guess I’m too slow on this one.. I agree with Tom and L4P that the overdriving isn’t going to be there on this one if the prelim datasheet is accurate. 225% relative output max. At 420lm binning, maybe we see 945 lumens. Might be a more efficient alternative at the 3.5A range. Only one way to know I guess.

Superstocker
Superstocker's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 34 min ago
Joined: 11/28/2018 - 21:22
Posts: 319
Location: United States, Virginia

Thanks for the data sheet welight and thanks for bringing those charts together Led4power. It is unfortunate that the cslnm1 “handles heat” better than the XP-P. I was hoping the latter would do slightly better than the cslnm1 in that area and be able to be overdriven slightly more. The data sheet has bad news there. The good news is that if we can get top bins then it will still be close with a better color temperature.

Enderman
Enderman's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 16 hours ago
Joined: 11/03/2016 - 22:42
Posts: 4283
Location: Vancouver, Canada

The output curve sees to peak at ~225%
Even the best bin only does 400lm at 100%, so max would be 900lm best case scenario.
Still definitely worse than the CULNM1 unfortunately (4040 size), and probably also worse than the CSLNM1 (XP size) when you take into account thermals.

Agro
Agro's picture
Offline
Last seen: 19 hours 27 min ago
Joined: 05/14/2017 - 11:16
Posts: 6860
Location: Ślōnsk
djozz
djozz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 9 hours 45 min ago
Joined: 09/07/2012 - 17:04
Posts: 18071
Location: Amsterdam

Nice! So we can expect 720 lumen at 3A, and 5000K, now see how they compare to the Osram version Smile

Pages