I find it most important that the clip opens wide at its end. The original KR1 clip is wonderful. The clip Jared has shown seems to be of this kind, at the same time allowing deep carry.
Suggestions for better deep carry clips have been addressed to Sofirn today. I explained why it is so important to us but no guarantees that any major design changes can still be incorporated. A bare aluminum version is being discussed, too.
This is the current design, picture courtesy by Sofirn.
Thanks for the updates on this Lux-Perpetua
I will not focus more on the pocket clip, since you already addressed that issue
I will, however, focus in one aspect I mentioned before: length! Of course, this is a Sofirn light, with a “Sofirn style design”: long screwed-in bezel.
But, how feasible would it be to diminish the size of the bezel (and eventually reflector) to make the flashlight slighty more compact?
I’ll take this photo as example:
The SP10 is the longest, due to that bezel. The Manker E11 (has a magnet, making it taller) and the Skilhunt M150 (all side switches) are more compact than the SP10, and it is mostly due to the bezel lenght. Trimming it down a little bit would:
a) make the flashlight more compact
b) not have impact on heatsinking (hoping that the head structure does its’ job well)
c) make it more “pleasant” to the look and attractive .
Of course, I will not be picky about this, since the train is in march, but I would not be ok with myself if I didn’t mention this aspect!
And once again, thank you very much for all your work
Here’s another example of what I mentioned before.
I tried the FWAA bezel on the SP10B host for illustrative purposes (the bezel doesn’t fit).
Skilhunt M150 > SP10A > SP10B “shorter” > FWAA
It would be nice to have these 2 AA/14500 lights as the “shortest” in their category
I’m all for making a light shorter, but not at the expense of the quality of the beam. The SP10S is already fairly floody, and shortening the reflector doesn’t seem like a good idea.
I’m all for making a light shorter, but not at the expense of the quality of the beam. The SP10S is already fairly floody, and shortening the reflector doesn’t seem like a good idea.
Not having the SP10S, I only have the SP10A/B, and they are not that floody. Actually, when I first hot them, both the SP10A and the SF14 were quite throwy for AA lights! The thing is, mine have XP-G2 while the new one has Samsung LH351D.
I do get your point but now we may start entering personal preferences, about floody or throwy.
Given that the SP10 Pro will be an EDC light, I would prefer it floody for looking and short/medium distances. If I want throw, I can pick the GT Nano. But again, this is about personal preference in the beam.
Overall, in terms of design, I would prefer and carry a shorter light quicker than a longer light!
If I remember correctly, deeper reflectors has less spill and larger hotspot and shallow reflectors has wider spill and smaller hotspot. Same hotspot intensity and range.
If I remember correctly, deeper reflectors has less spill and larger hotspot and shallow reflectors has wider spill and smaller hotspot. Same hotspot intensity and range.
Kind of. Shallow hotspots are actually probably wider from a fwhm perspective. Deep reflectors get more of a ‘cone’ beam with a bright, tiny ‘hotspot’ and then many ‘coronas’. Shallow reflectors will give a clean, sharp spot and deep are more ‘fuzzy’. I find just under 1:1 (depth:dia) is about the happy place for most applications.
Final custom SP10 Pro Andúril 2 UI diagram posted on the OP.
Sofirn has finished creating a prototype driver. The final driver will offer flashing pads to have direct access for a pogo pin adapter to flash new/alternative firmware to the MCU.
Next step is to release two prototype flashlight samples to gchart and Tom E for full examination and testing, followed by a trial phase before ramping up mass production.
gchart created a custom Andúril 2 hex-file to be used for SP10 Pro:
Default mode is stepped ramp with 5 brightness levels
Simple UI has full power (ceiling 150/150)
Advanced UI ceiling per standard 120/150
USE_2C_MAX_TURBO command implemented, i.e. Turbo in the Advanced UI works like in Andúril 1 via 2C
toggle stepped/smooth ramp via 3C from ON in Simple UI
all latest code updates until August 12, 2021 are taken into account, i.e. firmware revision 2021-08-12
Lumen output as per gchart's prototype testing sample:
(actual numbers may vary in the final product and depend on the used battery and the emitter type/tint)
Mode
NiMH
Li-Ion
Eco
0.2
0.5
Low
6
16
Med
32
75
High
133
270
Turbo
308
729
Next steps:
Lux-Perpetua: create manual for SP10 Pro incl. separation and simplification of the the UI diagrams for Simple UI and Advanced UI
Sofirn: check possibilities for alternative (deep carry/captive ring) clips
Sofirn: check possibilities for alternative anodizing colors or bare aluminum design (clear coated / sandblasted)
Sofirn: build prototype samples
BLF community: check for hardware requirements to realize a cheap and reliable pogo pin adapter to be used with future drivers with AVR-1 MCUs.
[...] Of course, this is a Sofirn light, with a "Sofirn style design": long screwed-in bezel. But, +how feasible would it be to diminish the size of the bezel (and eventually reflector) to make the flashlight slighty more compact? [...]
Obrigado pelas tuas sugestões.
I talked about this with Sofirn but they have already committed to this design and they are eager to finally bring this model to life. If they had to redesign the entire head it would cause more delays, e.g. testing a new reflector geometry, beam shapes etc.. I assume the SP10S head design was successful/popular enough to keep it this way. However, I do agree with you that a shorter length would be nice with regard to EDC aspirations. A shorter, lighter TIR lens version could certainly be considered in a future upgrade of SP10 Pro.
a) make the flashlight more compact
b) not have impact on heatsinking (hoping that the head structure does its’ job well)
c) make it more “pleasant” to the look and attractive .
Agree with your points. A TIR would be a space saver. Not sure if this is a standard size, but if it is, people could even choose their beam characteristics.
Point c is also important: This light needs to be de-uglyfied.
Regarding the flashing adapter, historically I’ve used a Xnano-416 dev board or a AVRJTAGICE programmer. But they aren’t super cheap and they do bring some complications (Windows vs Linux, custom avrdude stuff, etc).
So I decided to checkout the pymcuprog project and a super simple and cheap adapter. I think this should be a good universal solution for programming these AVR 1- Series chips. I’ve got the parts ordered. I’ll update when I have more info.
Ok, next project...get Sofirn to create a high quality rotating angle head light like the Nicron N7/Rofis R2 with dual battery support, good emitters, quality driver, etc. Both of those lights are ok and super handy to own, but the quality is not there on the Nicron and the Rofis (other than having disappeared now...) was rather expensive and a little overdone while not giving great firmware options.
Good to see that this supports NiMH. You might need to slow down the party strobe’s on time – 4 to 5ms should be OK.
Woah, good catch! I don’t spend too much time in strobe modes. I just tried party strobe with NiMH and sure enough, it didn’t light up on NiMH (but is fine on Li-Ion). I tried setting it to 4ms, no dice. So I went ahead and skipped to 6ms and that seemed to work. Thanks for the tip!
Updated hex-file (correcting the NiMH glitch in Party Strobe) as been sent to Sofirn.
New UI diagram draft to be used in the upcoming SP10 Pro manual
Just to be sure, this is (almost?) exactly the same as the diagram with all the fancy icons, but without those right? Looks way cleaner for sure! I like it! Also good to see the factory defaults, although I still miss the default temperature value If I may also add another thing, maybe add asterixes (*1) to the “set …” bubbles and explain them on the side? That way all of the information you need to use the light is available in one compact picture without having to read the whole manual
The button brightness settings are the same for both UI’s right? Although the SP10 Pro won’t have a button-LED I assume? And auto-lock is not available in simple UI? Overall I’m excited to use Anduril 2, I only use the battery check most of the time so Simple UI will be perfect for me
Ah yes just another thing, I suppose voltage calibration will need to be tested rigorously on both NiMh and Li-Ion voltages so it behaves exactly as expected? Or are there two different internal calibration values depending on the source voltage so this won’t pose any problems?
I need to double check, but I think you can set up auto-lock in Advanced UI and then put the light back into Simple UI.
Correct, no button LED.
There is only one voltage calibration value. In my sample size of 1 flashlight, the voltage reading was very accurate on both NiMH and lithium ion without any calibration. Of course some of that will depend on the accuracy of the voltage divider resistors themselves.
Oh, and one more great thing about the use of the AVR 1 Series: the thermal sensor is factory calibrated with both offset and slope values! In all of the 1 Series-based drivers I’ve put together, they seem to be spot on!
Just to be sure, this is (almost?) exactly the same as the diagram with all the fancy icons, but without those right? Looks way cleaner for sure! I like it! Also good to see the factory defaults, although I still miss the default temperature value
Yes, I wanted to sweep any unnecessary stuff and give it a cleaner look.
Factory default temperature is always 45°C if I am not mistaken. gchart probably knows way better than me. I like a safe level for default since those people who ask for higher temperature limits are often those who can handle a complex UI quite well.
Fescron wrote:
If I may also add another thing, maybe add asterixes (*1) to the "set ..." bubbles and explain them on the side? That way all of the information you need to use the light is available in one compact picture without having to read the whole manual :)
Agreed, but I am afraid it could turn the cleaner look into something more confusing. Instead, my intention is to offer detailed (yet essential) explanations for each function in the text manual of SP10 Pro. This manual needs to be kept short for Sofirn will offer it in not less than eight different languages.
Fescron wrote:
The button brightness settings are the same for both UI's right? Although the SP10 Pro won't have a button-LED I assume? And auto-lock is not available in simple UI?
gchart wrote:
I need to double check, but I think you can set up auto-lock in Advanced UI and then put the light back into Simple UI. Correct, no button LED. (…)
OMG, how did I miss the fact that there was no switch button LED?
I will ask Barry if they plan to use the SP35 / IF22(A) switch which has an LED in the button. If I recall correctly, the original switch in SP10S was often reported to be mediocre. So, let‘s wait and see what they are going to use here. In the worst case, I will remove that part from the UI diagram and manual.
About auto-lock…
Good question, never checked before. According to ToyKeeper‘s text manual, auto-lock is a part of the Advanced UI only but maybe timer-settings are also being propagated to Simple UI as well?
Yup, it looks like it would be a simple add. The question though is: should it’s inclusion be made it universal? or should it be a compile-time config option? TK clearly designed it to not autolock in Simple UI. So I would think if it’s going to be added in, it should be a compile flag. The setup of autolock would definitely still happen in Advanced UI, but I could see it’s config carrying over to Simple UI. (sorry, kinda thinking out loud there)
ToyKeeper/spaghetti-monster/anduril/off-mode.c
#ifdef USE_AUTOLOCK
// lock the light after being off for N minutes
#ifdef USE_SIMPLE_UI
if (! simple_ui_active) { // no auto-lock in Simple UI
#endif
uint16_t ticks = autolock_time * SLEEP_TICKS_PER_MINUTE;
if ((autolock_time > 0) && (arg > ticks)) {
set_state(lockout_state, 0);
}
#ifdef USE_SIMPLE_UI
}
#endif
#endif // ifdef USE_AUTOLOCK
to be honest, I fear that both Sofirn and some (many?) BLF members / customers would rather like Simple UI to be really „K.I.S.S.“ (keep it simple, stupid). Some “muggle“ users could get confused if their light locks out automatically. On the other hand, if auto-lock is not active in the factory defaults of the Advanced UI, it should not be of any concern.
How about a quick poll (1 week runtime) to see what people want most? I can ask Barry to hold on using the current firmware for there might be another one coming with auto-lock working in Simple UI, too.
Auto lock probably won’t be a good idea. Hand a light to grandparents and they’d just think it were broken. Anyone given a light in simple UI should be able to figure out how to use it immediately.
Even as an enthusiast and huge fan of Anduril – I agree, I think auto-lock should be kept out of the simple mode. But I also agree with the suggestion to put it to a poll.
Remember – auto lock would still have to be set up in advanced UI for it to carry over to simple UI. There would be no danger of someone accidentally enabling auto lock from within simple UI.
For those who do not want to use the clip I had this in mind, same as Hank‘s ring with a small lanyard hole.
I find it most important that the clip opens wide at its end. The original KR1 clip is wonderful. The clip Jared has shown seems to be of this kind, at the same time allowing deep carry.
Smile, you cannot kill them all.
Thanks for the updates on this Lux-Perpetua
I will not focus more on the pocket clip, since you already addressed that issue
I will, however, focus in one aspect I mentioned before: length! Of course, this is a Sofirn light, with a “Sofirn style design”: long screwed-in bezel.
But, how feasible would it be to diminish the size of the bezel (and eventually reflector) to make the flashlight slighty more compact?
I’ll take this photo as example:
The SP10 is the longest, due to that bezel. The Manker E11 (has a magnet, making it taller) and the Skilhunt M150 (all side switches) are more compact than the SP10, and it is mostly due to the bezel lenght. Trimming it down a little bit would:
a) make the flashlight more compact
b) not have impact on heatsinking (hoping that the head structure does its’ job well)
c) make it more “pleasant” to the look and attractive .
Of course, I will not be picky about this, since the train is in march, but I would not be ok with myself if I didn’t mention this aspect!
And once again, thank you very much for all your work
MY REVIEWS THREAD /// My Flashlight Collection /// YouTube Channel
Mods: 1 / 2 // TIR: 1 / 2 // Others: Biscotti 3 + 1*7135 / Triple TIR w/ XP-G2 /// My Review's Blog (PT) /// OL Contest 2019 /// OL Contest 2020 /// GIVEAWAYs: 1 / 2 / 3
Here’s another example of what I mentioned before.
I tried the FWAA bezel on the SP10B host for illustrative purposes (the bezel doesn’t fit).
Skilhunt M150 > SP10A > SP10B “shorter” > FWAA
It would be nice to have these 2 AA/14500 lights as the “shortest” in their category
MY REVIEWS THREAD /// My Flashlight Collection /// YouTube Channel
Mods: 1 / 2 // TIR: 1 / 2 // Others: Biscotti 3 + 1*7135 / Triple TIR w/ XP-G2 /// My Review's Blog (PT) /// OL Contest 2019 /// OL Contest 2020 /// GIVEAWAYs: 1 / 2 / 3
I’m all for making a light shorter, but not at the expense of the quality of the beam. The SP10S is already fairly floody, and shortening the reflector doesn’t seem like a good idea.
Not having the SP10S, I only have the SP10A/B, and they are not that floody. Actually, when I first hot them, both the SP10A and the SF14 were quite throwy for AA lights! The thing is, mine have XP-G2 while the new one has Samsung LH351D.
I do get your point
but now we may start entering personal preferences, about floody or throwy.
Given that the SP10 Pro will be an EDC light, I would prefer it floody for looking and short/medium distances. If I want throw, I can pick the GT Nano. But again, this is about personal preference in the beam.
Overall, in terms of design, I would prefer and carry a shorter light quicker than a longer light!
MY REVIEWS THREAD /// My Flashlight Collection /// YouTube Channel
Mods: 1 / 2 // TIR: 1 / 2 // Others: Biscotti 3 + 1*7135 / Triple TIR w/ XP-G2 /// My Review's Blog (PT) /// OL Contest 2019 /// OL Contest 2020 /// GIVEAWAYs: 1 / 2 / 3
If I remember correctly, deeper reflectors has less spill and larger hotspot and shallow reflectors has wider spill and smaller hotspot. Same hotspot intensity and range.
Kind of. Shallow hotspots are actually probably wider from a fwhm perspective. Deep reflectors get more of a ‘cone’ beam with a bright, tiny ‘hotspot’ and then many ‘coronas’. Shallow reflectors will give a clean, sharp spot and deep are more ‘fuzzy’. I find just under 1:1 (depth:dia) is about the happy place for most applications.
https://fundrazr.com/osturaband
No affiliation, just a fan.
Update (August 15, 2021):
Lumen output as per gchart's prototype testing sample:
(actual numbers may vary in the final product and depend on the used battery and the emitter type/tint)
Next steps:
Obrigado pelas tuas sugestões.
I talked about this with Sofirn but they have already committed to this design and they are eager to finally bring this model to life. If they had to redesign the entire head it would cause more delays, e.g. testing a new reflector geometry, beam shapes etc.. I assume the SP10S head design was successful/popular enough to keep it this way. However, I do agree with you that a shorter length would be nice with regard to EDC aspirations. A shorter, lighter TIR lens version could certainly be considered in a future upgrade of SP10 Pro.
Agree with your points. A TIR would be a space saver. Not sure if this is a standard size, but if it is, people could even choose their beam characteristics.
Point c is also important: This light needs to be de-uglyfied.
Maybe in another version.
Smile, you cannot kill them all.
Great updates, Lux-Perpetua!
Regarding the flashing adapter, historically I’ve used a Xnano-416 dev board or a AVR JTAG ICE programmer. But they aren’t super cheap and they do bring some complications (Windows vs Linux, custom avrdude stuff, etc).
So I decided to checkout the pymcuprog project and a super simple and cheap adapter. I think this should be a good universal solution for programming these AVR 1- Series chips. I’ve got the parts ordered. I’ll update when I have more info.
Fantastic!
Ok, next project...get Sofirn to create a high quality rotating angle head light like the Nicron N7/Rofis R2 with dual battery support, good emitters, quality driver, etc. Both of those lights are ok and super handy to own, but the quality is not there on the Nicron and the Rofis (other than having disappeared now...) was rather expensive and a little overdone while not giving great firmware options.
Please add me to the list…INTERESTED!
High CRI lights for sale
Good to see that this supports NiMH. You might need to slow down the party strobe’s on time – 4 to 5ms should be OK.
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Any info on price yet?
Woah, good catch! I don’t spend too much time in strobe modes. I just tried party strobe with NiMH and sure enough, it didn’t light up on NiMH (but is fine on Li-Ion). I tried setting it to 4ms, no dice. So I went ahead and skipped to 6ms and that seemed to work. Thanks for the tip!
Update (August 17, 2021):
Just to be sure, this is (almost?) exactly the same as the diagram with all the fancy icons, but without those right? Looks way cleaner for sure! I like it! Also good to see the factory defaults, although I still miss the default temperature value
If I may also add another thing, maybe add asterixes (*1) to the “set …” bubbles and explain them on the side? That way all of the information you need to use the light is available in one compact picture without having to read the whole manual 
The button brightness settings are the same for both UI’s right? Although the SP10 Pro won’t have a button-LED I assume? And auto-lock is not available in simple UI? Overall I’m excited to use Anduril 2, I only use the battery check most of the time so Simple UI will be perfect for me
Ah yes just another thing, I suppose voltage calibration will need to be tested rigorously on both NiMh and Li-Ion voltages so it behaves exactly as expected? Or are there two different internal calibration values depending on the source voltage so this won’t pose any problems?
I need to double check, but I think you can set up auto-lock in Advanced UI and then put the light back into Simple UI.
Correct, no button LED.
There is only one voltage calibration value. In my sample size of 1 flashlight, the voltage reading was very accurate on both NiMH and lithium ion without any calibration. Of course some of that will depend on the accuracy of the voltage divider resistors themselves.
Oh, and one more great thing about the use of the AVR 1 Series: the thermal sensor is factory calibrated with both offset and slope values! In all of the 1 Series-based drivers I’ve put together, they seem to be spot on!
Yes, I wanted to sweep any unnecessary stuff and give it a cleaner look.
Factory default temperature is always 45°C if I am not mistaken. gchart probably knows way better than me.
I like a safe level for default since those people who ask for higher temperature limits are often those who can handle a complex UI quite well.
Agreed, but I am afraid it could turn the cleaner look into something more confusing. Instead, my intention is to offer detailed (yet essential) explanations for each function in the text manual of SP10 Pro. This manual needs to be kept short for Sofirn will offer it in not less than eight different languages.
OMG, how did I miss the fact that there was no switch button LED?
I will ask Barry if they plan to use the SP35 / IF22(A) switch which has an LED in the button. If I recall correctly, the original switch in SP10S was often reported to be mediocre. So, let‘s wait and see what they are going to use here. In the worst case, I will remove that part from the UI diagram and manual.
About auto-lock…
Good question, never checked before. According to ToyKeeper‘s text manual, auto-lock is a part of the Advanced UI only but maybe timer-settings are also being propagated to Simple UI as well?
Can confirm, auto lock settings do not carry over to simple UI.
Yup, I just confirmed the same using my customized SP10S with the proposed firmware.
I’m not sure how many people would want to use Simple UI with auto lock, but I don’t think it would be too hard to implement.
Yup, it looks like it would be a simple add. The question though is: should it’s inclusion be made it universal? or should it be a compile-time config option? TK clearly designed it to not autolock in Simple UI. So I would think if it’s going to be added in, it should be a compile flag. The setup of autolock would definitely still happen in Advanced UI, but I could see it’s config carrying over to Simple UI. (sorry, kinda thinking out loud there)
ToyKeeper/spaghetti-monster/anduril/off-mode.c
#ifdef USE_AUTOLOCK // lock the light after being off for N minutes #ifdef USE_SIMPLE_UI if (! simple_ui_active) { // no auto-lock in Simple UI #endif uint16_t ticks = autolock_time * SLEEP_TICKS_PER_MINUTE; if ((autolock_time > 0) && (arg > ticks)) { set_state(lockout_state, 0); } #ifdef USE_SIMPLE_UI } #endif #endif // ifdef USE_AUTOLOCKThank you gchart for this great idea.
I like this option, but…
to be honest, I fear that both Sofirn and some (many?) BLF members / customers would rather like Simple UI to be really „K.I.S.S.“ (keep it simple, stupid). Some “muggle“ users could get confused if their light locks out automatically. On the other hand, if auto-lock is not active in the factory defaults of the Advanced UI, it should not be of any concern.
How about a quick poll (1 week runtime) to see what people want most? I can ask Barry to hold on using the current firmware for there might be another one coming with auto-lock working in Simple UI, too.
Auto lock probably won’t be a good idea. Hand a light to grandparents and they’d just think it were broken. Anyone given a light in simple UI should be able to figure out how to use it immediately.
Even as an enthusiast and huge fan of Anduril – I agree, I think auto-lock should be kept out of the simple mode. But I also agree with the suggestion to put it to a poll.
My Lights (Updated: June 20, 2021)
Remember – auto lock would still have to be set up in advanced UI for it to carry over to simple UI. There would be no danger of someone accidentally enabling auto lock from within simple UI.
Active Poll #1 for 7 days from now on:
Would you like Auto-Lock to be integrated in Andúril 2 Simple UI?
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78727
Active poll #2 for 14 days from now on:
What anodizing do you prefer for SP10 Pro?
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78728
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