What I am wondering about right now is: If I choose an Anduril-powered light (like the IF25A or WT3M), how is she going to be able to tell when to charge it (without letting the LVP fully shut it off)?
Having it blink out the battery voltage is obviously not an option 
At the very low brightness levels she is likely going to use it, do you think the LVP step-downs will be noticeable enough to be used as low-battery indication? Is it possible there are no intermediate steps in that case, and the LVP just shuts the light down completely as soon as it kicks in? (Sorry if it is a stupid question. I have not really studied how LVP is implemented on Anduril, yet.)
Very good insight, i was thinking of the switch going red when needing charging but light blinking is not a bad idea.
Even my old old old Convoys with the dreaded 3/5 drivers would start blinking when running low.
My plumber’s light had a slow-blink every few seconds, which I assume was that the light’s about drained.
And what I suggested elsewhere about a blink every 5-10sec when running low, to every 2sec or so when about to crap out, would be best. Can’t possibly miss that.
And my Tacklife that I use around the house, when you’re using the light, you don’t really notice that the ‘T’ in the tailcap went from green to red unless it’s by pure chance that you’re looking at it while using the light. So if I can miss it, granma is gonna end up in the dark when she needs the light most.
Sofirn CO1 is a great ~7 lumen 1 mode AAA light with very nice 3400K hi-cri led. Inexpensive & durable (black & green models are potted for extra durability).
Twist on/off.
Very long runtime for AAA battery. Great little lights!
I guess that’s one drawback here. I don’t know about the IF25A but the WT3M doesn’t have any indication other than stepping down. Probably will not see stepdowns until the very end and/or if she’s using it for longer periods at that point. The switch light is configurable for brightness/off, but it doesn’t do anything else except turn red when connected to a charging cable (green when charged). I’ve not tested it but 2.8v is supposed to be the cutoff…not ideal but with low current and occasional use I don’t think draining that low will affect battery cycle life. Even if it did a decent 21700 cell used like this is going to last her several-to-many years.
As long as granny doesn’t have arthritic hands…
This is why there’s a burgeoning market for things like those sticky rubber sleeves to stretch over doorknobs, or replacement lever-type door-handles vs shiny slippery round knobs.
Everybody… put yourself in the place of poor ol’ granny, with failing eyesight, arthritic hands, limited mobility and strength, etc.
That’s why even tailswitch lights might be a Bad Idea, despite a mechanical cut-off being superior as far as zero battery-drain when off, or even a “lightweight” AA-based light might be too skinny to hold comfortably, and so on.
This, exactly. Tailswitch could be fine or could feel like murder. I was wondering the same about the rotary switches everyone has been clamoring for…they’d need to be easy to turn but also the size of the light may need to be larger/longer to use those comfortably in weakened hands. Before I recommended the WT3M I was wondering if it might be too heavy, but almost everything else checks nicely.
It’s not always the stiffness/difficulty of activating a switch but the position that arthritic joints may need to be in to use it.
I couldn’t agree more. This is one of the reason I am leaning towards the chunkier (21700) IF25A and WTxM. The others would be way too skinny to be comfortable for her. Especially the tiny Manta Ray S1 and CO1.
The D4S V2 could be nice option, but is too expensive and lacks both a built-in charger and AA NiMH support. Having to buy a standalone charger would drive the total cost even higher (about 2x the IF25A and WTxM), not to mention the extra hassle for her when recharging.
I appreciate you putting this much thought into it IMO, the ~200g total weight of the 21700 form factor should not be a problem. Remember, she is going to use the light only a couple of minutes at a time. And she is used to carrying things of similar weight.
“Twist on-off” is also a “no-no” in my mind. She - like many elderly people - has restricted mobility, and an impaired sense of balance. So she either walks with a cane or holds on to the nearby furniture, doorhandles, walls etc. Therefore two-handed operation is a deal breaker. Tailswitches might be a slightly better option, but they cannot beat a good side-button in terms of overall ergonomics. It is also an important factor of course, that a side-switch is what she is used to.
Shame. I really like the low-battery indication (via the button light) feature of the Wurkkos FC11. Too bad it is 18650… and its UI is not Anduril-based => long presses could cause confusion.
As far as I can see, the new 21700 TS21 has the same feature + Anduril v2. But reviews seem to indicate its button is of the higher actuation force variety, which is an instant deal breaker (unless modded, of course). Unfortunately I’ve also seen multiple reports of excessive parasitic drain with the current revision of the TS21. Plus it seems to be the general consensus among users that in comparison with the IF25A, the latter is the better product overall.
That leaves the IF25A and WT3M. Between those two, it is a tough choice. I read up on both, and man, do I love the WT3M! Especially its capable thermal design, ease of disassembly, accessible flashing pads. It’s a true enthusiast light. If I was looking for a compact torch for my personal use, I would definitely go with it. For grandma though… the IF25A might be the safer option. It just seems… more refined and also more rugged somehow.
Based on what I’ve read, the WT3M looks like a very respectable first(ish) effort from the manufacturer which needs some extra care(*) to reach its true potential, while the IF25A is available as a complete package and is pretty much “plug-and-play”. Plus it is available with warmer color temperature and higher CRI LEDs than the WT3M. And it has Anduril v2, i.e. the config menus are hidden deeper.
(*) Fixing potential connection issues (supposedly only affecting the clear-coated silver versions), replacing the bad-batch 7135, buying a battery separately while keeping in mind not all 21700 batteries will fit, smoothing the occasional sharp tail spring, modding the USB cover flap so it is easier to remove, etc.
I just got my Wurkkos TS21 on Christmas Eve, and I was planning to do a side-by-side comparison video of it with my trusty IF25A. For a number of reasons, I probably won’t do that now, but the IF25A just feels solid. It’s shorter and thicker than the Wurkkos, but the perceived ruggedness is amazing. It’s probably purely subjective, but the squat, dense feel, plus the fact that I’ve carried it for months, dropped it multiple times and only have one ding in the ano, makes it “feel” invincible. As Kondo Marie would say, it sparks joy.
Yeah, it most definitely looks indestructible Loving that compact glass with the thick bezel. Looks like it can handle a few drops.
Speaking of potential drops, I also like the fact that the tail of the IF25A has 3 flattened sides, which makes it less likely for the light to roll off a table / nightstand when stored vertically (e.g. versus the WT3M which is perfectly cylindrical). In addition, I can also order the 1.5$ Sofirn pocket clip for it. (It’s weird how it is not part of the default - and otherwise quite generous - bundle.) That will definitely prevent it from rolling off, although it might make it more uncomfortable to hold.
Do you own a BLF LT1 by any chance? If so, how do the e-switch actuation forces compare? (just so I have a frame of reference)
Nope, sorry.
No problem.
One last question: Which of Sofirn’s 21700 batteries do you think I should choose for the IF25A? As far as I can see, people tend to recommend the 4Ah high drain variant over the 5Ah model (mainly for better performance). But for our special use-case I can’t help but think we might be better off with the 5Ah one. She will most definitely not use the light on higher levels, especially not on turbo. I might though, if I borrow it occasionally 
Yeah, button indication would be a nice feature to have…I find it handy on many lights. I did confirm the low voltage cutoff yesterday…burned through a 40T and it does indeed shut off at 2.8v. I teased it to keep on going and when it finally refused, it measured 2.76v out of the light, bounced up to 2.88v after a half hour or so. The stepdowns are certainly there but it’s going to take a long time at low levels for them to appear. (side note, pleased to see that after a rest period and charging that 40T at 800mA (0.2C) the charger said it put in 4280mAh…go Samsung!)
As far as ruggedness, I think any of these would hold up just fine for her in the house and in the yard. Hardly any of our lights are truly durable when it comes to drops and “off-label abuse” but for ordinary use most do great and I don’t see anything in the WildTrail that would suggest caution. I don’t have that Sofirn but do have several of their lights and none of them have been questionable there…pretty decent build quality generally.
The FC11 does need a firmer press but it’s not terrible…hard to quantify by feel but maybe it takes twice as much pressure to activate than the WildTrail? The similar Sofirn SC31 Pro is just a tad easier to press than the FC11 but still more than the WildTrail. The firmware on the FC11 I think is the exact same as Sofirn’s ramping software that they use on lots of lights - it’s actually one of my favorites because of its functional simplicity although I do love many things about Anduril(s). It can go stepped or ramped, will blink when voltage is low, and the ramping is pretty good. Long press from off goes to the bottom of the ramp…not a true moonlight but probably in the area you say she’d like to be, and it’s not like a lonnnggg presss to do it. The button sits pretty far forward on the head, but she probably won’t be dealing with turbo heat…however the clip may need to be removed for comfort and the tailcap may fill her hand past the outside of her palm. All in all a nice light but 18650 run-time and diameter and a narrower beam/spot at low light levels. I got the 5000K in that one with the LH351D high CRI and the tint is still nice at low light levels although a tad to the green side as expected (wonderful at higher levels). The SST40 5000K in the WT3M is standard CRI but actually looks nicer at low levels, maybe because of the three emitters blending? I’ve had no problems at all with my WT3M, btw, but black and SST version…had some minor design quibbles but it’s a great light and it’s really grown on me. Amazon still has a few of those left at $31 right now (not sure if WildTrail is pulling out of Amazon or just out of stock on almost everything, but Amazon at least gives you quick shipping and easy returns if it doesn’t work out).
Whatever you get her, I’d love to hear what she thinks of it and how it works for her.
Missed some posts…looks like the IF25A is the one. On the Sofirn/Lishen batteries, I’d go with the 5000mAh one for this but either one would be fine. At low output the 4000mAh cell may give more than that anyway so it could be a washout (would have to look again at HJK’s test on it…he hasn’t done the 5000 yet). I have both but only a dozen cycles on the 5000 in a few lights…right now I can’t say that I notice much difference at all between it and the 4000, which I have several of. But if they give you the choice in their kits, may as well go 5000. It seems to compare very favorably with the Samsung 50E btw, and the only thing better might be the 50G if you can find it (so far I only see that in the EU countries…).
I would check the parasitic drain of whatever e-switch light you get her. Depending on how long she stres it, it could come into play.
I would check the parasitic drain of whatever e-switch light you get her. Depending on how long she strores it, it could come into play.
On the WT3M with a fully charged 40T I get the following:
Switch off: 38-40 uA
Switch low: 66 uA
Switch high: 103 uA
Switch breathing: 40-80 uA
No concern. I leave the switch on low now, rather than off as I do most of my other lights.
Wow, thanks a lot for the test…
…and the button comparison. Very useful info!
Hm… very good point. I admit I did not consider the tint-shift at low levels.
Thanks for the tip. I’ve checked out the Amazon listing. However, with shipping and VAT, the total becomes $53 which is not that sweet of a deal any more. (In comparison, I can get the IF25A for 40-42$ with battery and accessories included).
Will do Who knows, maybe the feedback will also help Bort with his project.
I found some tests:
4000mAh (This is for the OEM Lishen part, but the Sofirn is supposed to be identical, just rewrapped)
5000mAh review by HKJ
5000mAh review by Funtastic
Yeah, I thought about that, too. It is indeed an important factor considering the ultralight usage.
I read basically all the reviews I could find on the potential candidates, but unfortunately I could only find idle drain measurements for the WT3M and not for the IF25A.
But maybe manithree can help us out with that 
Those are low. Just reminding him to check his specific light to be sure. Some can drain a battery fast.