FW3A, a TLF/BLF EDC flashlight - SST-20 available, coupon codes public

yeah I agree with change of SKU. That reminds me of silent downgrades in the SSD market, which are quite common.

In a perfect world they would use an off the shelf driver from another Lumintop light or go to the Chinese market and get one, but there aren’t any suitable FET+6 drivers, or even any linear drivers (buck) since even those are hard to come by due to shortages. Plus it would raise the cost of the light considerably which would beg the question why not buy something else worh a better driver (Emisar, etc).

Yes, I was thinking of this example also.

Many SSDs have been silently downgraded. Many HDDs were downgraded to SMR platters recently also, including WD Red. I know people who had major problems with a ZFS array because of this.

If they had the choice to buy SMR for cheap or pay a few bucks extra for CMR there would be no problem. But they did not have a choice, the manufacturer instead tried to trick them and in doing so caused major damage to their reputation.

The FW21 uses the exact same driver parts as the FW3A. If Lumintop can’t source those parts, it’ll affect all FW-series models. The exception is the FW3X, which uses a different driver (but it also costs at least twice as much, even though the parts cost approximately the same).

Also, I have a FW21 Neal sent me a long time ago. I assumed it was an early prototype, because when I put in the battery it was designed for, it did not turn on. The battery tube was so long, the battery couldn’t make contact at both ends at the same time. I had to add a spacer. Also, some other parts of the design were clearly not thought out, like the clip was too short for the body, the optic was too small for the host, and the head had a weirdly thick bezel to fill in the extra space. But it turns out that was not a prototype… it was the production version. They shipped it to customers like that.

It seems like something gets downgraded every few months, and it’s random which batch people receive. The older batches are, of course, less and less obtainable over time… so you’ll probably get a newer, downgraded one. It’s a gamble, and the odds are not in your favor.

You mean between Lume1 and the original FET+7+1 driver ? No there is a non negligible cost difference.

I talked about it here : https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/qllgxx/would_you_pay_an_extra_20_for_a_more_efficient/hj4ssxi/

Then there is 4 layer vs 2 layers PCB cost andthe lower volume production.

That said the manufacturer probably sourced cheaper capacitors, also there has been a new revision with a different Op-amp, (SC70-5 case vs SC70-6 previously, guessing a less expensive one).

BOM for FET+7+1 for 100pcs is probably around 2~2.5$

Yes, comparing just the drivers by themselves, there is a large cost difference. It’s like $2 vs $12 or so. But an extra $10 is relatively small compared to the difference in price for assembled lights. Something doesn’t add up.

The FW3A was originally sold for around $30 to $35, and now is about $40 or so. The FW3X driver is sold by itself for $25, though the cost is probably only half that… or less, if Lumintop did the thing they usually do and optimized the costs. Take the FW3A price of $40-ish, plus the driver’s retail price of $25, and it adds up to about $65. But the assembled FW3X was sold for $100, though it looks like the last few are now on clearance for $80.

It’s disappointing to see the retail price jump up by $40 or $60 while the production cost increased by only $10 or $15.

Yeah, true, that doesn’t explain the large price difference, some other small costs for the AUX board and extra assembly but that’s it, they’re taking fat margins.

Maybe Emisar will make successor at some point (although maybe unlikely since they already have the slightly bigger KR4).

Wurkkos is making a copy of the FWAA, maybe after that they’ll make a copy of the FW3/1A.

I was looking at this recently and only found posts so far from ca. 2020 about this issue for HDs. Has anything changed? For example the larger drives in WD Desktop elements hard drives (day 12TB and up), are they still all CMR? Is there an up to date list of what is what? And with the SSDs, if you can give a link to more on that I’d appreciate that too as I want to get a bigger SSD for my OS/workspace soon.

I mentioned this in an earlier post, about how the 21700 light was a triple and then later they released a quad 18650 light which just is backwards. I really wanted a quad emitter 21700 FW21 but it never happened for some reason. Instead we get all these different FW69XXXL versions which never seemed practical for carrying like the original FW3A was. I guess the Noctigon KR4 makes up for the light I wanted never being made but it’s still something that annoys me today.

With the FW3A they had a hit on their hands, but Lumintop did not know why it was a hit. (because it was designed by enthusiasts)

So they tried to capitalize on the popularity with all these dumb variations, but without an understanding of why FW3A was popular, most variations missed their mark. They milked it way too much. Then all the spec downgrades and dumb writing on the bezel etc.

It is an interesting lesson for any other flashlight manufacturers who are paying attention.

Wow, thank you for the personal reply! I was just kind of “old man shaking fist mumbling” because I was so excited when this project started. I don’t remember some of those details about shipping customers sub par product, but I feel better now for giving Noctigon my money instead. And Sofirn, lot’s of Sofirn…

I think you mean… CSTZATZIKIBOCCI :smiley:

My impression was always that Neal was the driving force behind the endless FW variations rather than Lumintop themselves. The FW3A was a surprise hit, and he spent years riding the hype train with all all the new colours and models before the shine wore off. Add in Lumintop cheaping out on components or just not caring about quality at all (see the FW1A reflector fiasco) and the entire thing is completely removed from its roots as an enthusiast light developed by the community. Neal was also the reason the FW3A originally took so long to be released too.

Awesome! Gooooooo Wurkkos! I think Sofirn/Wurkkos, Wuben, and maybe even Mateminco can capitalize on Lumintops woes. I’d give them my money. I have been really impressed with Wubens stuff and Sofirn is Sofirn (or Wurkkos).

I am interested which Wurkkos is a FWAA copy, is it released?

Not released yet: Selection of "slender waist" Wurkkos WK10 14500 Light Single Color Aux

Thank you. I am not yet caught up on all the new lights, the Manker E05 is looking pretty good. Every time I find a light that is reviewed it is now discontinued/replaced, making finding proven lights difficult.

I could not agree more… I want one more old FW1A. I have a newer one and an original one.

The KR4 has become the almost perfect replacement for the FW3A, but the head is larger diameter and the light is a little longer. I EDC an old unmarked copper FW3A and have a spare on the shelf along with 5 aluminum 3A’s but only one old 1A.

@boo5sted has offered a nice 1A, PM him.

I approve this message lol.